There are estimated 5 to 8 million Muslims currently in the United States, and by the year 2010, if the present trends continue, that number will double to 10 to 16 million. There is no question that Islam is alive and growing in America. Dr. john R. Weeks, Director of the International Population Center, San Diego State University , a noted demographer and author of The Demography of Islamic Nations, states, "There can be no question that the Muslim population in this country is large and is growing at a fairly rapid pace." The estimated rate of conversion to Islam among Americans is 135,000 per year (35,000 of this number come from those who are incarcerated).


http://www.netiran.com/Htdocs/Clippings/Social/941200XXSO06.html


Muslim American reports in the Arab press indicate that Muslim =
proselytizing efforts have been unusually successful since the September =
11 attacks. 'Alaa Bayumi, Director of Arab Affairs at the Council for =
American-Islamic Relations (CAIR), wrote in the London daily Al-Hayat =
that "non-Muslim Americans are now interested in getting to know Islam. =
There are a number of signs...: Libraries have run out of books on =
Islam and the Middle East... English translations of the Koran head the =
American best-seller list... The Americans are showing increasing =
willingness to convert to Islam since September 11... Thousands of =
non-Muslim Americans have responded to invitations to visit mosques, =
resembling the waves of the sea [crashing on the shore] one after =

http://lists.eramuslim.com/archive/news/2001-December/000757.html

........and not one single one of these brothers on this forum.....sheesh

:rolleyes:

Sorry to say but Muslims are fleeing the US. In NYC there were 500,000 Pakistanis before 9/11, now down to around 200,000. About 50,000 have been interogated by the US, and guess who is getting all these AMERICAN refugees, yup Canada. :(

Citations Nico, citations.

Originally posted by nico
Sorry to say but Muslims are fleeing the US. In NYC there were 500,000 Pakistanis before 9/11, now down to around 200,000. About 50,000 have been interogated by the US, and guess who is getting all these AMERICAN refugees, yup Canada. :(

1) America's loss
2)Canada's gain.
3) but i was refferring more to indiginous Americans converting to Islam, irrespective of migration patterns of immigtant Muslims.

Sorry to say but Muslims are fleeing the US. In NYC there were 500,000 Pakistanis before 9/11, now down to around 200,000. About 50,000 have been interogated by the US, and guess who is getting all these AMERICAN refugees, yup Canada

You forget however that traditional Islam as practiced by for instance Pakistani is not the only major form of Islam active in America .

This goes for most places on the globe , however in USA the Afro-Americans have their one drive in Islam .

however in USA the Afro-Americans have their one drive in Islam .

the less said about that one the better.

;)

But I hope that this trend of conversion illustrates to a few people on this forum (though I very much doubt it) that the two concepts of "Being Muslim" and being "American" (or being any other "nationality" for that matter) are indeed not mutually exclusive.

I don't it matters what type of Islam they practice, do u honestly believe that the US Homeland defence dept. cares? I think that Muslims will come to Canada instead of the US, it is the smart thing to do. The population increases in the US will be impressive but I am not to certain that they could wield much power. We have to compare Islamic growth rates to the average American growth rate. Which is: Population growth rate:
0.89% (which I believe it is) then maybe you may have a point. But the politics of Islam in America will be a stormy one.

I don't it matters what type of Islam they practice

nico, with all due respect it does. There shouldn't be a type of Islam, thats just the whole problem which adds fuel to the already rampant lack of understanding of Islam.

the less said about that one the better.


Buhdmaash , why ?

There shouldn't be a type of Islam, thats just the whole problem which adds fuel to the already rampant lack of understanding of Islam.

Yes but what African American converts practice deals with a variety of interpertations reaching racial ideologies .

Also they are very linked with non-Islamic groups that are very similar to their intepertations of Islam , like the Hebrew Israelites & Morish Temple-scientists .

And as these groups are converts , one might wonder weither they differ in the treatment and political implications that come along with other Muslims in America .

Dont get me wrong I dont judge their views , but I do know that within these given perspectives the difference in their views does have an impact on policy and how things go .

Nico : That is why it does matter what islam they practice , but I think you're not really well enough aware of these groups to understand a serious relevant difference with seriously different implications .

As you mentioned the Pakistani from NYC , NYC is the foundation of the peoples mentioned they rather are drawn toward it than that they go elsewhere . These Muslims wont ever set foot in Canada unless you offer them land and a souvereign state .

But the politics of Islam in America will be a stormy one.

