http://www.wired.com/news/business/0,1367,62780,00.html

Apparently, corporations are not to take all blame for all those jobs being outsourced to other countries.

Smells like bullshit to me, I think they outsource because they can pay Indians less than one fourth what they pay Americans.

I agree with the corporations, the US educational system is slowly deteriorating by stupid goverment policies that instead of promoting excellence, they promote mediocrity. It's the result of dumbing down america, the policy that says everybody is equal and only skin color determines who gets the jobs. Affirmitive action my ass. Work hard, get good grades, get rewarded.

A lot of it has to do with the advantage of cheap labor. But the fact that kids are not getting good math and science skills in schools cannot be denied. Certification standards are getting more complicated for teachers, but it usually involves learning teaching techniques instead of making sure their scientific knowledge is up to date.

I stand corrected, according to CNN,
(http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/biztech/03/30/outsourcing.survey.ap/index.html)
Indian workers make less than one sixth the U.S. average. So in order for U.S. workers to compete they must be able to complete more work in a day then six Indians I always root for the home team but I doubt we can do that. If the U.S. worker got a "A" or a "C" on a math test in High School wouldn't matter a fart in a hurricane, one person can't do the work of six.

As far as improving U.S. schools I tend to agree with this writer.
http://maddox.xmission.com/dumbassjocks.html

I stand corrected, according to CNN,
(http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/biztech/03/30/outsourcing.survey.ap/index.html)
Indian workers make less than one sixth the U.S. average. So in order for U.S. workers to compete they must be able to complete more work in a day then six Indians I always root for the home team but I doubt we can do that. If the U.S. worker got a "A" or a "C" on a math test in High School wouldn't matter a fart in a hurricane, one person can't do the work of six.

i agree. the US education fails most but not everybody, some students refuse to get stupefied by our schools.

now if the problem was that our dimwits can't get jobs that require stellar command of maths etc ... but thats not the problem. i have a friend who graduated form columbia university and it still took him a year to land a job.

imbeciles are actually better off than those who aced their calculus exams. because its harder to outsource a job at McDonalds.

who needs to outsource? the people working at mcdonalds are already foreign nationals.

man the USA education doesnt even teach kids about CANADA, the closest country to them... nor do they teach about WHAT WARS they been involded in.... they only talk about "yeah we kicked their ass and we kicked their ass as well"

all USA kids learn about war from freaken movies

full metal jacket, platoon, peral harbour, the alamo... and alot of other countless movies

it
is
a
joke....
they made a movie about 911 twin towers thing in less than a year from when it happened....

REALLY WHAT THE HELL.....


so much rage inside of me i cant even talk anymore


fucken american entertainment, fucken american goverment
half of you americans are A-OK, but your lifestlye PISSES THE LIVING SHIT OUT OF ME....


YOUR COUNTRY IS CRAP AND YOU KNOW IT! WHY ARE SO MANY POEPLE LIVING THERE!

sorry for the american bashing.... but whats been going on USA for the past 10 years... is.... there isnt even a word to discribe it...

im speechless from my own post....

Rage
Rage
Rrraaagggeee!

Calm down, and step away from the computer. :)

Canadian history is covered in most curriculums at the secondary level in a typical American History class.

Canada played an instrumental role in shaping the peace settlement of the Suez Canal crisis, so they've got that notch in their belt, right? :D


man the USA education doesnt even teach kids about CANADA

I think the general consensus among educators in America is that it's best to spend more time teaching subjects that have relevancy in the present context. :cool:

At the risk of sounding racist here is my view why US is deteriorating. The educational system is playing to the lowest common denominator. Every attempt is being made to tear down excellence and replace it with mediocrity.

Colleges instead of using grades give pass or fail, in classes that students get graded attempts are made to keep it a secret less the poor students get a complex.

I used to work for a goverment agency that made every attempt to pass minority students even to the extend of looking the other way to cheating.

Affirmitive action has put a stigma on minorities that they can never overcome. Society is going to look at minority graduates as somehow inferior and never give them a even break.

Is it a wonder the american corporations import foreign students or export jobs to other countries. Is it just costs but ability as well.

Several attempts have been made to eliminate academic decathlons because minority groups are under represented. The list goes on.


Now for hollywood. Most of their movies suck, they are full of violence, sex, car chases, inane plots and poor acting. Other movies have political agendas that skew history to their ideology. Political correctness makes me gag, every movie must have a black actor even if the movie is about vikings in the 5th century. Why cant they make just good movies without the BS?


And now goverment. The era of getting good and able presidents is gone. Unfortunately the media has created a situation that only squeeky clean candidates can become president. Who wants to run for president when they know the media is going to expose their whole life on the air starting at kindergarten. Again the media would rather have a mediocre nobody as president than an able but imperfect man.

