Warnings about being a Demonologist and What Goes with the Territory!

I have had alot of Conversations with people who wanted to know exactly why I chose to go into Demonology and becoming a Demonologist. Alot of these people were all gung ho about getting into it because they thought it was cool. By the end of our conversation , they wanted no parts of any of it! Let me first explain something. Anytime you deal with evil , it has reprocussions of some sort, whether effecting your job or your loved ones it does not matter. Alot of people think that if they get into GHOSTBUSTING it is like the movies and is full of fame and media recognition and that they can just go onto a property and get away scott free with no effects later. I am here to tell you they are extremely wrong! I have been dealing with the Demonic for 30 years and can remember when I was a child all the horrible things that used to happen to me physically and mentally. Since I experienced it back then and throughout my life(including now) I am accustomed to it and can deal with not showing any fear. If someone gets into demonology and has never experienced the Demonic, they can have one of the most frightening experiences of there life! It takes a certain calibre of a person to be able to see shadow figures or physical manifestations or even to watch things fly around on there own or to be hit,kicked,punched,stabbed,thrown and sometimes even to have voices come out of nowhere with no physical means of explination.Once a person experiences this kind of activity it Bends your Reality and can sometimes make you go insane. Let's face it, I am always looking for a scientific explination for things and 80% of the time there is none. It is the most Mind Altering experience to know that there is something there that cannot be seen or touched (I am referring to when you get thrown or hit or anything physicall happens to you) and it is enough to turn the most athiest of people into believing in god. Alot of the people I encounter always say " I want to get into this stuff because I want Proof there is a God, I have Faith but i just need to know for sure.". I laugh at that because the basis of having Faith is not needing any physical proof of an existence and it is something that you know 100% in your heart exists. I have seen things that I know there is a God and a Devil and unless you experience what I have Dealt With you may never know physically because you have not experienced it. Although I can say this, one of the most precious gifts in this world is the gift to know from a physical sense that God is REAL and so is The Devil( Knowing there is a Devil is not a good thing but at least it let's you know that everything you have been taught IS real!). It is so weird knowing that and very hard to put into words completely. I could not even describe to you the emotions I feel when in direct contact with pure evil.

Since I rambled on in the above paragraph , I am now going to explain what this is about. When you cross the line between Ghosts/Paranormal to the Demonic your life is changed forever. You constantly live in danger. You risk all the events that happen in your life and also put all the ones you love in danger. My whole life has been like this so when I got into Demonology it was nothing really new, just that now things can get alot worse. Now why would anybody in there right mind put anything and everything at risk? The answer is simple, For GOD! Even thou The Devil and Demons are evil , God still gave them rights. They must obey certain things and that is just the way it is. People have this misconception that the Devil and Demons just Do What they want. That is not true because think about it, If they could, then the world would be full of Physical Entity's and this world would turn into a living hell where Good was not found even in the most remote parts of it. Sure the world is full of negative energy and bad people but they are most of the time influenced by Demonic Forces. Demons are not something that will just always appear, the are traits and habbits and even personalities. Latest figures say demons are up in the 9-15million legion. That would put it about right for the amount of evil that goes on in this world at one time. Anyway, once you cross over the line, they know who you are and anything you do to provoke them will have a consequnce on your life. When and Investigation happens and you provoke them to manifest themselves, that is when your journey of being a lonely person begins. I say this because you and you alone are the only one that knows you are not a Demon or under the influence of the Demonic. I have had people I never knew before come up to me as thou they knew me all my life and I became friends with them in a matter of hours ,only to never see this person again or any trace of them. This happens every so often and is just a reminder from the Demonic to let you know that you are being watched and that they can get to you. It may sound crazy but have it happen to you enough times and you'll know what I mean.

Knowing that you are always a target has to make you expect certain things and actually it makes you a more kinder BUT stronger person. My house is full of all kinds of activity and sometimes things leave on there own free will and other times I have to clense it myself. It is not the greatest feeling in the world knowing that at anytime your kids or wife could get so scared by something that they would never want to see me again because of what I do. The funny thing is that all this stuff is great table talk but once you get into the actual field of it , everybody starts to mock it and say that it is not real, including all those people who told you really scary stories about things that happened to them. Once your called Crazy one Time you get over it!

