Democratic Socialism In Venezuela

Japan has a social system very similar to Germany (although, to be fair, Germans are probably more OCD-ish). Now that the demographic tide has turned, the young are paying in lost opportunity, lost prosperity, the inability to form families of their own, most younger Japanese expect nothing in terms of pension, social security. And, don't think that the old are doing well, they're not either. No interest on their savings, many work until they drop, etc...

Why?

How did so many people, get so much, so wrong?

In the early 1980s, the 'Tiger" economy had it all figured out. Chinese, apparently, would go to Japan and say they got 'communism' right (which is to say socialism). Well, they didn't get it right.

But, luckily for Japan - after 25 years of economic stagnation, the situation is sort of, in some way, turning around for the youngest. As the old, die off, without immigration, corporations are forced to compete for limited labor hours, which (like anything in limited supply) increases the price of the thing in limited supply. So, in Japan (thanks in large part to low level xenophobia) they resisited the sirens call to open the flood gates and allow immigration mask the real problem, cut welfare, cut benefits, gave up on the idea of retiring, moved in with family - and things are turning around.

Ethnic Europeans are, in some countries, are expected to be minorities before the century is done.

 

Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.

double post

 

Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.

rose glasses much?

Colonialism?
WWI?
WWII?

 

Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.

re Japan?
They overlooked the necessity of regulating big banks and real estate lending, and then refused to extricate themselves from the inevitable boom, bust, and liquidity trap, via Keynesian economic policy (the only alternative to war). In other words, their ruling class was unwilling to adopt Keynesian remedies, and so they remained stuck in a suboptimal equilibrium.

Fukushima may have jolted them out of it, btw.

Those came before the governance and regimes you despise. You were talking about "socialism", remember?

 

What is an "ethnic European"? I think you must mean a white European.

(Pass the pillowcase and dog-whistle)

 

Really? Ethnicity?

Ethnicity is shared beliefs and traditions.

As an example, in Japan, most Japanese attend a Shinto ceremony at birth, age 3, 5 and 7. They read and write in Japanese language. It's common to eat sticky rice. It's common to eat fish in certain ways. They generally share Buddhist beliefs. Reading and writing is based on Chinese - a different ethnicity. Buddhism is based on Graeco-Buddhism, itself derived from Hinduism. Japanese wear suits - that's European. I know Japanese who are 'White'. They don't speak any other language than Japanese and, quite frankly, have little to no interest in Western culture. No more so than any other 'Japanese'. Being white and green eyes is separate from their ethnicity - which is Japanese.

Is there a relationship to genetics? Probably, in as much as IQ has a strong genetic component. As an example, empirical studies suggest that in order to run a successful democracy, the average IQ has to be around 95. Are societies with average IQ's of 85 or 65 likely to develop and maintain successful democracies as a part of their culture? Maybe not. Democracy and it's related shared values and traditions, never becomes a reality.

Not that this matters for you. Europeans want to live in multicultureal societies. You'll have to accept racism and sexism as other belief systems - because, in other cultures, these are their shared beliefs. In numerous countries throughout the middle east homosexuals are condemned to death. They have a shared belief that the magic sky daddy wants these people to die. So, you need to accept their belief as valid - for them. See? It's their culture. And get this, when there's enough people who share a belief, and they get to vote, that becomes the law. Which, you would respect.

See how it works?

 

The average IQ as calibrated on today's scale, applied to the citizenry of the US around 1800, would have been in the 80s. (The recalibration to account for the Flynn effect has moved the "100" about 15 points up, so "100" then - average by definition - would score 85 - 88 today).

 

Japan is famously homogeneous and is thus a particularly poor analogy for Europe.

And your country has just voted to embrace racism and sexism, so you have not a lot to crow about.

 

Actually, there's good evidence that the Flynn effect isn't real. Or at least not what has been measured across the last few decades. What may have happened, is kids are gaining test taking experience and are taking tests that contain questions similar to those found on an IQ test. Many kids are being drilled in taking these tests - for decades. Some of these questions can only be used one time - in your life.

Whatever g is, it's probably the same and it probably has a large genetic component.

Having a high IQ, isn't the key to success. That's not my argument. Prosperity requires: sound money, laws that protect private property and uphold contract and free markets / free people. North Koreans have very high IQs. They never developed a democracy. And they're poor.

 

Black kids in the inner city US have not been getting drilled in taking IQ tests since 1955. Neither have the children in South American and African countries - the Flynn effect is world wide.

No, there isn't.

That puts the IQ of the average US founding citizen of the early democracy around 65.

