In the course of discussion it was come upon that nanotechnology could be the grounds for the next weapon of the millennium.

So the question arises of how could this be put to use? What would be the probable result? How would you deploy such and how would you defend and protect your populace?

What means would you use to detect who was your hidden enemy and how would you deal with such a threat?

As a kick off for this thread. What if I sent a horde of nanobots with the instructions to convet lead to a lacey, filmy type of substance leaving no firmness to the material?

That would mean no bullets for the guns to fire. So how do you protect yourself? And what happens to your vehicles and food supplies? I would think that just that one item would cause major headaches to the infrastructure of a nation. Oh, other things could be targeted such as steel. Turn it to rust by accelerated oxidation. Remove nitrogen from the soil, convert oil to a hard substance. ect.

Ideas?

And for the benefitical side, what if I want to get rid of say the potato bug, world wide. Or the acid rain remanants after it has hit the soil.

It occurs to me that we can have 3 types of nanobots each with their strength and weakness.

1. 100% non-bio nanobots
2. Half machine half bug so that bugs will act as transportation devices. Machine attached to them. Like a nanoborg!
3. Full bio, genetically modified bug to function for a specific purpose.

Something to keep in mind. I am watching Jay Leno, somebody stole a FBI laptop!!

Bye

Originally posted by wet1
As a kick off for this thread. What if I sent a horde of nanobots with the instructions to convet lead to a lacey, filmy type of substance leaving no firmness to the material?

That would mean no bullets for the guns to fire. So how do you protect yourself? And what happens to your vehicles and food supplies? I would think that just that one item would cause major headaches to the infrastructure of a nation. Oh, other things could be targeted such as steel. Turn it to rust by accelerated oxidation. Remove nitrogen from the soil, convert oil to a hard substance. ect.

My humble opinion is that the best way to go about this is to have your nanites target DNA. This has the advantage that you can go for a certain ethnicity (most wars involve two different ethnic groups), and if you're after an individual, then you can program your nanoscopic chum to target certain SNPs.
If you're after hardware, there are bound to be difference in, for example, paint composition. Remember: you're using a disassembly machine. If it's targetable at all, you've probably got a vast choice. Does your foe use titanium alloy in their rockets when you use Tungsten Carbide? Etc.

Provocative thoughts rde. Pull up a chair and sit down. Any others certainly welcome to join. I purposely left out the targeting of people from the thread as to me that is a whole different level of aggression. And once the step is taken there is no turning around. A complete people wiped from the face of the earth. Now I know from all the posting I've done in some of these threads I would have lead you to believe that I have to be one of those blood thristy war mongers. In actuallity that is not the case. But this is in the realm of what if so I guess most anything goes.

I would assume that if you knew your enemy/opponet at all, which you would have to some extent to use such, then you would be up to date on his weapon componets and their weakness. So targeting a particular metal should not present a problem. Blunders throughout history would have me wrong I know. Even the History Channel has enough of them to make a series on. But if your going to use such as this you'd best know, most likely you won't get the second chance.

Originally posted by wet1
But if your going to use such as this you'd best know, most likely you won't get the second chance. Herein lies the problem. It's possible to have a limited nuclear strike, or a limited biological strike. 'Limited' might mean the end of 90% of humanity and a planet that's fucked for ten thousand years, but all that's nothing, cosmically speaking. Nanotech has the capablility of killing the entire planet. More than that; in fact. It's possible that after Earth's been turned into grey goo, an asteroid will carry the nanites to Mars and/or Europa, spreading the contamination beyond our ex-planet.

I'm a huge fan of nanotech, but I'm acutely aware of the dangers. Nanotech should never be used offensively. It's dangerous enough when we're just trying to do nice things.

Nice post.

And I believe that we have hit upon the grey goo before. A very real threat if your senerio has foundation. The assumption you had made in the grey goo thread is one that I will not argue. It seems to have its merit.

The possibility of solar system wide contaimination is indeed one that I had not considered. I shall dwell upon it some and make comments later...

Do not worry, human beings will not be able to destroy the planet - not anytime soon. Somehow, our ability to design a self replicating and evolving nanobot will be limited. By the time we get to that stage, we will have superior technology in computing power to thwart any nefarious activity by the nanobots.

Originally posted by kmguru
Do not worry, human beings will not be able to destroy the planet - not anytime soon. Somehow, our ability to design a self replicating and evolving nanobot will be limited. By the time we get to that stage, we will have superior technology in computing power to thwart any nefarious activity by the nanobots. Such faith. And while - in theory - they're simple to control (a strong magnetic field should do the trick) all it takes is one nanite with instructions to do nothing but replicate itself and we're all dust within a matter of months. It doesn't have to evolve.