In conclusion, the life of investigating demonic activity is very dangerous, if not physically then mentally. Sometimes your work consumes you and you have to back off. Sometimes if you are not carefull you can become what you are battling and not even know it. The interaction of people around you is also important because you will know when you are getting to heavy into a case or just taking to much time with research, other people (like a wife) will let you know when you are going overboard with it(Even then you have to watch and make sure something is not manipulating the way that other person is thinking, as to where you think your doing something wrong, boy what a mental rollercoaster!). So as you can see there are alot of problems with becoming a demonologist. It is not just something you can go about your 9pm-5pm day job and do and not worry about anything happening to you, you always have to watch your back. Just remember this, you are not dealing with something that is of this realm of reality and is not like a ghost or anything of the paranormal. When dealing with the Demonic you are confronting something that knows what you are thinking as you are thinking it, knows the future and is highly intelligent (BUT very anonomous, one of the rules is that a Demon or Devil can only leave once THEY or IT say(s) there REAL NAME!). Imagine trying to go up against something that has The Wisdom of the Ages! It's very very hard!

If anyone is venturing into being a Demonologist or getting into Demonology or Demonography please be careful and know what you are dealing with before you devote your life to it because it will and can consume you. The Good thing about all this is that you are helping people who otherwise would have nobody else to turn to in a time or real need.

God Bless!

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There is one thing that i want to say before i begin, "OUIJA Boards are VERY Dangerous!". Out of all the cases we have done and that i was a part of, 95% of them were caused by this Quote UnQuote "GAME". When i first researched the Ouija Board i thought that there were only 5-10 game variations total, But to my surprise there are well over 100 games made all around the world. That is alot considering the Power of this "GAME".
The Problem with the Ouija Board (It is called many other things as you will soon see by my Ouija Archives below) is that when you use it, you have no idea Who or What you are going to contact. Most Ordinary People buy the game thinking that is would be COOL to talk to a spirit of a dead relative or a famous person. There biggest query is usually to find out either what happened after death or to see if there is really an afterlife. Once they start using the Ouija board, they have opened a gateway for anything to come into our reality. The simple fact of this whole thing is that you have no idea what you are talking to.

Example - Let's say that little johnny and his friends are out at the mall and find a store with a Ouija board for sale. They buy it and everyone thinks that it will be cool to see stuff move and hear voices and all that other stuff. After taking it home they open it and get everything ready. Johnny then wants to contact his deceased grandfather and see if he made it to the otherside or for that matter to see if there is life after death. Johnny and his friends make contact with something that is claiming to be his grandfather, basically telling him everything he wants to hear. Then johnny asks for a sign from him and to show himself. This is when the trouble starts and then climax's into a low level haunting or posession but can easily convert into many other level's. The end result now is that johnny has opened up a gateway for that spirit,demon,devil or whatever to come threw. This will not only effect him but also anyone else who was involved. If johnny was to have done this alone with nobody else, the Ouija could have addicted him to the point of a Posession. This is rare but it can happen and nothing in the world would matter to johnny but using that Ouija by himself and contacting that deceitful spirit. The end result of which would be him being posessed by whatever spirit he contacted.

There have been cases of a Ouija board being harmless but there is more bad to get out of it than good. You have to understand this is my opinion and it is based upon years of research along with many other investigators/demonologists.We basically share the same premise that these Ouija boards are not to be played with and should Never be used.

*NOTE*- I find it very interesting that hollywood would even consider the fact of handing out Ouija boards at the premeire of one of there movies called "WitchBoard". 1000's of people have these boards and who knows how many of them now have hauntings. By the way, most of these Ouija Board Games come with a warning inside. It Reads:

" WARNING , DO NOT PLAY ALONE!"

I would also like to mention that since there is a spiritual side to the "Ouija" (the real name is "Automatic Writing Boards or Talking Boards" and the moving piece is called a "Planchette") there is also a Pyschological explination/phenomena called "Automatism". This is when your subconcious mind basically spells out words on the Ouija and you have no idea you are doing it. The clinical term is called "Ideomotor Response". I have no doubt that it is possible for your unconsious mind to move the planchette but i do not think that this happens as frequently as you would think. Besides, spirits work in many ways and the "Automatism" could be one of them...

Closing The Gateway!

Alot of people have many different views on getting rid of a Ouija board. People have mentioned burning it,cutting it up,burying it, lighting it on fire,and even gone to the extremes of throwing it away in another state! Some have worked and others have not. In my opinion there is one sure way to rid yourself of this board. When all else fails there is a rather simple way of dealing with this. Take the board to your local catholic church and leave it on the steps.Since the board is now on holy ground, the gateway closes and all events asociated with it SHOULD stop. If not, then a more serious approach will be needed. This is rare and only a professional should deal with it at this point. I hope i did not offend any catholic churches by saying everyone should leave there ouija boards on your steps ,but i know that you know what to do with it and let's face it, the church is there for people when they are in need of help :)




[This message has been edited by Lou Gentile (edited March 20, 2000).]

