Is love just an physical/emotional need in humans to help reproduction or is it somehting more powerful/cosmic?


Thanx,
Cactus

Love developed due to evolution. Love tends to create a favorable enviroment for successful procreation as well as post-birth nurture.

The combination creates a powerful influence for survival of the species.

I'm curious to see what role love plays when anti-aging treatments become widely available and people begin to live for centuries. Population control will be needed at first but I for one would not want to have another family. That was an interesting experience and I want to pursue other interests now. I no longer have an urgent need to find a loving partner and procreate. I suspect that love will become far less important in a long-lived society.

Lack of animosity will be important but that is different to love.

Cris

"Love developed due to evolution."

What 'love' are you talking about? Surely not romantic love.
Evolution? How ... why ... ?

"Love tends to create a favorable enviroment for successful
procreation as well as post-birth nurture."

As does living up some hollow and going to town twice a year
for 'necessities'.

So what's your point?

Take care ;)

Chagur,

I think you are being a little dense today.


What 'love' are you talking about? Surely not romantic love. Any combination of emotional effects that you want to attribute to the term ‘love’.


Evolution? How ... why ... ? If evolution favored the emotion of hate then it would seem unlikely that the species would have survived since procreation would have been unlikely to have occurred very often. Those individuals that had that particular trait would have likely died out resulting in only those individuals with the trait of love surviving.


"Love tends to create a favorable enviroment for successful
procreation as well as post-birth nurture."

As does living up some hollow and going to town twice a year
for 'necessities'.

So what's your point? Well what’s your point? If you consider other environments also encourage procreation then fine. I made no implication that love was the only approach. The topic is about love remember.

Cris

what about love for companinionship?

Humans = social animals. We need(ed) each otehr for survival. So naturally the human animals always felt safest and had the best chance for survival when with other humans. We developed biological mechanisms to encourage that community, that social behaviour, simply so we humans could survive. Romantic love was a further extension to facilitate mating pairs within that community.

PS: Yes, I'm down on the whole love thing lately.

Cris is the man. I completely agree, love does form out of evolution and is present one way or another in every animal that procreates sexually (as for the asexual ones, well, they love themselves). Since we're generally fairly intelligent compared to most other species we figured that to survive we would be able to live longer in the harsh world if we worked together, and that's how our populations grew a little faster you might say because for the most part we didn't have to search for a mate, they were already ripe for the taking in our hunting packs.

But I think that for awhile at least love will be present, but I think for the most part love is what spurs most other emotions, jealousy, fear, hate, disgust, laughter, etc. You get the point.

Where's Nelson?

Romantic love probably evolved to facilitate pair bonding. Human children are helpless for a longer period of time, so the pair bond between parents must of necessity be stronger.

This also explains why humans and other animals with long infancies enjoy sex more than other animals without.

In other words, what Cris said. :)

Where's Nelson?

HERE I AM!!!!! :)

Am I late? :D:D:D

I only saw this thread now...


Well Love is certainly the Spirit of the Universe! :)
Love is Conscience.
Unconditional Love is the True Love.
Love is pure.
Love is kind.
Love is omniscient,
Omnipotent,
Omnipresent.

Love is Everything! :):):)

We are Love Beings.
We are the Children of Love. :)

Love,
Nelson

Yes, you were. I mean, you find topics like 'love' faster than a lawyer finds a car-accident victim. :D

Sushi!,
Xev

To all,

Well I guess that is worth some kind of response otherwise people will think that truthseeker has a valid point, which he doesn’t.


Well Love is certainly the Spirit of the Universe! Words of a dreamer, otherwise more gibberish.


Love is Conscience. No, love is a set of human emotions.


Unconditional Love is the True Love. Unconditional love is impossible since conditions can result where perceived unconditional love can cause massive harm.


Love is kind. No, kindness is part of the loving process.


Love is omniscient, No, love is generally blind.


Omnipotent, Unfortunately love and emotions don’t pay the bills, and that is where the intellect becomes useful.


Omnipresent. Nope, most people spend most of their time doing other useful things.


Love is Everything! Nope, love is just one single characteristic of human nature that has evolved to help mankind survive, but human nature has numerous facets.


We are Love Beings. Nope, we are human beings who just happen to have the ability to love occasionally and at appropriate times.


We are the Children of Love. Sounds like some New Age religious concept from the 60s hippy movement. The statement is otherwise gibberish.

Cris

Cris: Or some have given up on ever persuading Nelson to give evidence for his theories and would not bother.....


Unconditional love is impossible since conditions can result where perceived unconditional love can cause massive harm.

Yes, unconditional love would destroy ethics, if it existed.

Somtimes people come close. This emotion often destroys duty and morality.

Love is a chemical reaction within the brain. I imagine that it could be every bit as destructive as heroin, if unchecked.

Balance in all things.

