What are ethics and morality based on?

Discussion in 'Ethics, Morality, & Justice' started by Mr. Hamtastic, Apr 24, 2009.

  1. sniffy Banned Banned

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    A survival trait.
    Seems to work in general terms at least doesn't it?

    Co-operate by sharing/exchanging (peas, morals, christmas cards) and survive.

    Unfortunately it all starts to fall apart slightly as the groups you share with get bigger and bigger and bigger.

    Unless you can persude them there is something in it for them to put up and shut up or some kind of otherworldly punishment if you don't.

    Mr hamtastic I give you heaven and hell virgins and infidels.....
     
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  3. Mr. Hamtastic whackawhackado! Registered Senior Member

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    I'm confused.

    Are you suggesting that learned behavior is passed on genetically? As in I learned that fire is hot, I pass that knowledge to my offspring as instinct?

    and yes, Religion was a base for morality, it pulled us out of the dark ages in the west. Isn't it time we reinvestigated our regional morals(cultures?) and rewrote those ideas based on the possibilities we have technologically today?
     
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  5. sniffy Banned Banned

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    I'm saying that the thing we label altruism or morals are survival traits that we have evolved within our social groups. As humans have spread across the globe they have evolved different forms of altruism/morals that have effectively helped them survive within their social groups.

    What is confusing about that?
     
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  7. Mr. Hamtastic whackawhackado! Registered Senior Member

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    I didn't know if you were talking about biological evolution or societal evolution.

    In that case, I agree. It could be said, then, that relativism may be the way to go, as all morality is equally correct.
     
  8. sniffy Banned Banned

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    Or equally incorrect......
     
  9. swarm Registered Senior Member

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    Certainly very complex behaviors can be passed on genetically.

    Cuckoos are raised in the nests of other birds and may never see another cuckoo as they are raised, and yet they manage to migrate to exactly the right spot in Africa, from Europe and find other cuckoos to mate with.

    Other birds, like ducks, the males mate with whatever looks like their mother did. So if you take a male mallard egg and put it in a wood duck's nest the mallard will try and mate with female wood ducks and will ignore female mallards.

    What starts as learned behavior could conceivable become genetically encoded over time.
     
  10. James G Registered Member

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    I tend to agree. Hume put it well: “It is wisely ordained by nature, that private conexxions should commonly prevail over universal views and considerations; otherwise our affections and actions would be dissipated and lost, for want of a proper limited object” (Enquiry Concerninc the Principles of morals)

    Ideally societal Justice (Laws) would take over where personal connection (which gives us a sense of duty) leaves off. Does to some extent, but hasn't thus far been able to correct for the gross inequalities both domestically and, most of all, internationally.
     
  11. James G Registered Member

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    In some respects I would say yes, such as in the general opposition to gay marriage (a good example of prevailing moral notions being based on regional religion) (and I recognize that this example as nothing to do with the "technological possibilities of today"). But is your post advocating for the free reign of science at the expense of all traditional morality?
     
  12. Roman Banned Banned

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    I find that rather inconceivable. How would transient chemical processes in the brain affect the genetic material of the gametes that was decided prior to the organism's birth?

    While certain life events may induce chromatin remodeling and change the epigenetic make up of its gametes, all the evidence I've ever seen only suggests that epigenetic effects are in response to broad environmental factors, like starvation or temperature. It could be possible that chromatin remodeling could turn certain genes on or off prior to fertilization (making your offspring more likely to be aggressive or altruistic), but given that we don't even understand how the mind works, let alone the genetic basis for human behavior, this is pretty wild speculation. Furthermore, given the advantage of having large brains and a largely blank slate seems to be incredibly successful for us humans. Epigenetic control over your offspring, as a human, seems counter-productive, seeing as how our edge as humans is our adaptive nature.
     
  13. swarm Registered Senior Member

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    They aren't chosen before, they are chosen after.

    Basically you have a variety of behaviors and then kill the ones that don't work. Over time the "works"ness becomes genetically encoded from natural variations. The result, complex genetic knowledge.

    A perfect example would be a termite mound. They are extremely complex with regulated air control, gardens, nurseries, waste control, tough, water proof building materials and no designer, nothing learned, no one in charge. Strictly genetic knowledge of the same sort that gets your heart in the right place.
     

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