Hi Lou,

Welcome to the discussion, I appreciated your warnings regarding demons etc and the nasty boards.

You were very correct in your sumation about the demons being very ancient, intelligent, cunning, sly, manipulative etc. This follows a similar line that I have been discussing with another person in this forum.

From what I read you have a faith in God and obviously this helps to hold you in stead. I know from first hand experience that this is paramount when dealing with demonic, satanic, luciferian entities. I take the greatest joy in the realisation that for me as a believer I can call on the name of the Lord. It is a wonderful thing to realise that by looking at the works and teachings of Jesus and the Apostles we can by faith in Him confront these forces as He leads and directs us to.

Quite often I have found that a spirit or demon that resides over a place is very difficult to rebuke and remove. This is essentially because people in the area are subject to it and as a result it has a kind of spiritual landlordship which must be broken. This can be quite difficult as these ties to people, generations and localities can cover hundreds of years. In these instances fasting and prayer are almost a must, along with full submission to God the Father in the power of the Holy Spirit and through the Blood of the Lamb of God, Jesus Christ.

It should also be pointed out that never is the battle against another person, as the Bible points out:

"We wrestle not against flesh and blood but against the princes and powers of the air"

Now it may be that an individual is compelled or possesed by these demons, but our struggle is never against the individual it is always against the forces that they have subjected themselves to. Unfortunatly there are a number of individuals walking around totally oblivious to their condition. Our goal should to always be that of restoration of an individual back to God and His love as was the example of Jesus.

Anyway that's just my two cents worth but I am glad you raised the topic.

Again welcome to the site and a little hint, don't expect everyone to agree with everything you say here :D .

Allcare

Tony H2o

Lou~

Greetings, welcome to exosci!

I have to say that I have a really hard time believing that a Parker Brothers Ouija board is a demonic gateway. It's cardboard and plastic, mass-manufactured in factories. There's not a drop of mysticism associated with those things. I feel it's a whole lot more likely that it is the questioner's subconscious mind spelling things out.

I have played with an Ouija board myself. We "contacted" a spirit who spelled out it's name as "kittykat" of all things. Of course, since it was a bunch of 4th graders doing it, that's not all that shocking. The "spirit" was unable to help us figure out where the key to the freezer with the ice cream in it was, so I'm not too impressed with it's "power" either. And it was a terrible speller, it could spell at about the 4th grade level (hmmm, big surprise there!).

Basically, my opinion is that the Ouija board only has as much power to it as you believe it does, and the power it does have stems directly from YOU, because the board itself is nothing but just that - a board game.

In all my years of what is vulgarly called "ghostbusting" I have never encountered an "evil" entity that hasn't originated with a living person, whether intentionally or not. I have found, in fact, that the bulk of the problem is psychokinetic energy, a phenomenon proven under laboratory conditions to exist. It is, however, a psychological condition and not a religious or supernatural one. When dealing with PKE it is important to leave out gods, ghosts, devils, and demons. None of these notions can hope to resolve a sitiuation that rests solely in the lap of unrealized stresses and emotions.

When confronting PKE, I find that education is the sharpest sword in my arsenal. I learn as much about the family situation as possible. If one person is being attacked, it is important to find out if this one person is suffering from any mental disturances. Most of the time this will be the case. If there is no mental disturbance aside from the attacks, I study the rest of the family and see if there is a reason that one of them might be at odds with the victim and coping with unrealized emotions. If the whole family is being attacked, it is of utmost importance to find who is the source of the attacks. There are no demons save the ones in the mind, and they are under the strict control of the subconscious, which, as I'm sure you know, doesn't always follow the accepted rules of polite society. This is the source of PKE.

Once PKE is let loose, it can be very hard to rein back in, especially if the person in whom it originated insists that there is nothing wrong. Denial only strengthens the PKE, so how to approach the originator is a matter that must be dealt with on a case by case basis.

