Today I noticed something very interesting...

Have you ever noticed that highly gifted people are usually said to be crazy and are hugely misunderstood? Have you noticed how Mozart, Beethoven and many others have such a hard and complex life? And Van Gogh, Camille Claudel, many others... many of them finished in mad houses... why?

Are they really crazy or we are crazy? How a crazy person can oaint beautifull things or compose amazing pieces? Haven't we misjudged them? If they are genius, then who are the crazy ones?

Maybe they were right...

Let's see... it's written in the Bible...
Isaiah 55:8,9
"8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts. "

1 Corinthians 3:19
"19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness."

Maybe they knew God... who else would give them their gifts? But the world could not understand them...

John 14:17
"17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. "

1 John 3:1
"1 Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not. "

Maybe they knew God... Maybe that's why "we" cannot understand them... :eek:

Any thoughts?

Edit: Oh shit... I pushed the button for a pool and it didn't worked...:mad:
*sight...
Anyways...:(

There is a very blurred line between madness and genius. Some ancient cultures believed madmen to be gifts from the gods. I am in no position to deny this claim.

The best of us often do not function well in society. It seemes one can either do great things or function well, but not both.

Aah... to be a blessed lunatic. It would be a curse to one's self and a gift to the rest of the world.

I guess they (...or we...:rolleyes:... I'm a pianist... :( ) don't function well on society because society wasn't designed to give the world great things, but rather just to work as pieces of a machinery. I often fell like a slave of this society as all the work that is avaiable for me to do is extremely mechanical and repetitive with no space for me to be creative and be always changing...

Everyone just work everyday doing the very same thing for what...? It makes no sense... Maybe someone should use his/her genius to design a better system...

We designed a system so bad that our best people often dies or get nuts because of it... :eek:

I think our system don't work very well because it limits to much oneself... And also, specialization is a pretty big problem as it makes the everyday life extremely repetitive...

But I have no idea how to solve those problems... :(

The real culprit of insanity is society its self. The general population has very distinct ideas about what is "normal" and anything beyond that is frightening. Anyone that doesn't fit in with "normal" people is strange, insane, stupid, devient among many other discriptions people use. It seems that most people are so concerned with fitting in and being "normal" that they don't stop to think that there is no such thing. I almost feel sorry for people that consider themselves normal because they spend their entire life searching for something they will never find because it doesn't exist. I don't mind being called strange or weird at all. Why should I? To the general public it's true. However I get very angry when people say I'm crazy because it's not true. I tend to think of crazy people being criminally insane, otherwise we're just harmless excentrics that only disturb those of mediocre thought.

I'd rather be extraordinary than normal, and would trade changing people's lives for the better through some artistic means for dying in an asylum.

I don't know what it is, but ever since the latter grades in elementary school I've had this...reputation, I don't know...of being intelligent, and sometimes if I do badly or less than average on any assignment people will act surprised, a few weeks ago one person was shocked with my grade in my insanely hard honors bio class and shouted: "but you're a genius!"

But the bottom line is that if I were a genius I would get straight A's in school instead of B's and C's. I might have thought that I was a genius when I was extremely naive, I think my very very early posts here reflect this. I may know a few historical facts and I may be able to spell and write but that all makes no difference if there's nothing tangible behind the letters. I can't stand people saying that I'm smart because it reminds me every single time that I'm really not and that for whatever reason they can't identify this fact as well as I can.

But the word genius is just not a good word for our society. Genius implies that someone knows everything about anything, I think the part Brendan Frasier played in Bedazzled (which was, btw, a pretty bad movie but nontheless funny) displayed this pretty readily, with his intelligent character speaking paragraphs about wines or tablecloths or whatever. If you're going to call someone a genius, say that they're a genius with an instrument of some sort (not just musical). Call it political (Hitler), Musical (Mozart), Written Word (Dostoevsky, JD Salinger), or what have you, but don't just call someone a genius without attaching the appropriate adjective.

Now where were we...? Yeah...genius' who go nuts.

Well, I guess I'd have to say that they weren't that smart if they didn't manage to hold onto their sanity, maybe it's just because I can't empathize with them that I don't understand....

Billy Corgan IS a genius. i kid you not.

and, did you guys realize there is a fine, fine..very fine line between genius and insanity...?