The politics of International Islam ... sort of speak .... yes . But the groups I am talking about wont suffer stormy politics on Islam , rather they suffer stormy politics on Blacks for the last couple hundred years .

Ghassan, I was reffering to the nation of islam, and they aint muslims because whats been drummed into their heads isn't Islam. Elijah Muhammed wasn't even a Muslim, just some crazy fool who knew he could feed the blacks any old shit, they wouldnt know the diffrence.

why did they kill Malcolm X?? They knew as soon as he got his ass back from mecca he would completely expose the bullshit Elijah Muhammed was feeding people in the name of "islam"

bro u just cant make any old shit up and pass it off as "islam"

Okay now I see where you are coming from, but I am a realist when it comes to this. The Islamic population in the US is being prosectued, and anyone from a ME country (apart from Israel) has to get a visa and screened and the whole lotte. This are only going to get worse, I remember a American airlines pilot refusing to fly because a muslim was onboard! Most Americans could give a shit about these different sects of Islam and if the public dosen't care neither does the government.

this is it you see, the damage has been done, the lines have been drawn either you're on their side or ours.

The more and more the situation is over simplified for the masses the more the environment becomes condusive to "mass hysteria" and emotional over reaction. The truth gets lost in all this, and who suffers? individuals and their families.:mad:


we've seen from this forum how members fuelled by pure stereotypes and mis conceptions post fallacious offensive material about that which they have absolutely no knowledge or experience of, and about which they have no INTENTION of experiencing or learning about.

and hence the cycle perpetuates.

Most Americans could give a shit about these different sects of Islam and if the public dosen't care neither does the government.

Most Americans indeed dont really care for the groups I mentioned ...... that is not in "ME/terrorists/etc" perspective .

However I think those groups may very well play quite a role in the future of America and with relevance to the results of the "war on terror" .

Buhdmaash

I thought it was important to mention them as you firstly mentioned :

35,000 of this number come from those who are incarcerate

Now that goes mostly to NOI (and others) bro ..... who demographically are considered Muslim when it comes down to sociologic issues as this .

There are estimated 5 to 8 million Muslims currently in the United States

See they dont really know .........

Now as for Elijah , you cannot say he taught not Islam and that he was no Muslim , you may disagree weither everything he taught was Islam or weither he was a virtous Muslim or not .

But he did call himself a Muslim and he did use as base of many of his teachings in Islam .

He was taught by Farad Muhammad an Arab Shia-Sufi who was highly influenced by Druze (can we consider them Muslim ? its all very debatable) .

I dont know about these Druze.

Its not my position to coment on his virtuousness, but I can comment on his teachings.

Teaching that the race of whites were devils created by some wizzard???

i would LMAO, but it's not funny. There's enough missunderstanding about Islam without these idots making things worse.

Although he believes that Islam is the natural religion for Africans, Farad does not stress fulfillment of any of the traditional "five pillars" of the religion. He instead focuses upon a revisionist mythology explaining the historical oppression of black people. This mythology includes the claims that black people as members of the tribe of Shabazz were the original race of humans and came to the Earth 66 trillion years ago, and that white people were the result of an experiment performed by the evil scientist Yakub 6000 years ago. W.F. Muhammad subsequently spends three years teaching Elijah Muhammad (born Elijah Poole in Sandersville, GA) his version of Islam. Farad then sends Elijah Muhammad to establish a second temple in Chicago.

http://www.stanford.edu/group/Thinker/v2/v2n3/NOIBackground.html

come on Ghassan this is pure fallacy. he might aswell have called it the religion of kwejjawhfsdjknvk

Well I find the Nation of Islam to be rather hypocritical about the "white slavery" thing. We did buy and sell millions of blacks, as did the Arab traders. Who incidently were muslim... SHOCKERS!

I dont know about these Druze.

Well they're teachings are Islamic and we have quite alot in ME mostly they are not considered Muslims by the traditional authorities (....) . Many Sufi have been treated likewise (and Shia as well) while IMO the traditional authority has no clue what they are talking about in the first place . But it still then isnt for me to call them Kafir , yet they do call many so . And this attitude is what I consider a huge problem , if one calls himself Muslim there should be dialogue and not dismissal into Kufr .

Its not my position to coment on his virtuousness, but I can comment on his teachings.

But wait a minute bro , you can say he isnt a Muslim (when he claims otherwise) but you cant judge his virtue as a Muslim ? That doesnt mix , and I rather would call a person a lost brother or a misinformed brother than a Kafir , as that is what a non-Muslim is , is it not ?