 

There's evidence that nutrition can increase IQ, however there's also evidence that adopted North Korean children have average IQ's 117 - 121 when raised in the same country where IQ is set at 100. It's not either / or. There's very good evidence that IQ has a strong genetic component.

As for the required IQ to create a sustainable democracy - IQ measures more than just the ability to score well on verbal reasoning or spatial reasoning, there's also something in there that seems to incline the individual to project far into the future. These behaviors also appear to have a strong genetic component. Which, seems reasonable - DNA code is used to build the proteins that make our body - including our brain.

As for the USA, what was the average IQ of the Framers? That's what's important. They created a system of government, one that was so limited, that even an idiot could make it work. I am convinced, if they had created the system we have now, we'd probably be living in the equivalent of the 1200 - 1500s.

 

Not according to you. You keep banging on about the average IQs of the citizenry, which you seem to think are racially distributed according to the sociological races of 1850 America.

Here's your take:

Well, after correcting for the Flynn effect the average IQ of black people in the US today is higher than the average IQ of the Japanese, Americans, Swedes, Germans, English, or French, between 1700 and 1900.

Sure. Like height - it's partly inherited. But like height it doesn't seem to vary by sociological race in any reliably established way, and there's no reason to expect that it would.

 

Nice strawman.

I said there is a strong genetic component to whatever it is IQ tests are measuring. And the data suggests there is.
I also said there is a difference between so called 'race' and culture/ethnicity. An example would be a 'white/Caucasian' Japanese with round green eyes and dark brown hair. Such a person (whom I know) is no more ethnically related to any Western culture than you are to an Asian one. They don't speak any language other than Japanese.

Secondly, I said there is evidence that democracies (particularly welfare States) require a general IQ of around 95. But, given there are so few democracies, and how quickly they follow the path laid out in Plato's Republic (vote for a bunch of free shit and collapse); and given the different types of democracies, republics, cultures and etc... it's not possible to 'know'. Maybe you think it's worth taking a chance? And if it does't work out the way you planned? Then what? What happens when you find yourself living in a society incapable of supporting democracy? I mean, Jesus, we just elected a person right out of the Lego's Movie. Mr Business. Ha!

It's happening right now - not some day far off in the future. But, that's okay, because it'll be glacial slow. More than enough time to normalize

Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

Thirdly, having a general IQ of 95 or above isn't all that is required for a democracy. The other requirements are sound money, laws that protect private property and uphold contract and freedom to trade voluntarily within the law and under contract in a currency of your choice - with others around you.

Welfare States worked when populations where expanding - that's how ponzi scams work. Japan has been dealing with their 1980s welfare State for decades. It's only now, that things maybe, might be, turning around - at least for the worker. With less and less labour hours to buy, the price is finally starting to budge up a little for those with some skills. Also, the elderly have given up on this idea of retiring and now prefer to work up until the end. Rather that than cultural suicide vis a vie unmitigated mass migration.

I'm fairly certain there's a strong correlation between IQ and religious governance. All sorts of behaviors from math to the ability to get up in the morning and start work, or to say no to that free krispy kream donut, has a genetic competent. Who'd of thought, Michael Jordan's amazing basketball skills are linked to his genetics and an 5'3" Asian female isn't likely to do as well on the court against him - no matter how hard she trains. AND to suggest she can, well, that's not fair. That's not scientific. And while it may give you comfort and you may pat yourself on the back pretending to be tolerant (mighty White of you we'd say in the North) - in the real world, people are distressed when told we're all the same - and they repeatedly fail. They start creating stores like 'The Narrative' or White Racism or Sexism or all sorts of things to explain certain outcomes.

AsianTM's didn't just pop out of no where. They popped out of Obama's pushing the narrative. Why? Because if Asians are doing so well, it's not that THEY did well - no, they're stealing from YOU. So go on down to the Uni and punch some money out of a few of the f*ckers.

A good lesson on why we should not deviate from scientific findings when drawing conclusions - nor, should we claim more than what we have evidence for. Do democracies require an average IQ of 95? I believe the evidence suggests yes. However, it depends on the democracy. A limited government, with sound money, law and freedom may support low IQ societies and maintain a standard of democracy. Welfare States? No way in hell. They're already unsound. They'll fail even with a high IQ population. The only thing that keeps them going is an ever increasing population - well, sorry, but the earth is only so big.

 

The Dutch are not, on average, taller than a person from Papua New Guinea?

The data suggests that Asians do better than others on spatial reasoning and that ashkenazi Jews do better on verbal reasoning. The epicanthal fold was probably selected for due to snow glare, which may have been the selection pressure for spatial mapping. Maybe this helps explain why Asians created a visual writing system and maintained it? Or why they like origami? Or why they make good engineers? Or why many Jews have won so many Nobel prizes, do well in law, make good playwrights, have written so much philosophy?