I am wondering about your approach. You said that you are always looking for the scientific explanation, but that 80% of the time there is none. You further say (or imply) that gods and demons are the answer. Do you have scientific proof of gods and demons? An awful lot of academicians would love to see your reports. I'll be brutally honest, though, and don't think I'm laughing at you or ridiculing you. I don't think you have looked for the scientific answers. I think that because of your past experiences, whatever the cause may have been, you have needed an answer for what you could not find an answer for. God and demonology filled that void for you. Hey, if it works for you, it works for you. But on the other hand, as I said, if you have scientific proof of gods and devils,k please share it with us. Some of us know right where to take the information for further study.

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I may not agree with what you have to say, but I will fight, kill, and die for your right to say it.

Welcome Lou,
my wife played with the ouija (by using an upside down glass tumbler and handwritten cards around it) with a bunch of friends and flatmates, before we were married.
To cut a long story short, the spirit (glass moving unaided)spelled out the name and adress of a woman, that nobody in the room recognised.
It then smashed itself against the wall, when the girls said they wanted to stop now.

During the night there were heavy bangings on all the walls, doors and windows of the 4th floor flat. Terrified, all the girls moved out the next day.

Some time later, one of the girls checked out the name and adress they were given and was amazed to discover that such a person had indeed lived at that adress, but had been dead for many, many years.




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Oh my God it's the funky shit!!!

Tab,

I read with interest your account of events that occurred with your wife. When I was younger our family used to do the same things with ouija boards, probably traces back to gypsy and pirate background. We were at some friends place and I kid you not at the stroke of midnight the glass levitated flew through the air and smashed on the wall, ALL UNAIDED. Then the words "Stop now or will kill you all" echoed out of nowhere. Freaky stuff.

This was my introduction into what became an area of deep interest and involvement to me prior to becoming a Disciple of Christ. So like you I am in no doubt about the veracity of such events and the existence of demons, devils, ghouls or whatever label you care to attach to them. However now days and in the light of Divine revelation and my salvation I truly see them for what they are. At the time of my involvement with them they did not appear directly sinister, they even appeared benevolent but deep down in your gut you knew to keep the eyes in the back of your head open. The trace of fear was always with you.

Anyway like you or your wife I know the reality of these things.

Allcare

Tony H2o

[This message has been edited by Tony H2o (edited March 21, 2000).]

I find this all very interesting. It is nice (if you can call it that) to know that other people have had similar experiences.

Generally speaking, I have knowledge that we live amongst demonic forces and that they live amongst us. Knowing them through the grace of God is our best defense against them. They really ARE here with us, and we really do have to know how to face them to rebuke them. At this point in my life, they are like specks of dust to me, easily blown away.

As mentioned previously - When face-to-face with such spirits, demanding that they reveal their name(s) is one way of rebuking them and invoking the grace of Jesus Christ is another. (I had one of these experiences this afternoon, as a matter of fact). Happy evil-busting all!

Thanks for sharing.

Marie

Hi Lou,

Could you explain, as you are aware through your experience, how it is that demons are "invited" by people? Can you explain the aspects of their temptation and deception for us? It is my belief that these aliens of light, gods and goddesses, fairies, and all of these "other" spirits, and other meaning other than the Holy Spirit, are demonic. Can you elaborate on this? What do you think that their #1 intention is regarding humanity? How many different ways and scenarios have you seen this demonstrated by? And lastly, why do you do this dangerous stuff? I myself have had "dealings" with them, personally in the way that everyone does in my own life being tempted by things I shouldn't do or say or feel, but also, in this "manifested" form called a "being of light" or "alien of light". I know that they are demonic, by what they say, and their intent, although hidden from the victim. It is scary. I got scared thinking about who it was that I was confronting. But you're right in that they have no power over you unless you let them. Jesus is the cure. Every single time. And you're right about the name as well, in that knowing their identity is key. But I always thought of that in a more general sense, in that knowing that they are demonic IS their identity, barring their specific name. Blowing their cover is the answer. Their only power it seems over us comes through deception regarding their identity. Now do you guys understand why I'm so concerned about abductees, and pagans, and the like? It's dangerous. You guys think I'm just trying to be some holier than thou pain in the ass, and am just trying to label everything I don't understand as demonic, but the fact is that I DO understand, and they are demonic, and I'm terribly worried about all of you. I can't even tell you how much it horrifies me to read things like Mooncat posted regarding her dream. Dancing around with demons, and she IS like an innocent child. A puppet on a string, mesmorized by their beauty and power and knowledge and acceptance. It is an illusion. Right Tony? A big pile of maggots.