Sushi!,
Xev

So Nelson do you believe love is a force that can break through all barriers and obstacles?

Xev,


Balance in all things..Yes exactly. Anything to excess always seems to create distortion and chaos. Just like a new toy, it is played with continuously to the exclusion of everything else, until finally boredom results and other activities come back into the field of view. I strongly suspect that truthseeker feels he has discovered the panacea that will cure all the world’s ills. He needs some practical lessons before he realizes his mistake. But you, tinker, tyler, and truthseeker, are all about the same age, but apart from ts you are all fairly well balanced. Is it that ts is simply not prepared to listen to the wisdom of others? And I don’t mean us, but there must have been other sources of knowledge that he must have been exposed. This is his natural arrogance I guess that prevents him from learning from others. I guess he must find his own way but at this rate it is going to take him a lifetime to just cover the basics. Sigh!

Cris

Cris:

Just like a new toy, it is played with continuously to the exclusion of everything else, until finally boredom results and other activities come back into the field of view. I strongly suspect that truthseeker feels he has discovered the panacea that will cure all the world’s ills. He needs some practical lessons before he realizes his mistake.

Yes, I notice that in some lovers, the way they absolutly dote on each other for a while, then drift or break apart. I wonder whether I will avoid such a trap if I fall in love again.

Me, ha ha, I am too busy with finals!

A good lesson in the 'school of hard knocks' is always in order.

Sushi!,
Xev

Yes, I guess I be dense, since ...

"Love tends to create a favorable enviroment for successful
procreation as well as post-birth nurture"

still makes me wonder where your head is at when you make a
statement like that and then blithely make a connection with
evolution.

If 'love', an 'emotion' be the result of evolution, what other 'emotions'
are similarly a result of 'evolution'?

Curious.

Take care :rolleyes:

"Love is purely a creation of the human imagination, the most important example of how the imagination outruns the creature it inhibits."

Cris,

I will prove you wrong in one quote...


Unconditional love is impossible since conditions can result where perceived unconditional love can cause massive harm.

The Love I speak here is completly unconditional. Since you don't know what unconditional Love is, as you state above, you don't even know what I'm talking about!

Cactus Jack,


So Nelson do you believe love is a force that can break through all barriers and obstacles?

Yes.

Love,
Nelson

Chagur,


"Love tends to create a favorable enviroment for successful
procreation as well as post-birth nurture"

still makes me wonder where your head is at when you make a
statement like that and then blithely make a connection with
evolution.

If 'love', an 'emotion' be the result of evolution, what other 'emotions'
are similarly a result of 'evolution'?

Curious.Ok I understand.

I start from the assumption that man evolved. That means that everything that man is is the result of evolution. I’m arguing from the perspective of why did evolution favor a particular attribute or trait and then try to make sense of it. All, or most of your emotions have survived because they either aided in survival or were neutral.

Hate for example we could say was beneficial since it encouraged man to fight off predators. Love is useful since it encourages man to care for his offspring.

Fear is useful because it prepares you for either fight or flight – ultimately survival is the goal. If the trait did not aid survival then it would die out.

Does that help?
Cris

Unconditional love is impossible since conditions can result where perceived unconditional love can cause massive harm.
The Love I speak here is completly unconditional. Since you don't know what unconditional Love is, as you state above, you don't even know what I'm talking about!

No, he didn't state that. In any case;

Argumentum ad hominem (http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/ad-hominem.html)
Appeal to authority (http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-authority.html)
And an appeal to ignorence.

Sushi!,
Xev

Hey nelson. If I raped your daughter would you still love me.

You live in Canada now right? So I take it you know of Paul Bernardo and Carla, right? If you love them than you've officially entered the realm of so low an intelligence level I previously thought it only reserved for monkeys.

Not chimps, either. Spider mokeys.

Tyler:

So I take it you know of Paul Bernardo and Carla, right?

Who? Sorry.

Dosen't matter though. Usama bin Ladin, Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Augusto Pinochet, Pol Pot, you love them, Nelson?

Sushi!,
Xev

Tyler,

I already said this in another thread and I say it again. No, I honestly don't think I would be able to Love such person unless for some miracle I could ever forgive such person.

I don't know these people.

Love,
Nelson

Why bring up Paul and Carla?

They were just a fun-loving Canadian couple, married at that, that
got their kicks in a somewhat unconventional manner.

Wasn't that big a thing Stateside ... Thanks to Canadian law, not
enough blood and guts to make it to US PrimeTime! Hell, not even
clips of the videotapes they made.

Take care ;)

Then like we've all said, you don't experience unconditional love. Unconditional means exactly that - without conditions. So if the condition of the person being a rapist or torturer makes you unable to love them.

And I would pray that you never forgive karla and paul.


Xev - god-damn americans and your lack of care for canada...