Originally posted by rde
Such faith. And while - in theory - they're simple to control (a strong magnetic field should do the trick) all it takes is one nanite with instructions to do nothing but replicate itself and we're all dust within a matter of months. It doesn't have to evolve.

Faith? Coming from Ireland? You must be kidding!!! We already have a few dust makers in Africa today. They are called Ebola and Nile virus. More potent form may be lurking somewhere in your backyard that has not jumped to humans yet!

Something else too, what about the shielding in nuclear reactors?
That could lead to unanticipated effects as well.

Shadow

Excellent point. You have come upon some of the very things we speak of. ...and you would do?

That bears some thought. Off the top though, if I remember, graphite is also a good shield, as well as concrete. Of course, bugs could be designed to destroy those as well. Maybe an outer wall with bug destroying bugs. How about a continuous localized EMP to disable them. Or maybe something that runs too hot for them to function. Of course, given the technology, ways will always be found to work around any defense so it will have to be constantly evolving.

Shadow

Which is another way of saying like it is today.

BTW, you have come up with some excellent ideas.

Current estimates are that we have around 8-10 years before we start seeing this technology become practical. First applications will most likely be medical. Though guessing is an area where anything goes. Weapon offshoots are something that will also be developed. It is an excerise in speculation to think about. But we will see this techonolgy come to be.

I do agree one hundred percent that nano tech can be used as a weapon. It can even be designed to be the next mechanical plaque of the century.
The defense from nano-tech weapons lies in advanced scanning technology. Scanning technology that can pinpoint one particular atom from orbit (If one so desires). I know that this technology sounds far from likely, but it is definitely possible.
One of the best expenditures of energy on where to use nano-tech should lye with enhancing lives. This would include enhanced intelligence, enhanced immunity, disease control and elimination, just to name a few. This is where the true potential of nano-tech lies.

Welcome to Sciforums matrixghost2000. May your posts be many and varied!

I tend to agree with you about the best being in the benefits as opposed to weaponry. Lately we have been seeing a disturbing trend in the world of development. Hmmm, how to state this...

You see, in the past almost all-revolutionary technology came from 2 places on the average. Either government developed them because costs were to great for the individual or corporation to swallow or schools and universities (usually with government funding). Not to often in the past was it that John Q. Citizen discovered, without aid, some new technology.

Now days we are seeing more and more of things developed and manufactured for civilian use and later adapted for military use. So, if such is developed to help, you better bet some of the funding was from government. And part of government is the military. And the military always wants new toys.

Your speculation of being able to spot one atom from orbit is a nice one. Rather beyond us for some time I would imagine. The ability to discriminate one atom out of the field of view of say a telescopic camera would require immense computing power. Beyond what we now have. But I commend you, as I don't think anyone else has come up with such a thought for use.

I am looking for the best sites on the internet to research the latest developments in nanotechnology. Any suggestions? Also, thanks for the relply Wet1. Just out of curiosity, let's compare notes. What recent technology has been developed first for commercial use, and then used later for the military? I'm not saying I disagree with you. I would just like to get a concept of what types of technologies you are talking about. Thanks again, matrixghost.

You might find these sites interesting:

http://www.nano.org.uk/

http://www.csa.ru/Fulleren/center.html

http://www.ifm.ethz.ch/mems/

Good luck

hey all :)

Who’s to say we have not already encountered such a
Situation!?!?
CHEMTRAILS- if they are living in our lungs they only need the correct order to do the rest!
LIKE- release a fatal disease-accelerate a genetic flaw to an early death-
Selectively kill all 2-strand DNA people as inferior beings!
I think the psychology would be not too far from current
Households in that they do not keep chemicals that are designed to kill inside or even near a residential area.
Maybe that is the reason Ebola is in Africa?
Topopause/stratisphere-41km strait up they have found bacteria-
Maybe we are being slowly invaded?
Maybe high level flight of spy planes and shuttles bring down deadly viruses that have been orbiting for thousands of years?

anywho... now that i have possibly upset a few frail minded people i will go :D
At least made a few peeps nervous anywho :)

# note can they fly? what vibration/frequency would they operate @ ?

groove on all :)

Richard Nixon

Initially I was thinking of something simple. The military used to have automotive manufactures make a specific vehicle for them to their specifications. The Jeep comes to mind. Now they buy regular pickup trucks with the military color of the year. :D However, to list a few things the military was not involved in during its conception and testing phase:
Compact disk
Superconductivity
Photograph
electrocardiograph
helicopter
fight
video games
After they were proved then the military was "interested in them" and so contributed to the further development and research need to bring those inventions up to the level of usable equipment.