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You may think I'm a nut, but I'm fastened to the strongest bolt in the universe.

Lori~

Welcome back. :)

Lori, I know you think they're demonic, but they're not. I can't prove it to you, but it's just the way it is. I know it freaks you out, but please don't worry about me! You don't need to!

They share with me, they now laugh with me, but mostly they make me figure stuff out for myself. Does that sound like your demons? I thought your demons spoon-fed everything to their victim(s)? And would a demon tell me to knock off the Jesus/God/Christian criticism? Would a demon tell me that a Christian is "just as right" as I am? That's what She told me, when I saw Her in my first dream as a tree. Would a demon refuse to answer any more questions until I straightened up and stopped bashing the Jesus-followers? I don't think so, not by the definition you are providing. Don't you think it's odd that these beings you call demons are actually bringing me much closer to Jesus and his teachings than I ever got on my own???

You know, I've been thinking about the whole Jesus-is-son-of-God thing, and I realize, of course he is! We are all sons and daughters of the universe, whether you call it God, God & Goddess, Allah, what have you. All the same. One big, unhappy family. :) I just hope some day we all turn into one big HAPPY family. I saw a quote somewhere that said all roads lead to God, I think that's very right. Yes, I do believe there is evil out there, but I think it comes from us, not from a purely evil being.

(Glad you're back Lori. Peace be with you.)

Hi Moon,

Thanks for the welcome. :) Listen, I know that what I say has to sound offensive to you and others, and I sincerely apologize, I really do. It's just that, well, can you imagine how I feel, how in danger I think you are, and how scared I am for you, based upon what I believe is true? I do think that in a way, it is very strange that you say you are closer to Jesus now than ever. That is VERY surprising indeed. But, in order for them to "advocate" Jesus, they would also have to "discount" His self-proclaimed identity, and the very basis of the Gospel. What they say is that He was a teacher, no different from Mohammed or Martin Luther King Jr. or John Lennon or whoever, but that He is NOT the Son of God, right? Well, that IS the deception right there. If they came out and told you all of the Jesus bashing stuff, and to hate Christians and whatnot, wouldn't it be a little too obvious? Like I said before, that's how they started with Flash, but as I had her ask more and more and more questions, they had to digress to the Jesus bashing thing in order to keep their story going. I mean, they say that Christianity is as right as every other religion right? Well, how can that be, when the entire basis of Christianity is that Jesus is the ONLY Son of God, the truth, the way, and the light? See, God wrote the Bible and made Jesus who He was on purpose, for this very reason. God is NOT the author of confusion, Satan is. And there is no way that you can confuse THAT message.
I'm sorry if you feel like I'm picking on you, I'm not. I had just read your dream and was still shivering with chill bumps when I posted. :) I know that you don't agree with me or sense the danger that I do, and I realize that. I just don't want you to be misled is all.

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You may think I'm a nut, but I'm fastened to the strongest bolt in the universe.

Lori~

I don't understand it completely myself, so I'm not surprised you don't either. :) I know you're not trying to pick on me. I appreciate your concern, I just don't share it. ;)

God didn't write the bible, several different HUMANS did. Even if those humans got direct dictation from god, couldn't they have screwed it up, just a little bit? The bible does contradict itself here and there, right? (Do we agree on that point?)

I posted this somewhere else, but let me post it again. This is the way I have tried to rationalize the "God is the ONLY God thing": What if God appears to you as you are familiar with him or as you will comfortably accept him - Father of Jesus etc. He tells you "I am the only God". Okay. He's the only God. All right. Then he appears to me. But instead of seeing the Christian God, I see two beings, a God and a Goddess. But it's really the SAME 'guy'. Why is this? Becuase people are different. We all have unique perceptions on things, we speak different languages, have different favorite colors, have different cultural influences. God knows this. He's no dummy! So he appears to each individual differently.

That's kind of what I think She meant when She told me the Christians are "just as right" as I am. The reality could be that God is neither exactly as the Christians see "him", nor exactly as I or any other Pagan sees "them", but something so foreign to our human existance that we translate it into something we can understand and relate to - most likely what culture has taught us to expect. Like the proverbial blind men and the elephant. And it's not that God is lying or deceiving when he says "I am the only God", it's exactly true. We just interpret it wrong. God is still the same being whether he wears a baseball cap or a top hat.

Does that make any sense to you? :) What do you think?