Anyway, IQ appears to measure something that also makes predictions about all sorts of behaviors. Some of those behaviors are amenable towards a civil society. Others are not.

Interestingly, for us, this century ethnic Europeans will become minorities in Northern Europe. Then we can test the hypothesis with a few more data points. Although, to be fair, I'd suggest Syria and Egypt, are probably good examples of what we can expect to see Europe look like in 50 years. Call it the cultural enrichment experiment

Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

We'll see.

I mean, really, this is all mute. What is, is.

 

Anyway, I've stated my position many times. If we want to become a prosperous society, we need sound money, law and free markets. But, that's not my 'solution'. My solution is peaceful parenting. Teaching children basic reasoning in a supportive, nurturing environment. Sweden seemed close, well on their way. Oh well. Not so much now.

 

Not genetically, as a population. Not if John Komlos and his fellow researchers, who actually collected and crunched the data, are correct.

"Asians" are not a genetically homogenous or isolated population. Ashkenazi Jews are historically a genetically insular - almost inbred - population, not equivalent to "Jews".

Or maybe better resistance to gnats, which would also explain its distribution.

The ones in Siberia, the Americas, and the mountains, did little of that. The ones that lived on paddy farmed rice, which required large scale government organization, did that stuff. So did the Egyptians - visual language, feats of engineering - who also depended on large irrigation complexes and the necessary bureaucracy and bookkeeping.

The Ashkenazi Jews do as well, or even better, at mathematical pursuits not involving verbal reasoning specifically.

And so forth.

 

So we agree: on average E. Asians score higher on spatial reasoning and Ashkenazi Jews on average score higher on verbal and mathematical reasoning.

In Berkeley, American Asians make up 40% of the student cohort. Similarly, American Jews often take 20% of the placements. Are you going to argue that genes can play a role in IQ but it really all comes down to their culture when they go to school? What? The other cultures are stupider? As if culture and genetics are somehow independent from one another?

Ever hear of island time? Life is pretty good on a pacific island. Try that shit in Russia and you'll be dead in a year. Or, would have 100 years ago. You don't think there's a selection pressure at work in the north hemisphere?

Anyway, in the coming decades we're going to find the exact genes - and in the coming centuries, we're going to use this information to alter the human genome. Then the point will be mute

Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

But get this, so long as there are limits to real stuff, and assuming we lack the ability to experience another person's subjective reality; we will be required to use some form of sound money, law and free markets in order to create prosperity. In a human society, composed of individual conscious agents / us, there is no other way. Socialism violates ALL THREE of these premises. Socialism requires fiat currency, which violates private property and reduces freedom. This works out well in an age of oil combined with never ending people to sell debt obligations on. Not so well when that trick runs its course.

Not long now. A few decades and I imagine genetic manipulation will begin to reverse many of the aging processes at the cellular level. Maybe not even that long.

 

No, we disagree that "Jews" are specialized in non-spatial reasoning, that "E. Asians" are the same as "Asians", that there is any evidence that an epicanthic fold is connected with engineering ability, and so forth.

Whatever the relationship, you don't know what it is.

I think if you had to navigate a thousand miles of open ocean and hit a target fifty miles wide on dead reckoning informed by mental calculation of star positions, current patterns, and knotted strings for mnemonics of the handed down stories of a thousand generations of ancestors, you'd be dead in two weeks.

Fish don't catch themselves, in the open ocean. Water doesn't find itself, or keep itself. Boats don't repair themselves. The population of an island doesn't regulate itself.

There's a term of respect given to a few, a very few, old men among the Hawaiian islanders in past days, and maybe still - that they had a "hey hey eye". It refers to hunting octopods - many kinds of octopus construct lairs on the sea bottom, and they put considerable effort into camouflaging them, which they are good enough at to fool both prey and predator. The ability to see such a lair, to recognize the subtle alterations of the seafloor that betray manipulation by design, is not one everybody possesses. It tends to arrive with age. Someone unusually able has a "hey hey eye", and the term extends metaphorically to subtlety and depth of perception in all areas of life - as a matter of survival, not mere prospering.

How about Australia? Given the rigors and complexities of life there, and the genetic isolation, we expect to find unusually high genetic components of intelligence by selection among the aboriginal population. Right?

 

iceaura,

Are you arguing there is NOT a strong genetic component to IQ test outcomes? Because that conclusion is not congruent with the empirical data which strongly suggests there is a strong genetic component to IQ - as well as many other behaviors, including self control, mathematics (abstract thinking), and etc...

