What came before the Big Bang?

Discussion in 'Astronomy, Exobiology, & Cosmology' started by Joaquin, Jul 4, 2015.

  1. Joaquin Sleuth Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    387
    I'm sure this thread has been done to death but i'd like to hear updated opinions on it now.


    I've heard many ideas very whacky, insane,...etc...


    I do believe in a multiverse, though. I'm on the fence with the many theories about this subject however.


    I think people might assume everything may have a cause and effect. I'm not sure if that could be attributed to the big bang, though. I'm not sure however as i find this quite hard to fathom. I don't think anyone will ever know for sure.

    A universe created from another universe perhaps? How was the other universe created? Rinse and repeat.

    Just an expansion maybe. A very simple idea. Something just expanding over time resulting in, as an accident byproduct, our existence.


    The whackiest one's i've heard are some beings called the ''Archons'' created our universe through their own. I think maybe the person i was speaking to had been smoking too much herb.


    Sorry. I think i posted this in the wrong section so you can move it if you want. Thanx.
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2015
  2. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  3. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    33,264
    What was going on before the Big Bang? Usually, we tell the story of the Universe by starting at the Big Bang and then talking about what happened after. Similarly and completely opposite to how astronomers view the Universe… by standing in the present and looking backwards. From here, the furthest we can look back is to the cosmic microwave background, which is about 380,000 years after the big bang.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!


    The history of the universe starting the with the Big Bang. Image credit: grandunificationtheory.com
    Before that we couldn’t hope to see a thing, the Universe was just too hot and dense to be transparent. Like pea soup. Soup made of delicious face burning high energy everything.
    In traditional stupid earth-bound no-Tardis life unsatisfactory fashion, we can’t actually observe the origin of the Universe from our place in time and space.

    http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...vYHgDw&usg=AFQjCNGsPghoyljbADmmAWptd39nqZyBow
     
  4. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  5. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    27,543
    According to all we know at this time, we can only be relatively sure of the Universe as we see it today, back to 10-43 seconds after the BB event. Any ideas as to what happened before then, is just speculation, but educated speculation in the main.
    I like the idea that our BB was literally the arse end of a BH in another Universe/spacetime, and likewise BHs in this universe lead to other Universes.
    Or maybe this is the one and only Universe according to the following...
    Remember the BB in the first instant was an evolution of space and time.
    Anyway take a read of this.......
    https://www.astrosociety.org/publications/a-universe-from-nothing/

    A Universe from Nothing
    by Alexei V. Filippenko and Jay M. Pasachoff
     
  6. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  7. timojin Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,252
    O see the gradual temperature drop to the present . My question is : particle react they give off heat, as material condense or collide there is heat liberated. so were is the whole heat gone ? Is it distribuited in the universe volume . If so, the universe have a fixed volume ?
     
  8. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    27,543
    The amount of energy and matter that evolved from the BB is the same amount of energy and matter that exists today, only in a bigger volume due to Universal expansion.
    In fact at the first fraction of a second after the BB, matter as we know it could not possibly exist at such extremes of temperatures and pressures.
    How can you suggest the Universe has a fixed volume when it is expanding?
     
  9. timojin Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,252
    Si If I take the picture for a rough analysis ,assuming there is a constant pressure AT THE PRESENT TIME dV = nRdT/P . I can see from here the volume is changing with temperature ,
    but we are saying the present temperature is constant at 3. K
     
  10. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    27,543
    http://www.universetoday.com/79777/cosmic-background-radiation/
    Cosmic Background Radiation
    by JERRY COFFEY on NOVEMBER 23, 2010

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!


    WMAP data of the Cosmic Microwave Background. Credit: NASA

    The cosmic background radiation, more commonly called the cosmic microwave background radiation(CMBR) is electromagnetic radiation that fills the Universe. The radiation can only be detected with a radio telescope which makes it show as a faint glow. This glow is strongest in the microwave area of the radio spectrum.
    The cosmic background radiation is radiation left over from early development of the universe, and is a landmark proof of the Big Bang theory. Before the formation of stars and planets, the Universe was smaller, much hotter, and filled with a uniform glow from its white-hot fog of hydrogen plasma. As the universe expanded, both the plasma and the radiation filling it grew cooler. When the universe cooled and stable atoms could form, they eventually could no longer absorb the thermal radiation and the universe became transparent instead of being an opaque fog. The photons that from that time have been propagating ever since, growing fainter and less energetic. The CMBR has a thermal black body spectrum at a temperature of 2.725 K, so it peaks in the microwave range frequency of 160.2 Ghz(1.9 mm wavelength).

    The CMBR is isotropic to roughly one part in 100,000. The Far-Infrared Absolute Spectrophotometer (FIRAS) instrument has measured the spectrum of the cosmic background radiation, making it the most precisely measured black body spectrum in nature. It is the main prediction of the Big Bang and Inflationary Cosmology predicts that after about 10-37 seconds the new universe underwent explosive growth that smoothed out nearly all inhomogeneities. This was followed by a type of phase transition that set the fundamental forces and elementary particles in their present form. The early universe was made up of a plasma of photons, electrons, and baryons. As the universe expanded adiabatic cooling caused the plasma to cool(at about 3,000 K) until electrons and protons combined to form hydrogen.
    The Big Bang theory suggests that the cosmic microwave background fills all of observable space, and that most of the radiation energy in the universe is in the cosmic microwave background. Once you consider it, it only makes sense that there would be a background radiation that is directly related to the expansion of the Universe.