Now these things listed above are not all new, lately developed technologies. But what the individual has now that they didn't before is the computer and that great source of information, the Internet.

As Chagur gave you some fine sources of nano sites I will not.

So all you little primates want a BIG gun!!!!!?


WHY?


Electromagnetic (lead shielding), conventional bomb shelters, ect...

Let nano tech be benificial, not destructive.

IN A BIO TECH WAR, EVERYONE SHOULD BE PROTECTE4D IF HE IS WRAPPED IN STERILIZED PLASTIC......




It should be the defensive desire of the USA. To defend against conventional and nuclear attacks!!1!

NANO WARFARE HAS NO WINNERS! WHEN THE BASICS ARE LEARNED, NO ONE WILL BE SAFE@!

IT IS THE GREATEST THREAT TO ALL LIFE ON EARTH!

WITH A SUFFICIENT AMOUNT OF NANO-KNOW HOW, A LOWELY THIRD-WORLD NATION COULD BRING THE USA to it's knees!!!!!!

It's the worst of the worst wet!......!1

With the know how, and a couple thousand bucks worth off the shelf equipment, I could erradicate every asshole on the North American Continent!!!!!

That's how dangerous it is!!!!!! BAT?????WET!!!!!!1

"not that I'm offering to be a Gerald Bull about it!"

:D :cool:

<B>Unfortunately, cannons are also instruments of war, and Bull's specialization ultimately led to his death. He was assassinated in March 1990 at his home in Brussels, Belgium, apparently by agents of Israel, </B>

When you talk 'Big Guns' ... you talk reeeealy big guns!!!!!

'Gerald Bull?' Damn it, where did I hear that name before?

Okay, hit the old 'Webferrit' ... and YES!!!

http://www-spof.gsfc.nasa.gov/stargaze/Smartlet.htm

Thanks for stirring the old grey matter!

Chagur

NOTE: About Bull: http://world.std.com/~jlr/doom/bull.htm

<img src="http://www-spof.gsfc.nasa.gov/stargaze/Sfigs/Sharpgun.jpg">
<b><font size="5">"BIG GUN"</FONT SIZE></B>


Development of Gun Launched Vertical Probes for Upper Atmosphere Studies" by G. V. Bull, Canadian Aeronautics and Space Journal 10, p.236, 1964.


"Big Gun on Barbados" by Peter M. Millman, Sky and Telescope, August 1966, p.64.


<B>Unfortunately, cannons are also instruments of war, and Bull's specialization ultimately led to his death. He was assassinated in March 1990 at his home in Brussels, Belgium, apparently by agents of Israel, </B>

HP just filed a patent for nanocomputers. Add nanocomputation to AI, what do you get?

Oh! talk about resonators. The resonators need a lot of power. Otherwise those low riders would have fallen apart in front of you on a freeway from their own sound system....

But the idea is sound (pun intended!). There are so many ways to kill and destroy life and property, it is not funny. Hopefully, we will find a way to get along.

As more countries setup Biotech labs, it is a matter of time, someone will come up with a weapon....The best solution is to work together...

hey all :)

hey howard!....strong words! :/
you raise a very good continueation of the space time continuim :D
nano bots that attach themselfs to things and then vibrate at a certain speed to make it time travel(in the theory of some in relation to light speed)
or just turn it into goo!
the problem ....as such....
is that the type of people who would want to do such things would not want to "get rid of" all the people because then they would not have anyone to pervert and control!

kinda like a double negative in psychology of self evaluation of a "normal" person :D

groove on all :)

going way back in the thread, first to the DNA-specific targets: look up The White Plague by Frank Herbert. Basically the same, he just uses man-made virii. Also interesting, it targetted only women... can you imagine what that would do to a nation?
Secondly, going even further back in the thread, to the example of targetting lead: I'm sorry I can't place the book, perhaps someone has read it. But the main subject was: this man created an organism that feeds off petroleum products. All gasoline, oil, plastics, everything related was destroyed. That in itself would also be an incredible weapon. coincidently, both storylines had the loss of family as motivation...

And to defence of the nation: In this respect, I am thinking of nanites, mechanical mainly. I was thinking transponders around the nation, hidden of course, but that would kill any of the nanites that got within range, leaving the country free of their own weapon. Of course, like the nuclear strike issue... your only hope would be to be the first one to attack... because if you fail, your defences won't count against bots made by someone else...

Just to let you know ... Howard may have gotten wiped 9-11.

Check the date on the post.

Take care.