Turkish officials said 450 people were injured in the twin blasts, which occurred five minutes apart at about 11 a.m (0900 GMT) on Thursday. Many of the victims were Turks.

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Seventeen were killed in the bombing at the British consulate and 10 in the attack on HSBC bank in a crowded shopping area in the Levent neighborhood, the Turkish Interior Ministry said

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Eyewitnesses said they believed the blasts were caused by suicide car bombers.

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Speaking at a news conference with Bush, Blair vowed his country would "fight and defeat this evil."

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The blasts gutted the buildings, leaving enormous mounds of wreckage. Emergency crews searched through rubble for victims while bloody survivors were carried away from the sites, in some cases coughing and sobbing.

It was the second time in five days that Istanbul was struck by what Turkish officials are calling terrorist attacks.

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Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan said Thursday's bombings were similar while Interior Minister Abdulkadir Aksu said trucks were probably used to carry explosives.

Shortly after the bombings, a government office in Istanbul received a phone call claiming to be from al Qaeda and a Turkish Islamic militant group --the Great Eastern Islamic Raiders' Front (IBDA-C) -- claiming joint responsibility, CNN Turk reported.

IBDA-C initially claimed responsibility for twin attacks on Saturday.

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Turkey, which stands out among Muslim nations as a secular democracy, vowed not to allow terrorist groups to change what it stands for.

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etc.Source (http://edition.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/europe/11/20/turkey.blast/index.html)


Turkey is a Muslim democracy, along with Lebanon. The Turks represent the link btwn the Western world and the East. They have represented the second greatest extent of the Islam religion. Now they represent a struggling developing economy desperately trying to get into the EU (something IMO won't happen). Turkey has ever since the collapse of the Ottoman Empire in 1922 has been in the tradition of Attaturk, the great "enlightened" secular leader of the Turks. The current Turkey has elected a Islamic leaning party, but still has strong secular routes, the military is heavily secular, and presents a strong voice in Turkey. With the advent of modern "terrorist" actions around the world, Turkey is surely a compelling target. Turkey would be a state not worth losing for the Islamists they believe (correctly) that the Islamization of Turkey would be slap in the face of Western "progressiveness". IT would even be more of a slap then the 1979 Iranian revolution was. But I don't see Turkey turning into a Islamic state anytime soon. But what I do see is more of this:


http://i.cnn.net/cnn/2003/WORLD/europe/11/20/turkey.blast/vert.aerial.hsbc.ap.jpg

If what you say (that Turkey is the link between 'west' and 'east') is true then it is plausible the attack was made at a gateway where the West attempts to invade the East. The attack on the banking corporation was surely an attack on the West, because even though the corporation is supposedly 'eastern', it represents Western values. Capitalism (for the lack of a better word) has spread to Hong-Kong and various other places around the world, so I would say the attack was really an attack on materialism, which is what underlies capitalism.

i thought the target was the uk not turkey

*the attack was real cool. hope more targets are lined up. one sided battles bore the hell out of me.

Yeah I'd say it was. It was more of an attack to force the spread of English values out of Turkey (in my opinion).

In review your right it was an attack more so on the British, but never the less it was in Turkey. There must be some significance in that. The Brits were the target now that I look at the building the see the HSBC logo. And with the attack on the British consulate it has obvious British objectives. But I think the most potent and important aspect of this attack has been the fact that Al Qaeda or some organization has the capability to cause some pretty bad damage, just look at the facade of that building. Here are some pics of the building before the attack:

What was the entrance. (http://www.emporis.info/en/il/im/?id=216838)

General proximity to other buildings in the Levent area of town. (http://www.emporis.info/en/il/im/?id=106708)

The building was built in 1998, it has 15 floors.

The building was built in 1998, it has 15 floors. It had 15 floors. :D

Incidently humans aren't the first species to build such things. Termites (and Ants too I think) work together to build constructions which leads me to beleive that 'God' does (somehow) have human form, or in other words 'God' created man in his own image. I mean males and fe males both have the same soul, so I also beleive that animals do too! Given the different forms of animals this is perplexing, but highly interesting. :)

By the way Nico your grammar here is not too good either. I'm not getting at you, but it does make it quite hard to understand. You will be able to correct this with just a bit of re-reading before you post! :)

Well it didn't collapse... but it was a devestating attack. Yes my grammar is a horrid aspect of my writing skills... but hey no one is perfect. :( Live with it in essence.