Let me tell you a little story. Karla meets Paul. Karla falls in love with Paul. Karla is a regular woman. Paul is a successful, motivated business man and (as karla says) amazing in bed, one of the things Karla loved in him. They wed. It's a huge, amazing wedding that is picture-perfect. After the marriage, Karla finds out Paul was quite angry that she wasn't a virgin and so he couldn't take her virginity. In such, Paul convinces Karla that it's only logical he should be allowed to take the virginity of Karla's younger sister Tammy. So, Paul rapes Tammy while she's put under (karla worked at a vet's so she had access to the drugs) while Karla videotapes it; because taping something is a logical way to remember a special event. During the rape, Tammy started throwing up. Karla tried to hold her in a way that she would clear her throat, but Tammy choked on her own vomit and died.

Paul had raped many women (11 I believe) and Karla encouraged this kind of act in him, thinking it quite normal and cool. Karla loved him dearly and wanted him to everything that made him happy. And she wanted to do everything that would make him happy (sound a bit like unconditional love there nelson?). Paul now was very angry at Karla, believing she was the reason for Tammy's death. And Tammy, of course, was something he desired greatly. Karla sought out a new way to get Paul excited and soon found Jane, a teenager who kind of looked like Tammy. She invited Jane over to their house, got her to pass out and invited Paul in to see his surprise gift. They each had sex with the girl (videotapping it) and then Paul had his usual brutal anal sex with her. Jane (15), had no idea what happened.

Paul and Karla took a couple more teenage girls willingly for a while before the willingness ended. Eventually, they abducted a girl named Kristen French (16, I believe) and this is where the story gets disgusting. Kristen believed she would survive if she did everything paul demanded of her, so she did. As Karla videotaped, Paul became more and more sadistic in his acts as Kristen kept doing things. Things such as urinating and defecating on her, and eventually killing her (though the killing was not videotaped).

They did this a couple times, though with worse acts involved. Things like pulling out fingernails. Cutting off body parts. Injuring sexual body parts... All while the victim was awake.

That's Paul and Karla.

truthseeker,


I already said this in another thread and I say it again. No, I honestly don't think I would be able to Love such person unless for some miracle I could ever forgive such person.

I don't know these people. I thought you advocated unconditional love. Did I missunderstand you? How could you not love these people if you practice uncondtional love?

Cris

Paul and Karla I tend not to joke about. I don't know why, really, but I don't joke about them very much.

Don't worry, I'm not angry at you for doing so. I believe you should be able to joke about everything.

"Wasn't that big a thing Stateside ... Thanks to Canadian law, not
enough blood and guts to make it to US PrimeTime! Hell, not even
clips of the videotapes they made."

Bah. Americans only consider something large if there's a race issue involved. Anyway, yes, Canadian Law sucked ass on this one. Hey Xev, guess how many years Karla got for her participation in all this? Two 12 year sentances with parole available for good behavior in 6 years.

Know why?

Because the great law system here needed her to testify against Paul to get him a huge sentance. So they let her off easy in return for her testimony. Pretty sweet deal, eh?

And about the videotapes - they were considering burning the tapes. I think that's a horrible idea but it shows how little people want to deal with what these two did.

Tyler: Actually, I heard of the case but I didn't remember the names. Thanks.

And most Americans don't follow American news, let alone Canadian.

Fuck, I would not forgive either. If I was close to any of thier victims, I would hunt that bitch down the second she got out of prision.

But I don't have unconditional love.

There is not a doubt in my mind that if you left me in a room for 30 seconds with either of them I would find a way to kill them. Not because it's the morally right thing to do, but because they are such horrible human beings. In fact, it's morally a wrong thing for me to do (not to mention legally). Wouldn't stop me from doing it. The world would be a slightly better place if they had never existed.

Xev, heard the latest case in great ol' T.O.???


By the way

What is love (love, love, love)......
Baby don't hurt me........
don't hurt me........

Tyler:

Not because it's the morally right thing to do, but because they are such horrible human beings. In fact, it's morally a wrong thing for me to do (not to mention legally). Wouldn't stop me from doing it. The world would be a slightly better place if they had never existed.

I think it would be morally right under certain circumstances.

If Karla's victims had justice denied them because of a point of law, it is okay for me, as a citizen, to avenge thier death.

Of course, I'm not a Canadian citizen.


Xev, heard the latest case in great ol' T.O.???

Nope. Whenever I turn on the news, it is always somthing about the Middle East.

Great, now I am thinking of that routine on SNL.

Baby don't hurt me
No more
What is love
What is love

Sushi!,
Xev

Let me give you a brief break down.

Two art students catch a cat.
Hang it by a power cord.
Slit open it's stomach.
Start skinning the belly.
Stab the cat to a wall.
The tacking to the wall isn't great, so he takes the knife out and does it again.
At this point in the video (they are videotaping this) you hear one person say 'Beautiful, man.'
Another guy; "Doesn't bleed much, does it."
They decide to find the heart.
They stab it in the heart, it falls to the floor.
They start kicking it.
One guy slits the cat right through the chest cavity, sticks his face inside and inhales deeply.
Cat dies.