US education has been on the demise for much more than a decade. It has been at least 40 years.

My mother was a school teacher and in the early 60's she retired because a group of parents went to the school board because she failed the kids mesarable asses.

They wanted to grade on the new "Curve" method so there kids wouldn't be traumatized by being told they failed at anything. Shssss!.

Then there was phonics and new math. Shssss!.

But cost is indeed a factor when it comes to job loss.

And now goverment. The era of getting good and able presidents is gone. Unfortunately the media has created a situation that only squeeky clean candidates can become president. Who wants to run for president when they know the media is going to expose their whole life on the air starting at kindergarten. Again the media would rather have a mediocre nobody as president than an able but imperfect man.

If by squeaky clean you mean coke addict, womanizer, draft dodger, NG slacker, Botox whore, veteran turncoat, elitist, redneck, limousine liberal, arch-conservative hypocrites; Then Yes, I Agree. ;)

If by squeaky clean you mean coke addict, womanizer, draft dodger, NG slacker, Botox whore, veteran turncoat, elitist, redneck, limousine liberal, arch-conservative hypocrites; Then Yes, I Agree. ;)

You got me there, but you know what I mean. Excessive media coverage has prevented a lot of capable men in running for the presidency, so you end up with the likes as mentioned above.

YOUR COUNTRY IS CRAP AND YOU KNOW IT! WHY ARE SO MANY POEPLE LIVING THERE!

sorry for the american bashing.... but whats been going on USA for the past 10 years... is.... there isnt even a word to discribe it...

Your Hatred disgusts me. Why don't you tell me why so many people are living here if its so bad, and why are so many people emigrating here?
As far as the American bashing isn't that what most people do on these forums? More then half the people on these forums make it sound like the U.S. killed Gandi, MLK, and Jesus with one bullet then masterbated on the corpses while singing the national anthem and drinking a 40oz of King Cobra. Keep hating, I'm laughing at you.

Your Hatred disgusts me. Why don't you tell me why so many people are living here if its so bad, and why are so many people emigrating here?
As far as the American bashing isn't that what most people do on these forums? More then half the people on these forums make it sound like the U.S. killed Gandi, MLK, and Jesus with one bullet then masterbated on the corpses while singing the national anthem and drinking a 40oz of King Cobra. Keep hating, I'm laughing at you.

poeple move there becuases its easy.
easy to find work, no matter how revolting the job ( by THEIR standards)
more poeple means more illegal trade... and illegal activity, and cuase of the court system, its easy for them to get away with it... how many billions of people and really out of the whole bunch get cuaght for their crimes...


honestly... if mexico and your other immagrents, knew what has been going on in the US of A in the past 10-15 years, they would not be living there

they look at the easy advantaged of the USA, not what really goes on there...


im not saying all poeple of the USA are bad... just the government is so screwed up... so much secrecy and lies.... all goverments lie... but USA takes the cake....
US goverment wants more popele to immagrate legaly to the US... so they can get more money thur taxes and other bullshat...
more money means the gov' can keep secrets easyer and better

americans are a pawn to their government....
its so sad that 70% of americans dont realize it....

they have TV COMMERCIALS to rat out their presedental canidates for the next upcomming election...., we all know 95% of americans watch TV.... is it a scam or just being really smart... or just being a self procastinating jack ass....

I just read in an essay by stephen Jay Gould that the USA has a lot of anti intellectualism. Is that true? And surely, if so, its a good indicator of what else is wrong with the education system.
Personally, I think any subject is doomed when they start popularising it.

So, Canadian what has been going on in the U.S.A. for the last 10 or 10-15 years that would scare Immigrants away? If a job is revolting here its still better than starving to death in their home countries.
What makes you think the U.S. government lies more than any other? The U.S. government gets caught because we have a free society where anyone can write basically whatever they want. I could make a web page about how David Hasselhoff is the Anti-christ (http://www.esquilax.com/baywatch/index.shtml) and no one could really do anything about it. You think other governments as large as ours don't censor?
The U.S. government wants people to immigrate legally so they can get more money from taxes? Then why would the U.S. government have any immigration quata's? Your not making sense.

I just read in an essay by stephen Jay Gould that the USA has a lot of anti intellectualism.As far as I can tell, it's really hard to pin down. Lots of people talk about it, but nobody seems to understand it. My theory is that it's not an intentional hostility, but rather symptomatic of continually "economizing" and seeking the lowest-budget option.

