View Full Version : Why are we? Who are we? What do we want?
Aren't these the questions mankind have been asking since the dawn of religion?
There are many brilliant minds here at the forums, and i wondered if you would help me to try to answer them..
Are the answers subjective to ones feelings and thoughts of the day? Or is there a collective answer that might bring us one step closer to realize who mankind is, and why we are here on earth?
12-08-99, 03:50 PM
H-Kon, yes, I think these questions are basically the FOUNDATION of religion! Religion seems to exist in order to answer these questions. Three cheers, I like this question!
I think the answers you're going to get are going to be dependant on the answerer's religious beliefs. (okay, that was pretty obvious. So shoot me! :) )
I think I'm most interested in what Searcher's answer will be - what do you say, Searcher?? What have you found over your years of research?
Personally, I think we are just another type of animal - instead of really sharp claws and super-vision or something, we got brains. We are the analytical beasts, but we are still beasts. Asking why we are here...why are birds and lions and dung beetles here? We are part of the ecology, part of the world. What do we want...well, that's different from person to person. I don't know if there's a desire common to everyone in our species. Not all of us wish to procreate, not all of us care about the environment... I think maybe 'to be loved' would be the one of the few desires that most of the denizens of this human society will agree to. That is one thing that will cross any cultural, economic, racial, or social boundary. That's the only one I can think of off the top of my head, anyway. But, I think individuality is one of the greatest strengths our species has going for it.
12-08-99, 07:31 PM
As usual I liked what Skye Blue said, but I'm more into a 'what if?' type of explanation.
I'm just going to roll with this one!
you ask, why are we? hmmm, ok, what if our ultimate purpose was to evolve into an organic interface for the universe. I'm talking about the universe having a conciousness and us being able to connect with it. Enabling us to view things through the wise eyes of the universe and enabling the universe to have a macro lens view of all the tiny workings in our vicinity. It's like, the universe will suddenly become aware of us. And it will become conscious of yet another little part of itself.I guess what I'm trying to say is that maybe the universe uses its highly intelligent lifeforms which have evolved to this point and who are scattered around time, to act as its sensors so to speak.
Who are we? I think we are travellers;
I think we, as a species behave like parasites, eating up planets and moving on. The trouble is, only a chosen few manage to leave a doomed planet each time, so consequently the technology is eventually lost and we have to start from scratch, once we do colonise a fresh planet.
What do we want? every thing under the sun!
tabla-- You're post is one of the most intelligent things I've read here in a while. I'm glad to see that someone else has a broad enough scope to see the simplicity in quesitons like this. Don't you find it funny when people ask "is the universe alive?" Well, yes, of course it is. Does shit stink? Life is the living universe. As for anything more than this, it's always fun to guess.
Thank you all for answering so far. Glad you like this thread :)
To add a little bit more to this i have 1 more question:
Will we find the answer to the above questions through technological research, or is the answer to be found within the spiritual realm from within us?
This sure makes my braincells work :) I'll post my take on it a little later :)
12-09-99, 11:31 AM
I think technological research will reach a point where even scientists will be confused by the dividing line between the material and the spiritual.But once scientists begin to pose the right kind of questions, they may just come up with new mathematical formulae to 'prove' the existence of various phenomena which may be considered 'paranormal' at the present time.
I think imaginative, deep thinking individuals have always and will always be able to touch upon interesting ideas that are unacceptable to the scientific establishment of the day. But the ironic thing which I have noticed in myself and others lately is that as more of us become lay scientists through the popular media and computers, some of our new spiritual ideas are beginning to make some kind of scientifically feasible sense, even though we can't back up our claims with a bunch of numbers.
As far as attaining our evolutionary goal goes, I think we've got a lot of evolving to do yet, baby!
12-09-99, 11:49 AM
I think any idea that is way ahead of it's time will be percieved as a magickal or supernatural thing.
I was just pondering this last night - take an ordinary Bic lighter back to the 1300's, and you'd be a magician all of a sudden. Perhaps that is the same thing with Nostradamus' predictions, perhaps he was just an unusually early prototype of what's in our evolutionary future. From a current standpoint, he was an amazing prophet. From the future standpoint, perhaps all of us (meaning future generations) will be able to tap into that part of our brains at will and he will just seem to be amazingly early, not just amazing in his own right. Did that make any sense?