All in the name of art.

Ugh. I hope that they get thier asses nailed to the wall for that one. Disgusting.

Now that's a scenario where the punishment should mirror the crime. I'm one of those sad brits who just can't abide pet cruelty.

The canadian couple remind me of the wests over here. They killed many young people and buried them out back of their house.

They both went to jail for life and if freds case it was true. He was found hung in his cell some time later. Suicide? maybe not.

I don't know, sick killers... Ya gotta love 'em ?:rolleyes:

Ten months in prison during the trial.

One guy gets 'time served' so goes scott-free (though I never understood this expression. Who exactly is scott? And why does he get off so easily?). Other guy gets 90 days in prison, on weekends, and house arrest.

There will be an appeal. Everyone was extremely confused when we heard the sentance. Every single person in Toronto went; 'What?? Are you kidding?' as we all expected the max jail sentance of 2 and a half years for animal cruelty to be given.

They are also now likely going to up that max to 5 years for future cases.

Sometimes the only way to deal with the horror of being 'human'
is to make light of the madness of this 'intelligent' species.

Something the Jews have known for centuries.

Take care :(

Tyler and Cris,

Posted by Tyler:

Then like we've all said, you don't experience unconditional love. Unconditional means exactly that - without conditions. So if the condition of the person being a rapist or torturer makes you unable to love them.

Posted by Cris:

I thought you advocated unconditional love. Did I missunderstand you? How could you not love these people if you practice uncondtional love?

Since I've never experienced such thing I Love Unconditionally. If I did experience such thing I don't know if I could keep up though. Many sad things already happened with me but as soon as my Love starts to fade my life becomes worse. When I concentrate in my Love again, forgive people, and most important, forgive myself, than, I'm able to fully Love again.

I said once and I say it again. To Love Unconditionally is not easy, but rewardful. I'm not perfect. Sometimes I slip on a banana... :D

Unconditional Love is the Perfection, the goal. ;)

Love,
Nelson

LOVE is the opposite of FEAR


This needs to become the most important concept of the 21st century if our species is to survive.


peace, jandt

This is a good concept... :)

I still don't believe that LOVE has an actual opposite.
But two things that come really close are FEAR and INDIFFERENCE.

Fear is probably the ignorance of Love. As Love drives out Fear...

Indifference is probably the desvalorization of Love.

Somewhat... ;)

Love,
Nelson

ts,

You are unbelievable. You cannot be serious.

It's hard to believe that someone like you exists...

Ah but he does, and we love him, unconditionally. :D

Oh and the opposite of love is hate, I thought everyone knew that. Oh but then you've been having trouble with the whole opposite concept haven't you Nelson

Also love does not drive out fear, tho it can make fear easier to face.

Tata

"Unconditional Love is the Perfection, the goal"

Loving Bernardo is the goal? Okay......
You stick to your goals and I'll stick to reality. To me, loving someone who tortured and raped and tortured and raped over 15 teenage girls is something less than sympathetic to the girls.

Tell the families of these girls that you love Bernardo or that they should love Bernardo and I bet you get slapped.

"Fear is probably the ignorance of Love."

T.S. it appears these examples don't work well with you as you have yet to experience a close relationship. Still, I will try.

You are with your spouse or significant other. Out on the street one night, just for a walk. She walks over to the other side of the street to put something in a garbage can (let's say, oh, a coke). As she gets to the other side and you are away from her, a large man comes along. He holds out a gun at her and begins to rape her.

Are you afraid? Are you not afraid for her?

Could any amount of love erase this fear?

Do you still love this man raping your spouse? Do you go out at him with open arms and say 'friend!'?

If so, good luck finding a spouse.

truthseeker,


It's hard to believe that someone like you exists...Yes I know, although I am not as perfect as you think. I agree with you that I must appear perfect, but I know that I have made one or two mistakes in life. However, you don't have to worship me if you really don't want to.

;) ;) ;)

Cris (nearly perfect)

Since I've never experienced such thing I Love Unconditionally. If I did experience such thing I don't know if I could keep up though.

Yet you're perfectly able to describe in pseudo-babblistic detail that which you have no experience.

Many sad things already happened with me but as soon as my Love starts to fade my life becomes worse.

Let me give you hint: Use your brain for more than something to stick pencils.

When I concentrate in my Love again, forgive people, and most important, forgive myself, than, I'm able to fully Love again.

That would be the perpetual grin, eyes glazed over, brain turned off, lost in a fantasy world kind of love in which you live day to day.

I said once and I say it again. To Love Unconditionally is not easy, but rewardful. I'm not perfect. Sometimes I slip on a banana...

"Truth-I-am-a-contradiction-of-myself-Seeker"

Unconditional Love is the Perfection, the goal.