Teaching that the race of whites were devils created by some wizzard???
i would LMAO, but it's not funny. There's enough missunderstanding about Islam without these idots making things worse.

Dont worry nobody pays attention to them and nobody actually links them with Islam .... not in the for us harmfull political sense of it .

As for them , hey its damn funny especially when you find out that "wizzard" is called Israel (lol) ..... as he is Yaq'ub.

Oh its too funny you know what they point at as their "genetic manipulation" for the devil creation ?

Gen 31-43 KJ
And Jacob said, Thou shalt not give me any thing: if thou wilt do this thing for me, I will again feed and keep thy flock. 32 I will pass through all thy flock to day, removing from thence all the speckled and spotted cattle, and all the brown cattle among the sheep, and the spotted and speckled among the goats: and of such shall be my hire. 33 So shall my righteousness answer for me in time to come, when it shall come for my hire before thy face: every one that is not speckled and spotted among the goats, and brown among the sheep, that shall be counted stolen with me. 34 And Laban said, Behold, I would it might be according to thy word. 35 And he removed that day the he goats that were ringstraked and spotted, and all the she goats that were speckled and spotted, and every one that had some white in it, and all the brown among the sheep, and gave them into the hand of his sons. 36 And he set three days' journey betwixt himself and Jacob: and Jacob fed the rest of Laban's flocks. 37 And Jacob took him rods of green poplar, and of the hazel and chesnut tree; and pilled white strakes in them, and made the white appear which was in the rods. 38 And he set the rods which he had pilled before the flocks in the gutters in the watering troughs when the flocks came to drink, that they should conceive when they came to drink. 39 And the flocks conceived before the rods, and brought forth cattle ringstraked, speckled, and spotted. 40 And Jacob did separate the lambs, and set the faces of the flocks toward the ringstraked, and all the brown in the flock of Laban; and he put his own flocks by themselves, and put them not unto Laban's cattle. 41 And it came to pass, whensoever the stronger cattle did conceive, that Jacob laid the rods before the eyes of the cattle in the gutters, that they might conceive among the rods. 42 But when the cattle were feeble, he put them not in: so the feebler were Laban's, and the stronger Jacob's. 43 And the man increased exceedingly, and had much cattle, and maidservants, and menservants, and camels, and asses.

And he ends up with asses ..... lol .

Hey at least you cant say they aint creative (there are also theories (nice ones even) on symbolized importance of Elijah's teachings , just as the Bible teachings they use symbolized) .

But anyways yes this is rather silly , however (although it is very relevant ) its not all they teached , and many of their teachings are based in Islam .

Nico :

Well I find the Nation of Islam to be rather hypocritical about the "white slavery" thing. We did buy and sell millions of blacks, as did the Arab traders. Who incidently were muslim... SHOCKERS!


Well I dont know about Farakhan and NOI today , however Elijahs teachings can be compatible with that as many Arab slave traders were white or at least mixed who are being criticized as such ideologically .

come on Ghassan this is pure fallacy. he might aswell have called it the religion of kwejjawhfsdjknvk

No bro , what you do now IMO is the same what DJ does on traditional Islam , Im sorry .

You point out questionable things that you have not seen any reasonable logic behind and decided to judge everything on that .

Farad did as a matter of fact respect the five pillars in general , and there are quite more of these untruths told in your article :

Wali Farad Muhammad (born Wallace Fard),

No he wasnt born Wallace Fard there is no proof of that , he was an Arab from a Syrian mother and a Saudi father is the other explanation offered .

Anyways the drive & position behind the writers of that article (and others on that issue u linked ) is obvious .

The NOI and other movements have done many good things for their people and the perspective in wich they ought to be judged should be seperated one from the other .

Well I dont know about Farakhan and NOI today , however Elijahs teachings can be compatible with that as many Arab slave traders were white or at least mixed who are being criticized as such ideologically .


OMG LMFAO, your serious. NO LIES! That is the lamest thing I have ever heard since Dj.

Nico
OMG LMFAO, your serious. NO LIES! That is the lamest thing I have ever heard since Dj.

Hey nobody here was in agreement with that idea Elijah has , all Im saying that its not hypocritical in the way that you present it .

So stop comparing peoples to DJ ........ I was doing that ..... sorry Buhd I really shouldnt have , now I feel it myself and its too much :(

LOL

peace

So stop comparing peoples to DJ ........ I was doing that ..... sorry Buhd I really shouldnt have , now I feel it myself and its too much


Awwwww G.K you can't have it all! Me want too! :D Hey we can deface him together that sure is fun.