View Full Version : Gendankenexperiment
10-29-10, 10:44 PM
What if we were to take one of every element in the periodic table. Place them all together in a particle collider and fire proton beams at the cluster of atoms?
I'm sure we could calculate the results in an actual experiment, but i would have to say based on the double slit experiment that much of the beam would be refracted in different directions as it navigates through the elements at light-speed.
10-30-10, 04:42 AM
Goats on fire.
10-30-10, 06:00 PM
More like Schrodinger's cat is on fire. But would it be dead or alive if there were three separate boxes. One for the proton, one for the mysterious gendanken of elements, and the last one to hold the cat.
10-31-10, 08:47 PM
you want to catch a radioactive cat going at light speed?
The location is in the box which can be broken down to a 3*3*3 magic cube with rows summing to 42. Assuming that the elements in the box are all changing both their momentum and exact location at the speed of light. Lets assume the elements in summation due to their natural vibrations and contained condition act as a 0 spin particle. When two 0 spin particles collide a very funny thing happens. As the photon enters it pushes out an anti photon from the other end.
Imagine the eye of RA and see that his pupils are completely full, but his pupil is white. The instant the pressure of the proton hits one side of the pupil the fastest moving particles in the weak force are shed by the fastest moving outer layer spinning and following the impulse of the veins through the eye. The eye has the instant reaction to shed part of its outermost layer out of the other side, but the original proton is not going to even think of slowing down it has a definite momentum and indefinite location. As for the new proton, it has an definite location but an indefinite momentum and exits the box before the first.
11-02-10, 06:54 PM
Ok, class I've basically said 0+0=1 for any values that are "sufficiently large". Starts off with one Proton and out of the other end comes two. What happened?
11-02-10, 07:31 PM
11-02-10, 08:59 PM
What I find most interesting is that a huge selection of "scientific" people who know much about physics apparently shy away from this experiment when we have the full and utmost ability to test this. Even if the answer another person has given is not the right one. I might as well call some of you Wagner, like this is some sort of trap, or the thing is going to explode. You think a court case is going to stop humanity from some time in the distant future from reopening scientific research? I highly doubt that. No person or group has ever even asked a question such as Kapslocke, but I have no doubt that somewhere in the future of humanity we can explore this question with more objectivity on solving this current problem. Heck we might even try it just to see what really happens. That is all I have to say about that for the time being.
11-03-10, 10:11 AM
I thought I moved this thread.
Oh well...better late than never.
11-03-10, 10:15 AM
Let me answer the OP, in the event that it was an honest question.
At energies that high, the term "atom" no longer makes sense. Essentially, you have a relationship between length scale and energy scale---up to constants, L ~ 1/E. This tells you that as energy increases, the length scale of your experiment decreases. So, for example, if you smash to hydrogen atoms together at sufficient energy, the electron is too far away from the proton to make any difference---the collision is between two protons, not two hydrogen atoms.
Extrapolating this, if you take a hodge-podge of different atoms, and "smash them all together", the electrons don't matter, and the collision is between a bunch of protons and neutrons. This experiment has already been performed: http://www.bnl.gov/rhic/ See also their wikipedia page.
11-03-10, 05:42 PM
Did anyone say anything about smashing anything together in this scenario?
I don't think so. The link you gave Ben was very nice and it did show what happens when two particles collide. I also noticed there was no experiment as the above stated, nor could I find such from wikipedia. If an experiment like this had actually been accomplished this thread would not be in Pseudo-science. It would be back where it was with a nice little pop up box from Rpenner explaining all the details. TANGENT what if you send ions through this inspiring gendanken? Maybe we should make a couple more circles to the outer rim of the colliders and see if we can't accelerate heavy ions such as lead, Iron, or possibly Boron, through this mass of elements. Possibly see if we can get them going around immediately after one another. All that is beside the point here.
Have you never taken a statistics class? My high school teacher could tell you the dangers of that process. There is a thing called a chi square test in which you can test the accepted significant level of the correlation. If it is under %5 or .05 the value is said to be an outlier. Which is in fact what this experiment is "an outlier" by all current calculations and tested values of this day and age. You are "extrapolating" values that have not been "experienced" which can only lead to the correlation being under .05 significance level.
I'm glad this is in pseudo science. Hide it from Wagner before the sky falls down on him. Then again I'm not afraid to teach that guy a little bit about physics. Try to look past the sarcasm you just might start to think a little bit.
11-04-10, 09:54 AM
I've told you once, I've told you twice, stop putting fluoride in the water, it's not making their teeth any whiter
11-04-10, 07:07 PM
True, it is probably all the "copenhagen" Ben has been spitting out that keeps the teeth from turning white. I believe the OP asked for a stationary, "singular", "controlled" mass of elements from hydrogen to Ununbium. Then you shoot something going very fast at it. The OP suggested protons, I suggested different elements as well. Ben said this experiment has been done before, I have merely stated that it hasn't. My statements only intend to show that Ben is attempting to extrapolate from previous experiments, as he himself said, when this Gendanken is fresh. Fresh means that it has not been "experienced" before and therefore CAN NOT be extrapolated by definition. Spit your dip out before you try to brush your teeth, it only makes sense.
11-06-10, 05:22 PM
Do you want me to explain this to my grandmother so she can get on here and show you how it is done?:rolleyes:
11-15-10, 05:17 PM
I'll make this whole singularity thing very simple and civil, but not simpler. Now that I have all of your attention, I'll show you how to stare into a true "black hole" using relativity. The only way any of you are going to enchance you intelligence is not by anger, but with understanding of what it is that we can do that has not already been done. I could sit here and make fun of you as you have done to me, but it is still I who get the last word. Still you are the ones who need to find what "it" is in this genius thought of another person. Or you can turn up your noses and say you already know enough in your life to want it to end. The battle is with your own mind not mine and this is the start to the answer.
11-15-10, 05:25 PM
I'll show you how to stare into a true "black hole" using relativity.
And yet, once again, rather than actually "showing us" you resort to more inane badly-spelt ungrammatical waffle.
Why is that, I wonder?
Because you're a clueless crank?
11-16-10, 12:02 AM
Clueless is the one who is not married to this hypothesis and gives no explination for this gendanken being in pseudosciense. Extrapolates data the day after it is married yoda say. Ahh... still better than extrapolating "facts" that are 13.75 billion years old. If you were that old you wouldn't look much like you do now either, what makes you think that your aren't that old? Because God made you so many years old to this day? The OP only stated a question. Questions are not Pseudoscience. Only answers are pseudoscience until resolved.