I have carried certain ideas around with me my whole life, and considered them to be 'new' and 'fresh' and 'unique'. But now I have begun to study Old Religions - Paganism, withcraft, shamanism... My ideas aren't new at all! They've been around for centuries and centuries. But I didn't know that when I "invented" them myself. This makes me think that maybe there really IS some kind of data stored in our DNA that just isn't accessable by our concious brains. My discoveries have made me just recently decide to follow witchcraft. If if worked for all those other people that held the same beliefs as I, then perhaps it will work for me as well...
I agree with Tab' and JMitch, YES! The universe is alive! I believe in a general life-force that permeates the entire universe. We are animated by that same life force, just as all the other animals, alien life, and even the stars and comets. Stars have lives - they are born, they burn their fuel, they get old and weak, they die. Just like humans do. Just like whole galaxies do. Just like individual cells do. All are basically the same thing, just made of different substances, and existing on different scales.
12-10-99, 04:28 PM
-I believe in a general life-force that permeates the entire universe. We are animated by that same life force, just as all the other animals, alien life, and even the stars and comets.-
Yes, I agree with that, absolutely!
In my mind, the life force is like an invisible light which continually sweeps through the universe, at a speed faster than light. It is like string. Its source is at the beginning of time itself and it connects every single thing, including time (past/present/future) as each lifeform has its own share of the light within it.
The invisible light enters a life form at the moment of conception. The lifeform lives its physical life and dies, the invisible light then leaves the physical plane, hurtles through space, is re energised and goes on to give new life somewhere in the cosmos, most probably near the place it was at before.
During its life, the lifeform acquires an invisible aura, containing information which is an accumilation of all its thoughts, deeds, needs, wishes and actions. This aura is actually existing in the invisible light and is therefore 'outside of time'.
Auras exchange their information with each other continually and I believe play a crucial role in phenomena such as wish fulfilments, the power of prayer, affective curses, divination, prophecy, karma, reincarnation and evolution to name but a few.
I suppose what I've been describing could also be called the 'spirit'.
12-10-99, 04:51 PM
Man, you and I really are made of the same stuff!! (pun intended ;) )
I think we're percieving the same thing, you see it as invisible light, I feel it as something akin to electricity, but I think it's the exact same thing.
These ancient scholars knew about it too. And without the advanced physics and technology that we have today. This indicates to me that while science certainally CAN find the answers, that's not the only way to do it.
Until next time, may the force be with you! (wink, wink)
12-10-99, 11:37 PM
I'm flattered that you're interested in my ideas, but I'm afraid that you and Tab have already outdone me here! :) My feelings are almost identical to what the two of you have been saying in this thread, but I think of the life force of the universe as energy, more than invisible light or electricity. But I agree that we're all perceiving the same basic thing!
Great replies people :) Thank you for sharing :)
I feel just about the same as the rest of you on this matter. I couldn't have written it better myself tablariddim/SkyeBlue/Searcher/JMitch :)
So.. after reading this thread and thinking for a little while, it seems like we ( those that replied in this thread atleast)are starting to come up with common answer, feeling, thought about these questions. This is a very good thing i belive. (Even if the answer is wrong)
Now. My little take on it and the larger picture.
Have we started as a specie to develop a collective answer? or do we still have a lot of individualistic answers to this based on ethnic race, religion and social rank?
Why i asked these questions is pretty simple, or maybe even weird.
I do believe that the universe is awaiting our answer to these questions which will be due pretty soon i belive. I have thought about the UFO sightings and all the Alien talk in the middle, and i wonder if those unconfirmed Aliens could be the ones we would give our answer to( pure opinion) This will ( IMO) determine if the human race/collective will carry on to become a traveller again (Yes. I agree with Tab again) among the stars, or if we are left here to die. I got a new view of a God when i thought about this. God is the energy/light/electrisity that you wrote down here, and this peculiar/particular energy "decided" that Mankind was to inhabit Earth as a test to see if they could pass the test by answering these questions. The UFO sightings/Aliens in this could just be our babysitters/"teachers" waiting for our answer. ( Any opinions on this anyone?)