I bet if Osama saw Mohammud himself wearing a buisiness suit and tie he would order his destruction. *sigh*
I don't even think al Quaita even knows what exactly its trying to fight or what it wants to do afterwards. After it sets the rest of the world on fire it will probably turn its attention inwards and then nothing would be left. I just hope it dosn't come to that.

But I think the most potent and important aspect of this attack has been the fact that Al Qaeda or some organization has the capability to cause some pretty bad damage, just look at the facade of that building.

what what
9/11 faded into the dim recesses of memory already?;)

I used to write on this forum with a differerent username. Before the 2. Gulf war i told you guys that Turkiye is going te be effected the most again.
And here we are now after the war..
Turkiye is the target of the terrorist organizations. So many inncocent people got wounded or are dead now. In both gulf wars Turkiye got effected the worst. Thats why Turkiye tried to prevent US from attacking Iraq, but no one listened and now we know that Turkiye was right because everyday Americans get killed or people get killed by terrorist attacks.

I also want to say that these attacks only make our ties with Israel stronger instead of weakening it. The 2 countries, the two only stable countries in that region will stay together and help each other more now. I dont understand the mentality behind these attacks but i know that these attacks are not going to stay only in Istanbul but they will jump to inner Europe and America too.

So, i want some of the people here to think before what they did and then condemn the horrible attacks. Think about how you (or your governments) helped those attacks to occur even though maybe you didnt think it would be like this.

Long live SECULAR DEMOCRATIC TURKISH REPUBLIC... we have seen many horrible terrorist attacks in our 80 years republic but we always stood together and came back with much more power.

1) Turkiye is the only secular democratic Muslem country on earth. These idiots can not get it how a Muslem country can be democratic and secular. They still believe the Kuran (Quaran or how you guys know it) says things like secularism is bad. They dont have a clue about Islam but think that they are the best Muslems.

2)Turkiye and Israel have stron ties. They cant understand why a Muslem country stands together with Israel.
Ok, Israel is doing a lot of mistakes too but the last time when the Turks trusted in the Arabs we lost the first world war. Stability in the region has to stay and i dont see any other stable country but Turkiye and Isreal in that region.

3) Turkiye wants to forget totally about the middle east and join the European Union. It is going to happen in the next 5 years you will see.

4) There are a lot of different ethnic backgrounded people in Turkiye. We show those idiots how different people can live in a country in unity. They dont like it and want to destroy it.

5) Turkiye is the only Muslem country in the NATO. They dont like it

6) They dont have the guts to face the Turkish military in a normal and fair war between 2 countries, so they cowardly kill innocents.

7) They think that they know Islam the best but actually they dont know anything about Islam.

Before the 2. Gulf war i told you guys that Turkiye is going te be effected the most again.
And here we are now after the war..
Turkiye is the target of the terrorist organizations. So many inncocent people got wounded or are dead now. In both gulf wars Turkiye got effected the worst. Thats why Turkiye tried to prevent US from attacking Iraq, but no one listened and now we know that Turkiye was right because everyday Americans get killed or people get killed by terrorist attacks.
I didn't know any of that! I don't even know if I saw your posts but I wish I had. It seems that you were correct then. Your knowledge of history is obviously good. I have a question then. Why Turkey (Turkiye)? Does their population consist of a large majority of a particular religious group?

I wont ask if a clash on the sports pitch a short time ago is related in any way. I'm sure it is, but as I have written, there is no need for an answer. :)

3) Turkiye wants to forget totally about the middle east and join the European Union. It is going to happen in the next 5 years you will see.


That is not going to happen in the foreseeable future, as long as the Turkish military exhorts so much power, and as long Turkey keeps N.Cyprus under nominal Turkish control. If Turkey "forgets" about her immediate neighbors she is bound to have a massive Kurdish problem again.