Whatever you do, don't put that on your resume.

"You can't win 'em all"

Cris your post brings me to an interesting quesiton. What if there is someone who wins 'em all? I have to imagine that somewhere in the world there is someone who, up till now, has won them all. What would the implications of this be? And who would it be? Maybe it's scott from 'he got away scott-free'?


These are the kind of thoughts that are gonna keep me from high society.

Well, after the posts I read here I would say that I am egocentric, selfish and viloent as people say....

And I still proclaim Unconditional Love to the world, peace for people, and harmony...

That's why the world is like that...

Brain is more important then Love and peace...

I'm TruthSpeaker (as a friend pointed out... ;))

truthseeker,


Brain is more important then Love and peace... A balance between them is more appropriate.

Look for the word balance in Tao writings, it is very common.

People are very different from each other and so conflicts are always likely to be present. Perfect peace is never likely to occur.

Love is good, enjoy it when it occurs, don't overly seek it because that causes stress and frustration when it cannot be found. When love occurs it is effortless, natural and quite beautiful, and unmistakable. Don't analyse it because that may well destroy it.

The intellect can guide you to find both peace and love. Use them all to make yourself a complete individual. But find the balance between them. Each on its own is incomplete.

Cris

Cris,


A balance between them is more appropriate.

Yes... but you definatly DON'T have it...


People are very different from each other and so conflicts are always likely to be present. Perfect peace is never likely to occur.

Unless Love is Unconditional and EVERYONE has it for EVERYONE...


Love is good, enjoy it when it occurs, don't overly seek it because that causes stress and frustration when it cannot be found. When love occurs it is effortless, natural and quite beautiful, and unmistakable. Don't analyse it because that may well destroy it.

Again, as I said before, you mix Love with love.
love is projected in an object.
Love is the one you have within yourself. It's love in the pure form.
Analizing Love rationally is worthless as it goes waaaaay beyond rational thinking.
Analizing love rationally is common since Plato. And it's still done in Modern Psychology...


The intellect can guide you to find both peace and love. Use them all to make yourself a complete individual. But find the balance between them. Each on its own is incomplete.

I agree...

"The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithul servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift."

Albert Einstein

As I said before, our society supervalorizes rational thinking in detriment of intuitive thinking, which basis is Love...

Love,
Nelson

"Unless Love is Unconditional and EVERYONE has it for EVERYONE..."

Will never happen. It goes against human nature. Has never happened, will never happen.


"As I said before, our society supervalorizes rational thinking in detriment of intuitive thinking, which basis is Love.."

intuition is actually instincts. which are chemical. and can be easily logically figured out in evolution.

Unless Love is Unconditional and EVERYONE has it for EVERYONE...

That's scheduled to happen right after my torrid affair with Russel Crowe...:rolleyes:


As I said before, our society supervalorizes rational thinking in detriment of intuitive thinking, which basis is Love...

Certainly not modern American society! American society is decidedly irrational! As is what I've seen of Canadian society...dunno about Brazilian.

"That's scheduled to happen right after my torrid affair with Russel Crowe..."

I'll 'Gladiate' him if he tries anything.....

--hate is the opposite of like, not love--

Love is the opposite of Fear

Love is the absence of Fear

One could not exist without the other. One could not be known without the other.

Fear is the original condition. Love allows for the opportunity to resolve the paradoxes created by existing in our fear based
reality.

John Lennon said it best, "All you need is Love"


peace, jandt

Tyler,


intuition is actually instincts. which are chemical. and can be easily logically figured out in evolution.

Actually... intuition and instinct are different words becuase they have different meaning... ;)

Love,
Nelson

Nelson
Actually... intuition and instinct are different words becuase they have different meaning...



And on he talked
And the wonder grew
That one small head
Could hold all that it knew:rolleyes:

Xev
"That's scheduled to happen right after my torrid affair with Russel Crowe..."


Tyler
I'll 'Gladiate' him if he tries anything.....

You may not need to Tyler I just saw some early pics of him in a raunchy Gay scene in a film some years ago.
(There are some things ya just can't act. Know what I mean? :eek: )

Sorry Xev

I'll 'Gladiate' him if he tries anything.....

Sorry dear. I'll go back to "That's scheduled to happen right after there is peace in the middle east".

Really Bbcboy? My my my.

jandt:

--hate is the opposite of like, not love--

Love is the opposite of Fear

Love is the absence of Fear

One could not exist without the other. One could not be known without the other.

Fear is the original condition. Love allows for the opportunity to resolve the paradoxes created by existing in our fear based
reality.

John Lennon said it best, "All you need is Love"

I am beginning to sound like a broken record...:rolleyes:

Do you have any evidence?

Originally posted by bbcboy

There are some things ya just can't act. Know what I mean? :eek:

Hey, Crowe is straight. It's just that we Kiwis and Aussies know how to shake it when there's money on the table. Anything for a dollar.