By no means do i know if our answers so far are the right ones, but it seems like we are getting to something that is the essential part of who we are, whom we might become and ultimately "Where do we go?". Time will eventually tell if mankind will be able to answer these questions as a collective, but how close are we? ;)
12-11-99, 11:17 AM
hi, to me the concept of 'god' is too simplistic and too ambiguous. And so I wouldn't describe my invisible light as god.
I think there is a motivating factor which we cannot even begin to comprehend, which goes far, far beyond human ideas and notions of god/s/esses. I have tried to describe this theory of mine in a witty novel I finished earlier this year, If it's kismet it may get published.
If there are et's within the vicinity of Earth and if they are indeed helping us to develop our space/computer technology it could only mean that we are a very rare species which they want to protect, knowing that this planet is possibly doomed to be hit by a comet or large meteor.
They may just want to speed up our scientific knowledge and technological arts so that we can skip this mother (earth), before it's blown to smithereens.
This may explain our icredibly swift advancements in science and technology on the one hand and yet our deep spiritual slumber on the other. And as I write this I just visualise our recent techno achievements
compared against our mind sleep and dominant animal instincts and I think 'wow, maybe it's true.Our technology has advanced so rapidly to such a height and is still forging ahead at such full force that it feels like magic, other worldly, alien inspired even.
But alas no, I cannot subscribe to this view.
It is true that we have made quantum leaps in sci/tec and it is true that this planet is doomed, whether by our making or nature it is probably inevitable. But the fact and the point is that we know.
We know, because our auras have been 'discussing' our situation for quite a while now, as auras exist outside of time and they are all connected they are able to 'know' future events and are able to devise remedies. In the case of organic lifeforms, the auras knowledge and remedial action will cause the lifeform to develop/evolve/mutate rapidly in anticipation of the looming disaster.
So in our case, at this point in time we are witnessing super rapid development of our logical brain as supernature takes its course and is organising our future survival as a species, we are indeed priviliged to be living in this age, there are signs and wonders indeed.
Thanks H Kon, replying to your post has just given me these new insights, I feel chuffed!
Great post Tab :)
When i said that the "God" that i got the new view of could be the light/electrisity/energy that the universe is made up of i guess i didn't find the right english words for it which you said the term God is too simplisitic, and something we cant quite comprehend. I agree with you there ( yet again) in this.
Now a bold question related to this:
Since we really can't comprehend the concept of God and the questions that i first asked in this thread, is religion(all religions) as we know it the subsitute for the lack of understanding of this "God" ( light/electrisity/energy) we have yet to tap into? Or is it something completely different which we have no hope of ever to understand?
I agree with you. Something is really going on on our spiritual level these days. The New Age stuff that is going on, coupled with all the religious debates/doubts and Alien talk that is currently going on in the world. Are humans starting to think different about the founding questions? Are we questioning our existance in a different, but healthier debate these days?
I can just ask questions since i do not have an answer to any of this, all is just speculation from my point of view, but i am willing to learn, share, and eventually come up with something that seems more logical to me. Maybe that logical answer that i am searching for is something that is being shared by someone else.
Great thread so far.. :) Thanks Tab for sharing :)
12-12-99, 04:05 PM
I agree, GREAT thread. Right up my tree is this!
I wonder what Boris thinks?
12-12-99, 04:28 PM
Doh! I forgot to give you my 2 cents worth.
-Since we really can't comprehend the concept of God and the questions that i first asked in this thread, is religion(all religions) as we know it the subsitute for the lack of understanding of this "God" ( light/electrisity/energy) we have yet to tap into? Or is it something completely different which we have no hope of ever to understand?-
I think religion is a double edged sword. On the one hand it takes fundamental truths and spiritual ideas and processes them to be palateable to the idigenous culture, who always hunger for religion and so are placated and spiritually fulfilled by it.
So far so good, but religion is such a strong psychological force in human cultures that it has always been adopted, championed and promoted by monarchs, governments and rulers since our beginning. Hence, religions tend to consist of groups of very nationalistic and devious institutions with hidden aggendas.
Thats how I see it!
12-12-99, 06:35 PM
I think Boris is probably wrapped up in studying for or taking final exams right now. I'm sure he'll be back soon to give us his 2 cents worth! :)