4) There are a lot of different ethnic backgrounded people in Turkiye. We show those idiots how different people can live in a country in unity. They dont like it and want to destroy it.

Well then they should be attacking every ME country, the reason why they are attacking is because Turkey is secular.

6) They dont have the guts to face the Turkish military in a normal and fair war between 2 countries, so they cowardly kill innocents.


AH why would a terrorist organization attack hardened military targets? It would be like me throwing stones at a F-16, let's be realistic here. What get's attention? Not a Turkish HUMVEE getting blown it, it's a civilian building. It's very Macheviallianist the ends justify the means.

7) They think that they know Islam the best but actually they dont know anything about Islam.

RIIGHT! Ok... Islamist terrorists who don't even know what they are fighting for? All it is is a different perspective.

It's ironic that there is a 'terrorist' action, in Turkey of all places, which is pertfectly timed to take attention away from the mass protests against Bush's visit to the UK, kind of trying to justify Blair's and Bush's war by proving that 'Al Quaida' knows no bounds and would even stoop to attack in a Muslim country, regardless of whether it is secular or not.

I think it would be fair to assume that any terrorist leader worth his salt; if he'd really wanted to make a statement, if he'd really wanted to take revenge, if he'd really wanted to make a real score, then he would have really placed his bombs in London and as really close to the 2 heads of state as possible... so why didn't he? Why choose Turkey and for what specific purpose? It's not as though Al Quaida is in perpetual conflict with Turkey as with the IRA and Britain for example. When they used to blow something up, they used to call the Brits up before or after, prove their id with a codeword, admit to it and everyone knew what it was about and accepted it for what it was. Turkey and Al Quaida are not in that kind of conflict (if any at all) so again, I ask why? Turkey even stood up to the US and refused to facilitate their war machine at the beginning of the Iraq invasion and it wasn't until after much pressure that they conceded to assist the US, in a limited way. It's kind of irrational, Read Between The Lines.

'And they strike, even as the fools continue to protest against the war' is the kind of message that was intended to come across from this atrocity. To protest against a war on terror just as the terrorist is killing more innocents must be foolish in the extreme, non? Another case of fooling some of the people some of the time, methinks. RBTL

Here is my partly hypothesis why:

As you know ever since the old war in Afghanistan, al-quaida had plenty of time to organise "sleeping cells" all over the world until 9-11, when the west was finally woken up in a most brutal way. Now, with this this worldwide foxhunt and crackdowns on al-quaida operatives, especially in Pakistan, heartland Saudi Arabia and Indonesia, they are somewhat in the defensive and must keep low profile, but in a country that everyone overlooked was Turkey ( Problems between Kurds and Turks yes, but Al- quaida? )

So, precisely due to the semi-progressive nature of the Turkish democratic state effectively al-quaida had more "breathing space" and now they wake up their sleeping cell to show the world they can still deal a punch to "the imperialists" killing some innocent bystanders in the process....

then he would have really placed his bombs in London and as really close to the 2 heads of state as possible... so why didn't he?

I don't know could be 17,000 police on the streets? Also it's much easier to attack close to your base with a moderate base to support you then to attack on a different continent. If anything a attack in London would convince the Brits that maybe Blair was right (eventhough there is no link btwn Iraq and Al Qaeda).


killing some innocent bystanders in the process....

The means justify the ends I guess.

Originally posted by Clockwood
I bet if Osama saw Mohammud himself wearing a buisiness suit and tie he would order his destruction. *sigh*
I don't even think al Quaita even knows what exactly its trying to fight or what it wants to do afterwards. After it sets the rest of the world on fire it will probably turn its attention inwards and then nothing would be left. I just hope it dosn't come to that. \

For the first time you are making sense. Interesting post.

I bet if Osama saw Mohammud himself wearing a buisiness suit and tie he would order his destruction.
And if GW saw Jesus with kaftan turban and beard???

if Jesus christ was to stand up today
He'd be gunned down cold by the CIA
Matt Johnson

Dee Cee