So what would you do for a dollar Adam? (Strictly in the realms of research you understand :D )

A dollar gets you 'alf an hour in tha booth, Mista! You pay up front or I'll call the guvner!

But what do we do for the other 25 minutes:p

Love is dead. Love is merely a perversion of mankind's primordial drive to reproduce. Disease and the need for protection in prehistoric times drove the species to adopt the concept of manogamy.

Love isn't dead. There is still a physical need for it, and due to the way its been idealized - a psycological need also. Everyone here, though debating what it is, wants to be loved. Because of natural drives and now long ingrained social ideals.

Love isn't dead, no matter how we can rationalize it and understand what it is through science.

I agree with Cactus... :)

But it's hard to rationalize Love (if not impossible, at all)... there's a great limitation on that... ;)

Love,
Nelson

For once dude, I think we are in total argeement.

Hey, nother interesting idea for everyone to ponder. Due to the effects on the brain, actions, and certain chemical imbalances - some scientist belive love a type of mental condition liken to insanity.

Hey, nother interesting idea for everyone to ponder. Due to the effects on the brain, actions, and certain chemical imbalances - some scientist belive love a type of mental condition liken to insanity.

Ha ha ha! Yes, sounds about right. But have you got a link?


XTC, The Man Who Murdered Love

I'm the man who murdered love
Yeah, what do you think to that?
I'm the man who murdered love
Yeah, what do you think to that?

He was begging on his bended knee
For me to put him from his misery
He hadn't worked at all this century
Said I'd do a job for all humanity

I put a bullet in his sugar head
He thanked me kindly
then he layed down dead
Phoney roses blossomed where he bled
Then all the cheering angels shook my
hand and said

I'm the man who murdered love
Yeah, what do you think to that?
I'm the man who murdered love
Yeah, what do you think to that?

Oh it's the middle of the song
I'm guilty, I'm guilty, I'm guilty
And then I turned and said

There'll be no more pain
from broken hearts
And no more lovers to be torn apart
Before you throw me
in your dungeon dark
Your honour, they'll be putting statues up
In every park

So dear public I'm here to confess
That I'm the one who freed us from this mess
Love won't be calling at your adress
'Cause what you never had you never miss,
I guess

I'm the man who murdered love
Yeah, what do you think to that?
I'm the man who murdered love
Yeah, what do you think to that?

If you never, ever use it
You know you're gonna lose it
If you never, ever kiss it
How you ever gonna miss it?

Or, in the immortal words of Laleen of the t.v show Lexx:
"Love leaks puke juice" :p

Love is NOT mental insanity. Lack of it is what is completly mental insanity. How can someone live without Love?

NEEDS, in oder hand, can surely cause mental insanity. Need is commonly mistaken by love...

Love,
Nelson

First...... Awesome quote Xev, that's the stuff. Second, sorry I don't have a link - it was a Discovery Channel show entitled something like "Enraveling Love's Mysteries" Or "The Science of Love", Yeah I'm fairly sure the last one's it.

Sorry ~ Cactus

Originally posted by TruthSeeker
Love is NOT mental insanity. Lack of it is what is completly mental insanity. How can someone live without Love?

NEEDS, in oder hand, can surely cause mental insanity. Need is commonly mistaken by love...

If you can't live without something, isn't it a need?

No prob, Cactus. I'll do some googling.

Nelson:

Love is NOT mental insanity.

Oh yes it is. Quite close.


Lack of it is what is completly mental insanity. How can someone live without Love?

No, the lack of love is not insane, not in the clinical sense.

One can, but it is not human nature to do so. However, one can attempt to vanquish such desires.

Great is he who can vanquish the need for love.

Cactus: Here's another one, I love that band:

The disappointed
All shuffle round in circles
Their placards look the same
With a picture and a name
Of the ones who broke their hearts
The disappointed
All congregate at my house
Their voices sob with grief
That they want to be chief
Of the tribe with broken hearts
Once, I had no sympathy
For those destroyed and thrown away by love
Seems, your ring upon my finger
Signifies that I've become the spokesman of...
The disappointed
Will bear me on their shoulders
To a secret shadow land
Where a sombre marching band
Plays a tune for broken hearts
And day grows darker now
Everywhere, everywhere
The disappointed
Are coming in their millions
They're spilling from the bus
At a monument to us
Made of bits of broken heart
The disappointed
Are growing every second
They blot the sun to black
At the bottom of the pack
I'm the king of broken hearts

Awesome. Thanx Xev.

I could live without love.
Without sex? Not a chance. Without love? Sure, if there's enough sex and intelligent conversation.

NO sex is not the most important thing, its companionship and surport.

Oh and intelegent conversation, i can't belive how many stupid people there are in our world

Without love? Sure, if there's enough sex and intelligent conversation.