People get their news from CNN and the 1-inch capsules in the local newspapers and through online organizations because they don't have time to go in-depth. American life, if you count up everything you're supposed to care about and be aware of, is chaotically overburdened. So people cut out all but the practical.

This is, at least, what I understand from watching my own parents constantly struggling after a financial plateau in lieu of comfort, happiness, and security. The arts are not practical; schools became more vocational in the 1990s (at least it seemed that way in Oregon); I'll even take a moment to note a certain number of people--not the usual suspects, necessarily--who have in the past actually gotten mad at me because of the length of my posts. People don't have all night. They want an opinion and they want it now ....

They don't have time to understand their religion, their government, their civic community, the social contract. They have time to function and keep their heads above water.

The intellectual route requires a devotion of time and energy, and many bright people just don't have those resources to spare compared to their priorities. (House payment, kids to feed, &c.)

As a result, people come to mistrust the intellectual route, and over time that mistrust evolves into open distrust.

Take a simple example: "Tax and spend" liberal. That's better than a tax-cutting, overspending politician; logic dictates that you don't increase spending while cutting revenue flows. But people are willing to write that debt to "their children and grandchildren," as such. As it stands right now, with the temptation of a $300 check, the Bush administration has bought off the American people; to wonder about the prudence of the Bush tax cut is to "overintellectualize." To worry about the lack of planning and budget projections for the Iraq war was to "overintellectualize," and overintellectualization was considered a bad thing when action could "save lives" or (fill in the noble blank).

People are so caught up in today that they haven't time to remember yesterday or think about tomorrow, unless it's farming through past bills for proof of payment or securing retirement funds.

They haven't time for much of what they claim is important.

I dont know about you Tiassa but all my life has been spent in work or in front of the TV . There's got to be something more to life but cant think of anything else. Oh wait I think I got it, I'll start posting on the internet.

tiassa:

I don't think it's only a matter of not having enough time. I also think that many people don't want to put the effort into learning about the wider world around them. Fundamentally, they don't really care, unless it affects them directly. As long as they are comfortable, with their MTV and a fridge full of food, and a neat garden in their fenced-off estate, why bother reading about religion, or politics, or science? It's all too much effort to look beyond your own back fence.

Greco:

I think that the internet is an overwhelmingly incredibly positive force for information exchange. Some people are actually moving away from their TVs and starting to think about things and interact with other people a bit more.

I believe the internet should be filtered in schools and that some basic classes on information management should be taught since early in schools here in America, and everywhere.
I am attending an american college, and there are so many resources here it's overwhelming. Everything is given in a silver tray, and many students still don't get it. I myself still dont get it. They slack, and while many become idealists, many just use their education with a financial means. There is no real love of knowledge. The problem lies in the academic auto-concept perhaps, and the unresolution of questions such as "why learning?" "what for?"

I think that when one has many things there are less things to aim for, in physical terms. I suppose that, as most of the kids have houses and at least a few employment opportunities, there is this security blanket for them...they could make the worst mistakes and still not hit rock bottom.

If the U.S. education is so bad why are the vast majority of patents in the world coming from the U.S. I admit that the U.S. education system is admin heavy and not performance oriented but this is the U.S. We can change our system any time that enough people can agree on what is necessary. That is why there are so many people living here. Ps. is Canada that island in the Atlantic with lots of ice.

I agree with the corporations, the US educational system is slowly deteriorating by stupid goverment policies that instead of promoting excellence, they promote mediocrity. It's the result of dumbing down america, the policy that says everybody is equal and only skin color determines who gets the jobs. Affirmitive action my ass. Work hard, get good grades, get rewarded.

Im really sorry but grades don't mean shit. I don't need some life reject (professor) whose salary I'm paying now and will continue to pay my entire life to Issue a judgement of me based on my ability to suck up to him.
Grading is almost completely subjective and has nothing to do with the abilities gained during school.

I don't even buy the books to my classes, don't study, and have gotten a 3.8 up to this point until now when they have decided to enforce education policies that are 2000 years old. (Enforcing grading large quantities of written assignments, less ability to question teachers, less standardized tests etc) I agree the education system needs to be reformed but it needs to be done through an understanding of epistomology not following the whims of some self hating bunch of losers who never grew any character and want us to suck up to old, useless and completely amoral professors just because they had to.

The USA has a historical advantage with patents, due to being richer and larger. Plus, have you seen the number of foreigners working in US research labs? Their home countries cant produce patents so much, because they arent as well developed, hence, they end up being brain drained to the USA.

Indians are driven and determined to succeed. They work their asses off, getting themselves a good education, and working really hard. Unless americans put in the effort and really WORK, only then can they fight outsourcing. India has a great advantage though with it's cheap labour. 1.1 billion people need employement.