Yeeeeaaaaaa. Yea, that makes sense to me. But Jesus doesn't "appear" to me. And if He did, I wouldn't be able to recognize Him by sight. Actually, I have heard of instances where demons have impersonated Him in appearance, not true appearance, but to present themselves in a way that WE would envision Him. Who says that's what He looks like? Who knows? What I recognize about Him are His words. He has a presence and a certain way of talking that makes it clear to me that it's Him. There is no dancing, flying, magik, laser light shows, board room tables, nothing even close to that.

Also, don't you think that it's just a wee bit too convenient to be able to take the Bible, coupled with your beliefs about it's source and interpretation, and then be able to pick and choose which message is true and which is false within it? And no, I used to think that the messages were contradictory, but I understand them now. The Holy Spirit does that somehow. Sheds light on it all. There is nothing in the Bible's message that is contradictory. Even if you were to think so, I KNOW that you can't possibly think that the message regarding the "exclusivity" of Jesus as Christ is confusing at all. It's the most hard driven message in there. It's just way, way too convenient.

So, do you think that the god and goddess are actually God, or more like angels? Do you think there is one God, and He changes form? I personally think that if God were to actually show Himself to us, or even a hint of what He actually is or looks like that we'd just all fall down dead of a heart attack or something. BUT AN ANGEL, now I can buy that.

Ok, and as far as spirits go....how do you think that you would be able to tell the difference between a good one and a bad one? What about the concept of deception?

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You may think I'm a nut, but I'm fastened to the strongest bolt in the universe.

Lori~

I feel the same way about the God & Goddess as you do about Jesus:

"He has a presence and a certain way of talking that makes it clear to me that it's Him"

That's exactly it! I know it's Her even if She looks like a tree, or a gypsy, or a wolf, or a raven, or an elephant... There's a presence there that's intense and unmistakeable. The dancing and such I'm sure She added purely for my own benefit and enjoyment, like I said, She has also appeared to me as a moonlit tree, there was no dancing that time! (What an interesting dream THAT would make!)

I have to say I haven't read the bible, so I can't say whether or not the "exclusivity" of Jesus is hard driven or not - I'll take your word for it though. I will get around to it some day, but right now I'm working my the Pagan texts. I also plan on reading the Koran (I have a copy, just haven't started it yet), the book of Mormon, all that fun stuff. As She tells me, they're all right. So I think if I can read enough of them, perhaps I might figure out how they all fit together. (I'll surely let you know if I do!) But, life is short, and there are so many other things to do with my time. :) I have thought about taking study courses at the college, but I want it all to be my own interpretations. But I have a feeling (please don't be offended) that that part was more or less added or perhaps emphasized by the human aspect - we each probably really want to believe that we are the right ones, that what we believe is true. Human nature, understandable.

The bible you read IS NOT the same version that was originally written, either! When a word is translated, there are usually several choices to make. Someone has already chosen what words you are going to read, and that compromises the message right there. So I kind of find it funny that you think I'm picking parts of the bible out that I think are correct, because before I even begin to read, some of those choices have already been made for me. The best thing to do, if you want the original message, is to learn hebrew. I don't know about you, but I don't have enough time to do that. :) So, I take the translation(s) that are available, and try to make sense out of the overall picture. I cannot dwell too heavily on any one word or phrase, because they're not the original words anyway, it becomes pointless. 'Course, as I said, I haven't actually sat down and gone cover to cover yet, either. I've picked it up a few times, read most of the "student" version, so I get the gist of it, but it does deserve a thourough reading.

My take on God & the Goddess, and the Christian God, is that they are all one in the same. They are the part of the "ALL" (for lack of a better word) that is the "true" diety, but that "all" is so far beyond our comprehension that I doubt we'll ever grasp it. Kind of like you said - we might just drop dead if we were exposed to it, so it has to be mellowed out, and "dumbed down" so we can handle it without going nuts.

(On an aside, this reminds me of a book I read about some ?Indian? culture that believed that retarded children were the ones that had opened their eyes before they were born and saw God, and had their minds dazzled by him.)

Spirits - well, the way I see it spirits can be either one, good, bad, or indifferent. Spirits are hard to define, there are spirits to everything - animal spirits, people spirits, plant spirits, even earth or rock spirits. Some others call them "fairies" too, I shy away from that because it sounds too Disneyland, but I think they're talking about the same "beings". But spirits (in my opinion) are much more limited than any of the "gods" or "deities". They can be warded off easily, and in their case it's kind of like an ounce of prevention...

Oops, I have to go. I'll talk to you later. :)