Me too, my problem is:

Give me sex and intelligent conversation, and I will fall in love.

Stupid, I know.

Sure thing, Cactus.

Gotta disagree, Asguard. Sex is waaaaaay more important than companionship.

Friendship is nice, though. Luckily, sex is compatible with friendship.

The world would really, really suck if it wasn't.

I agree with that and i never said sex is not important but its not the most important thing (i mean if thats all theres allways your hand!)

Always your hand eh? Bah, that's obviously spoken from someone currently with a sexual partner.

that was surpost to be sort of joking but oh well

Look if lust is all your after call a pro

Me i much prefer love

I'm not sure that love can be achieved on the mortal plane that we now live upon. Perhaps a feeling of mutual trust and lust but not love like the media sensationally calls it. Love is held back until the afterlife whatever that may be.

Cactus,


If you can't live without something, isn't it a need?
Love IS life...

Xev,


Great is he who can vanquish the need for love.

Love is within you. You project your Love in someone else. When you do that, you are likely to created a need and an attachment unless you can control it. This need is what creates insanity.

Great is he who can find Love in his Heart.


Tyler,


Without sex? Not a chance. Without love? Sure, if there's enough sex and intelligent conversation.

See? love as you know, sexual attraction, is a NEED. Love in the Essential meaning is Life Itself! You just proved that you have a NEED instead of Love...


Xev,


Give me sex and intelligent conversation, and I will fall in love.


Sex is waaaaaay more important than companionship.


Friendship is nice, though. Luckily, sex is compatible with friendship.

I don't even need to comment, do I?


Asguard,

Totally agree with you!! :)
temporary_illusion is lucky! :)


Robeson,

It's incredible, but Love is possible to be achieved through self-awareness. That's because when you become more self-aware, you find Love in Its Essence in your own Heart... :);)

If you project It, you get away from this Essential Love and find this "common" love we have in our society. Most people project their Love. That's why we have this love in our society, as it's widely promoted.

Love,
Nelson

Well, I believe love exists, but I'm a complete dumb-arse about these things.

Adam,


Well, I believe love exists, but I'm a complete dumb-arse about these things.

Nahhhh... YOU are not... :);)

Love,
Nelson

Starman,


Love is dead. Love is merely a perversion of mankind's primordial drive to reproduce. Disease and the need for protection in prehistoric times drove the species to adopt the concept of manogamy.Well love is not dead yet.

And love is not a perversion but it is certainly a result of the evolutionary process that has helped man survive.

The human race is still largely primitive since it is still essentially controlled by high levels of emotionalism and sexual instincts.

As we adapt and improve ourselves through science and technology I’m sure many will choose to be free from largely irrational emotions including the claustrophobic desires to seek love and sex.

Human evolution is on the verge of moving from a random process to one of informed choices. Increases in intelligence will lead to a natural desire to be free of primordial evolutionary instincts and emotions.

Increasing independence of the individual and decreased needs for relationships will gradually change the culture and nature of human society. Love is likely to have a limited future.

IMHO of course.

Cris

"See? love as you know, sexual attraction, is a NEED. Love in the Essential meaning is Life Itself! You just proved that you have a NEED instead of Love.."

Sex is love? You obviously haven't experienced either.

Sex and love may be different things, but it rocks when the two are with the same person.

Agreed!

Nelson:

I don't even need to comment, do I?

I presume that that means: "Yes Xev, you are absolutly right! As usual, you have hit the nail on the head with your wisdom, intelligence and superior understanding!" :p


Great is he who can find Love in his Heart.

Great is he who can vanquish need.

Adam: You may be a bit of a moron in these matters, but I prefer your stupidity over my cynicism.

Tyler:

Sex is love? You obviously haven't experienced either.

Ooooh! That's harsh.

But yes, Nelson, sex and love are two different things.

And Adam is right.

Tyler,


Sex is love? You obviously haven't experienced either.
Oh God... have you read the difference between "love" and "Love"...? :rolleyes:

I've experienced and still experience one of them...


Xev,


I presume that that means: "Yes Xev, you are absolutly right! As usual, you have hit the nail on the head with your wisdom, intelligence and superior understanding!"

No. It means that it's not worth commenting such thing...


Great is he who can vanquish need.

I have to agree with that... but even air we need, eh...?

No. It means that it's not worth commenting such thing...

Oh! So it is even better than that! It means:

"WOW! Xev's posts are so utterly brilliant that I can't even comment on them, becuase I lack the knowledge of superlatives! Xev is truely the greatest mind ever to grace Sciforums, or really any internet forum. We should all send her all of our money, because she is so great and wonderfull and brilliant and witty!"

Thanks Nelson! :D


I have to agree with that... but even air we need, eh...?

Maybe you need air, but I do not.

Xev,

... :rolleyes:


Maybe you need air, but I do not.