Pollux V,


Well, I guess I'd have to say that they weren't that smart if they didn't manage to hold onto their sanity, maybe it's just because I can't empathize with them that I don't understand....

The point of the thread is to ask wheter we are "sane" or they are "sane". If they were genius, how could they be not "sane". Have it ever came to you that you might be the "insane" one? :D

Maybe what we call "sane" and "normal", is actually what we think as "insane"... and vice-versa... :eek:


pumpkinsaren'torange,


and, did you guys realize there is a fine, fine..very fine line between genius and insanity...?

Yup.... I guess it is because it is hard to be different... I guess those people that have so much talent actually know what the reality is... that's why they have their power. I kinda think that "we" are the insane ones...

Is it fair to say that the minority is the one to hold the keys of change? I was just thinking about this the other night:

If you think about anything that has 'mutated,' you might find that there is a good chance that the creation will be stronger..The oddball is the origin of the society. (society being any flourishing group of germ, plant, and animal..human)

That might be a strange way of looking at it..

I think there are very many oddballs in our society! :) Maybe the ones that have the ability to make themselves practical are the ones we call genius?

Just a thought...or two

What I call genius is people that stand up against the system. They go against it and try to change it so that they can fit in, instead of try to adjust to the system as the huge majority of people do... They usually express themselves in the arts... They can learn very fast... probably because their brains can do more connections in a smaller amount of time then the average. It's not about the amount of knowledge, but rather, how easy it is something to be learnt. It's the potential that matters, not the active... that's what I think a genius is... I guess...

and: have you considdered that it's not so genious at all to remember (or learn) things in a fast way.

I say it's genious if you'd manage to live your life according to your own principles, to manage even that is hard to do for some.

and last: what makes people geniouses is this: the appraise they get from people,...

if you can conquer yourself, that's genious
If someone realizes that matter is energy and that mind is above matter, that's genious.

Peace, fukushi

Yeah... I garee with you. :) But learn fast might be considered a form of genius. If you learn fast also means that you can learn more... ;)

However, I would say that a true genius person is one that knows oneself and overcomes his/her own limits. I don't think most people really know themselves and even less that they overcome their difficulties (like smoking or drinking or whatever...)...

I was reading an article about bobby fischer the greatest chess player of all time who throughout his time played chess, alone, up to 14hrs a day and had little or no education in any other areas. Although he was considered a genius he is also insanely paranoid ie who refuses to attend courts because they are ran by jews and believes that his filings have tracking devices in them and has so had them all removed.
But it was laing who devised the idea that schizophrenics are not crazy merley their schizophrenia is a reaction to a crazy world in which they cannot tolerate. Perhaps we are the crazy ones....looking at aspects of culture deemed normal i would tend to agree with this.

"there is nothing wrong with the world today...whats wrong is our way of looking at it." Henry Miller

?I think he said that back in the 50's or something....lol.

I'm a writer and whenever I'm seriously, really writing
I am crazy. I am mean to my mother; I don't see anyone,
I have mystical, cosmic vibrations and a sense of urgency about
random stuff. Then all of a sudden one day I have 70 pages of
quality work and I realize there is a whole world out there.
Then I'm kind of timid for awhile (since I haven't talked to anybody
in a month.) But during my writing time I can't stand anybody;
and whatever they say becomes text somehow, and fiction.
real life and fake life just corrode each other into one imaginary
world. is this crazy, I wonder, or is it just work?

always:o

Awesome Thread!!!! I dug it up from far below!!!

I have been told I am crazy, nuts, insane, and other words of misunderstanding throughout my entire life. Let's see...it started in kindergarten and continued up into high school. College and the Uni where a little different, because I learned how to blend in more. Then I come up with some strange new discovery that is damn near impossible for anyone to understand and I am called crazy!?!

Well...at least not everyone jumps to conclusions and most often those who do change their minds after some time. Even my parents and my wife have said that I am a little...well say, unusual.

But no one on earth has been able to tell me what it is I invented/discovered and exactly how it works. And until I can get a clear answer I can't take anyone's claims that I am crazy seriously, if they can't tell me about my work...who are they to make a Judgment?

I'll check up on this more later!!!

I know how you mean...I tested as gifted in first year. I'm also very ASDish though. I often think people are being sarcastic when they're not, and I take things far too seriously.