    We have written many articles about cosmic background radiation for Universe Today. Here’s an article about space radiation, and here’s an article about the origin of the universe.
     
  11. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    27,543
  12. timojin Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,252
  13. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    27,543
    ??Merging??? Why...the Universe/spacetime is expanding. Everything is moving apart, except those that have the strong, weak, forces, EMF and gravity overcoming the expansion rate.
     
  14. timojin Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,252
    I know it is idd me saying that . I understand the universe is expanding shown by the red shift. But we have neutron stars formation , Black hole swallowing objects , If we look in a spire galaxy like our milky way ,
    would you not say the the high density BH is contracting material to make a galaxy smaller in size. eventually our sun will become a dwarf and so our solar will reduce in size .
    Pardon me if my thinking is fantasy , but I believe some might hold .
     
  15. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    27,543
    BHs are not all purpose vacuum cleaners. eg: If we could magically squeeze the mass of our Sun into a sphere around 3kms radius, it would become a BH...yet Earth, Venus, Mercury would all continue to orbit as is.
    The only swallowing of any of our solar system by the BH, maybe just a few comets or asteroids of highly elliptical orbits that ventured to within around 3 Schwarzchild radius.
    Your thinking is fantasy and I don't believe any of it would hold.
     
  16. Billy T Use Sugar Cane Alcohol car Fuel Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    23,198
    I think the accepted answer to thread's question is that it is a meaningless question, like: What color are elephant eggs?

    I. e. both space and time were produced by the BB. There was no "before" just like there are no "elephant eggs."
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2015
  17. timojin Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,252
    I don't deny those are fantasy , but let us assume one billion years had a finite amount of material , as time progressed more meteors and astroids have collapse into other body and those body have increased in size , we have sean this in our own solar system , and I assume this is taking place in solar system in other galaxies . If this is so Should I not believe the universe volume is decreasing ?
     
  18. sideshowbob Sorry, wrong number. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    7,057
    Or, "What's north of the North Pole?"
     
    danshawen likes this.
  19. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    27,543

    Matter may be congregating under gravity, but spacetime or the Universe is still expanding.
    This is how the recently discovered acceleration in the expansion rate is explained. Same amount of matter/energy, in a bigger volume, so less density overall, hence the constant DE causing the expansion accelerates it.
     
  20. timojin Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,252
    Hi I don't know , but let add this to your portfolio
    Astronomers who discovered five new black holes now fear that there could be several millions of such hidden black holes present in the universe. Scientists for the study used NASA's Nuclear Spectroscopic Telescope Array (NuSTAR) satellite observatory.

    The team led by astronomers at Durham University, UK, used NASA's Nuclear Spectroscopic Telescope Array (NuSTAR) satellite observatory to detect the high-energy x-rays from these five massive black holes.

    The team pointed the NuSTAR at nine candidate hidden supermassive black holes that were earlier thought to be extremely active at the center of galaxies. Researchers associated with the research stated that the high-energy x-rays found in five of the black holes confirmed that they were earlier hidden by dust and gas clouds.

    Researchers noted that these five massive black holes appeared far brighter and more attractive than previously thought. They were also emitting large amounts of radiations, said researchers.

    Lead author George Lansbury, said, "For a long time we have known about supermassive black holes that are not obscured by dust and gas, but we suspected that many more were hidden from our view".

    He further thanked NuSTAR saying that it was the first time when they were able to clearly see those hidden monsters that were previously not visible as they were in their 'buried state'.

    So far, they were successful in detecting only five of these hidden black holes, but they hope that when they will extrapolate their results across the entire universe, the predicted numbers might increase to a much higher.

    The team presented their findings at the Royal Astronomical Society's National Astronomy Meeting, in Llandudno, Wales.

    Topics:
    Science
    News
     
  21. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    27,543
    Yep, read that article here.......
    http://phys.org/news/2015-07-universe-hidden-supermassive-black-holes.html

    My question actually resulting from that finding, is if the predicted numbers are correct, what bearing does it have on DM?

    On the article itself, we are finding new stuff everyday, and are refining data and measurements everyday based on new discoveries. That'swhat science [particularly astronomy/cosmology is all about.
    Wait till the JWST is launched.
     
  22. timojin Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,252
    O agree, science is not static, different opinion should not discarded all the time , we are all observers sometime from an other point of view.
     
  23. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    27,543

    True, but if the truth be known, no new opinion, no new model of cosmology, no refutation of accepted scientific theories, are ever going to be fulfilled on this or any other science forum.
    That will be done by the true Professionals with their heads up and arse down and their nose to the grindstone at the coal face.
    Of course we do have some exceptions.......and I believe those exceptions make themselves known in a short space of time. We do have a couple here, and I was lucky enough to once participate in a forum now defunct that had its very own astronomer and a real live SR/GR theorist expert.
    This is the third forum I have been a party to, and I have yet to see any great discovery or revelation or refutation from any alternative forumite.
    The new discoveries, the new innovations, the new models, will almost exclusively be done from the present mainstream academia.

    There are obvious reasons for this, first and foremost, forums such as this are open to every Tom, Dick and Harry, and its very are for forums to get an Einstein, Curie, or Bohr. Secondly of course the latter bunch have professional backing. Phds and access to all the awesome state of the art equipment both on Earth and in Space.
     

Share This Page