Pretending what is real, is not real, because it's what you 'want' to believe is true - is religious. It's also not fair to the people you convince are the same as everyone else - they just need to try harder. Or maybe their culture isn't good enough, they just don't study hard enough, like Asians and Jews. That's not fair. It leads to a lot of irrational thoughts too. Which is why we see BLM and other SJW groups making complete messes of society and higher education.

Imagine a world where everyone has to play basketball for 12 years. The outcome of which determines how well you do in life. Everyone is told, that everyone is equally as good at basketball. You just have to train. Soon, I promise, if you convince people of that nonsense, you'll have short Asians (who would fail in such a society) beginning to believe irrational conspiracies - and with politicians and media happy to encourage this line of thinking because it make for easy control and easy money. All sorts of 'fixes' will be tried, but will not work - they'll make the problems worse.

Pretending what is real, is not real.
That's religious.




Speaking of religion, I heard a relatively famous Atheist make the argument that 'we' shouldn't be discouraged by the political outcome. Why? Because if "we" want to make change happen, we need to make that change.

[at this point I was actually surprised, and somewhat encouraged... then he concluded with this zinger]

By getting involved in and running for office!


LOL!!!
Big surprise there.

I know you find it hard to believe - but this Statism: It's a belief system based on violence. State Authoritarianism. A superstition. An insanity that only irrational belief could be comfortable with. It's a religion. The idea you're going to initiate violence against morally innocent humans, and expect a positive outcome.

That's not going to happen. You're not going to rape your way into a loving relationship.


While anecdotal, I've worked in numerous countries, in numerous large institutions. I've only ever come across one person I 'felt' was a psychopath. Someone who made my blood run cold. It's never happened to me before. Or after. And I've had guns pointed at my head, and looked people in the face knowing I was going to be shot for walking into the wrong house, with the wrong idiot and see the wrong things. Like 5 seconds from my brains painting the back wall. Still, while that scared me, I saw humanity in the mans face. Almost pity. Pity he'd have to clean up a mess (my skull pieces). Anyway, as for the pyscho, I got up and walked away from that person and did my best to never come in contact with him. Then left. He runs a small nondescript public institution. It wouldn't even make it on the radar. What's interesting, this little idiot of a man, has spent 100s of millions of tax chattel fiat currency units. Maybe a billion. Given how old he is. He has LESS than zero to show for it. As in, things regress - they move backwards.

THIS is the state of our public institutions. A free market would have punished this person LONG AGO. If you think pulling a magic lever, has any influence at all people like this person, or will result in a positive outcome originating from within one of these institutions - this is pure superstitious abstract nonsense.

Which is what our Nation States and our Fiat Currencies are - abstract nonsense. No different than Gods.

I'd also note this, most of the time, when I speak with people in both private and public institutions - they know their institution is a total mess. But, their biggest fear? Losing their job or not getting promotion. In a private company, they know they have to provide value - and under pressure, people come up with good ideas. Anyone can. In a public institution? HA! They only have to tick a box. Which means working to the lowest common denominator. Extra money? Oh, you spend that all up and say you need more (even though the opposite is true). In a private company - THAT sort of behavior, also common, leads to bankruptcy. Which is great. Move out of the way! In public institutions - it leads to the collapse of entire countries, when they go bankrupt, often involving numerous wars along the way. Just something you may want to think about. Because we've been engaged in a phony war for over a decade.


Whatever the general IQ of the population in the USA, what made our country prosperous was LIMITED government, sound money, free people who generally followed the laws. Not 'ideal'. But it worked. We now live in the post-modern world. Nations that deviated from this path, generally led to their own destruction - namely, the worse of the lot, being socialist crap holes like Germany was, and China and Russia became. That Venezuela is.

 

Of course there is a strong genetic component to IQ. So? There's a strong genetic component to height, too. Disease risk. Lifespan. This stuff does not intrinsically vary by sociological race, except in narrow and defined specific circumstances. Give up on the racial IQ stuff - it's dumb, ignorant, and irrelevant.

Maybe, maybe not. Maybe it would have rewarded him with his own hedge fund, or top job at a modern capitalistic corporation.

Whenever you post something I can check, you got it wrong - often wildly, comically wrong, the opposite of what you intended. So that's the context of evaluation of these little fables you tell, that I can't check.

And slavery, indentured servitude, military conquest, destructive exploitation of a newly discovered continent, etc. Plus entire towns, colonies, etc, with some of the most intrusive, oppressive, detailed micromanaging government one can imagine - including, very often, severe restrictions and even outright bans on capitalist incorporation.

So you will never again post that silliness about a necessary minimum average IQ for democracy that some peoples do not possess, etc. Right?
,