So... stop breathing! :D:D:D

Love,
Nelson

So... stop breathing!

I'm not breathing now.

I prefer not to breathe, but some people notice when I am not breathing. So generally, when I am at home, I don't breathe. When in public, I do.

Originally posted by Xev

Adam: You may be a bit of a moron in these matters, but I prefer your stupidity over my cynicism.

I was a complete cold-blooded cynical bastard about these things. Maybe you could just take a chance on someone. Might be you'll get entirely screwed over as everyone else has been many times. But you might find a decent chap/girl/interdimensional-hellbeasty some time.

I was a complete cold-blooded cynical bastard about these things. Maybe you could just take a chance on someone.

No, see, that's where we differ. I am "rather unlovable" as Raymond Shaw put it.

But my real purpose of posting:

I'm STILL not breathing. Dosen't anyone want to learn how?

You're a zombie?

NO! I don't need to breathe! And neither do you!

Yeah, but I'm a zombie.

BRAINNNNNZZZZZZZZZ.............BRAINZZZZZZZZZZ.... ......BRAINZZZ

So, if not the zombie thing, what is your mysterious secret?

It's....MAGIC!

Piffle! Me gots gooder magic than yoo!

Either Xev has lost the plot completely, or she's drunk, or she's under the influence of something not entirely legal, or I have completely missed something rather important (not to mention earth shaking).

I am completely aware that Lovecraftian "Thingys" may not have been completely human, but setting aside the idea that you may have developed gills or similar Xev, please explain?

And PLEASE dont start quoting from a James Redfield text... I dont think I could stand it.

OMG... I'm missing "Mars Attacks" on TV... Please excuse me... :D

Originally posted by Tyler
"See? love as you know, sexual attraction, is a NEED. Love in the Essential meaning is Life Itself! You just proved that you have a NEED instead of Love.."

Sex is love? You obviously haven't experienced either.


Hahahahahahaha :D.

And my magic is the greatest for I learnt the dark arts from my allmighty master......... Mickey Mouse. I have the blue pointed star hat and everything to prove it. Yes I know, you can all start groveling now. :D

DAK-DAK!! DAK!! DAK-DAK-DAK-DAK!!!


DAK!!

Xev was under the influence of an all-nighter and nine cups of coffee....maybe more. :p

Love is mother natures way of keeping two parents together until their children are raised to the age where only one parent is necessary for the childrens upbringing.



Tom

Prosoothus,

And before they have children? :D
Which age are you talking about?

TruthSeeker,

"And before they have children?"

Your genetic code doesn't know if you have children or not, it just assumes you do if you've been with your partner for a while.

"Which age are you talking about?"

Between the age of 5 and 10.

Tom

Damn my alcohol problem. Sometimes it's embarrassing to wake up the next morning and discover you've written martian comments all over a perfectly good thread. :eek: :D :o

Allright, another idea from the same show as the insanity concept. Many couples are found to get "bored" with each other and break up in around the three year mark. Researchers believe this is because the time period is enough to concieve, bare, and nuture a child to the point of walking and being able to eat on its own.

I have a new thought on Love. It is a biological, Phsycological thing that has been integrated into human culture. We must learn to deal with it as it is, not as some mystical force. Love cannot break all bounds, only are believe that it can can makes us do things we didn't have the courage to.

(I am still a hopless romantic though, can't help it)

Welcome to realism! No offense or anything, but that ain't a new idea!

And nothing wrong with being a romantic!

I don't even comment on that...
You all know I don't agree...

Originally posted by Tyler
Welcome to realism! No offense or anything, but that ain't a new idea!

And nothing wrong with being a romantic!

Yeah I know its nothing new, but I think some people over look all three aspects some times and are left with....... I guess a rather dissmal opinion of love once they begin to rationalize it. And even if I do rationalize it I can still be a romantic, but then again, that's something I can't help.

And I know you don't agree Nelson, but do you seriously believe Love can do anything, even the completely impossible? - Wait I know the answer to that, I just wanna know why you feel that way.

A book indication for you:

"The Mastery of Love"
by Don Miguel Ruiz

Love,
Nelson

Thanx, I shall get my hands on a copy.

The Science of Love - by Anthony Walsh.

Very good, I highly recommend it. A biological/social/ and Phsycological view of love.

Originally posted by Xev

The Love I speak here is completly unconditional. Since you don't know what unconditional Love is, as you state above, you don't even know what I'm talking about!

No, he didn't state that. In any case;

Argumentum ad hominem (http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/ad-hominem.html)
Appeal to authority (http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-authority.html)
And an appeal to ignorence.

Sushi!,
Xev [/QUOTE]

I see you did phil 137, or at least a phil subject about critical thinking, or argument or something.. hehe i did it too!! w00t!

though, does anyone belive that marriage in 'western' is still valid? I predict it will fade, as we become more and more secularised, we move away from traditional thiinking.. agree?