I am very unpredictable myself. I might take everything serious one minute and laugh about it all the next. I do see a connection between madness and genius,
too much knowledge and awareness ungrounded can drive on over. I am constantly trying to keep myself grounded.

It gets better...because I can see energy that other people cannot. I have discovered how it can be done in a reproduce-able scientific approach. If you do it...you see it...end of story. And if you keep it up...well issues of craziness are bound to be asked.

Visceral Instinct,
I do not think you are crazy or sane. I think everyone on earth is crazy and sane to an extent. The madness and stabilization come and go in waves. Do you know anyone who would remain sane if they underwent massive trauma. Under the right circumstances anyone can lose it. If someone is a little unusual, then there are usually good chances that they can endure more trauma then those who have had easy lives giving to them.

If you put it that way, yea I think I'm crazy.. :p

There's no good standard definition of "crazy." But if it means "exceptionally unreasonable"... remember that reasonable people do things that have a high probability of succeeding, and therefore all progress depends on the work of unreasonable people.

If it means simply "insane," well the current fashionable definition of "insanity" is: continuing to do things the same way you've always done them, but expecting different results.

Taking the first definition, you should be proud that you're crazy. Taking the second one, you should be proud that you're not. :)

Edison tried several thousand different materials for the incandescent light filament, before he hit on ideal one (tungsten). By almost anyone's definition such dedication is insane. Had he failed, he'd be remembered as a lunatic (if remembered at all). The difference is, he succeeded.

I think the concept "sane" simply means "conforming to societal norms." A normal, well-adjusted Roman citizen would be considered psychotic today, and a normal, well-adjusted Roman slave even more so.

I am a clinical therapist at a mental hospital and I deal with patients labeled "mentaly disabled" on a day to day basis....A great deal of them are extremely intelligent and are very insightful and intuitive when they are in control.

However its when they lose control that their "mental disability" becomes an issue....A analogy I like to use is that they are like a professional pitcher who can throw 100mph fastballs but has a trick shoulder......

Their ability to function in society is hindered by their "mental disability"......refer back to the analogy I used and society = world series baseball game and the "mental disability" = trick shoulder.

I sometimes wonder if its just society that is the problem but i assume combating "mental disability" is much easier than changing society which is why things are the way they are.

As far as the terms "crazy" and "sane" they are just definitions and as such they are relative to he who is "defining" the "label"

Having said that.....you could conclude that the majority of society would rather label others crazy when the social norm is not met......Its rare you find a person who questions their own sanity when their percieved social norm isn't met by another person.

Social norm is not about right or wrong, good way or bad way of living.....its just what has been commonly accepted by the masses. If you dont get in line and conform you risk being crazy ;)

Well, i could play all sorts of peices at a very young age... such as the Flight of the Bumblebee, Piano Concerto no. 1, Vivaldi's Four Seasons, Debussy's 2nd Arabesque... ect ect... Therego, the way i see it, is that such gifts can be attributed to the God JHVH, however, or they are merely products that certain individuals can perform...

Its rare you find a person who questions their own sanity when their percieved social norm isn't met by another person.I still remember that episode of Star Trek:TNG, in which Dr. Crusher, faced with inexplicable and counterintuitive phenomena, uttered the classic line:

"Well let's see. I know there's nothing wrong with ME, so there must be something wrong with the UNIVERSE."

Of course that was a TV show and it turned out she was right. :(

I've found strong individuals are often considered "crazy" or whatever.

my thoughts are that it's not really necessary to quote the bible in something like this.

I believe that society is the insane one. Looking at people who spend their lives in deadend jobs with no goals or aspirations in life living a pointless existence.
I'm regularly called weird and indeed a genius at school and I don't care what anyone else from ''standard society'' says because they just don't understand or care, the latter being what worries me the most. The fact that society does not want to change and that people are becoming more and more institutionalised by their ways of life and failing to see the bigger picture.
Of course the world obviously can't all be gifted, as condescending and totalitarian as it is, the world has to have lesser, unispired ''drones'' to do menial jobs and tasks.
There is no argument in saying there are some geniuses and a world filled with stupid people, the argument comes when deciding which category you fall into...

Barry

Well there are some perfectly stupid people capable of being "self-sufficient". I've got a picture of the hicks from "deliverance" in my head here...