https://splinternews.com/how-to-not-die-in-america-1822555151 How do we justify a system where people can find themselves utterly destitute due to circumstances utterly beyond their control...and we call it normal... A sobering thought on what can easily happen to any number of middle class Americas.
Forget all its greatness the US fails because the system of health and indeed education are not free...in my view. In a country with a high percentage of religious folk one wonders why things are just unfair. That poor lady...what a terrible experience. I have had similar on two different occassions where poor health stopped me but the last thing I needed to worry about was maybe running out of money and not being able to be treated...not because I had money but because fortunately our system seems not just another commercial enterprise. Alex
From Wiki... Methodology Free Health care: Free health care refers to a publicly funded health care that provides primary services free of charge or a nominal fee to all its citizens, with no exclusions based on income or wealth.[3] Universal Health Care: Universal health care, sometimes referred to as universal health coverage, universal coverage, or universal care, usually refers to a health care system that provides healthcare and financial protection to more than 90% of the citizens of a particular country.[4] CountryFree Health careUniversal Health Care AfghanistanNoNo AlbaniaYesYes AlgeriaYesYes AndorraYesYes AngolaNoNo Antigua and BarbudaYesYes ArgentinaYesYes ArmeniaYesNo AustraliaYesYes AustriaYesYes AzerbaijanYesNo BahamasYesYes BahrainYesYes BangladeshYesNo BarbadosYesYes BelarusYesYes BelgiumYesYes BelizeNoYes BeninYesNo BhutanYesYes BoliviaYesYes [5] Bosnia and HerzegovinaYesYes BotswanaYesYes BrazilYesYes Brunei DarussalamYesYes BulgariaYesYes Burkina FasoYesYes BurundiNoNo Cabo VerdeYesNo CambodiaNoNo CameroonNoNo CanadaYesYes Central African RepublicYesNo ChadNoNo ChileYesYes ChinaYesYes ColombiaYesYes ComorosNoNo CongoYesNo Cook IslandsYesYes Costa RicaYesNo CroatiaYesYes CubaYesYes CyprusYesYes Czech RepublicYesYes Côte d'IvoireYesNo Democratic Republic of the CongoYesNo DenmarkYesYes DjiboutiYesNo Dominican RepublicNoNo DominicaNoNo EcuadorYesYes EgyptYesNo El SalvadorYesNo Equatorial GuineaYesNo EritreaYesYes EstoniaYesYes EthiopiaYesNo FijiYesYes FinlandYesYes FranceYesYes GabonYesYes GambiaNoNo GeorgiaYesYes GermanyYesYes GhanaNoYes GreeceYesYes GrenadaNoNo GuatemalaYesNo GuernseyYesYes Guinea-BissauNoNo GuineaNoNo GuyanaYesYes HaitiNoNo HondurasYesNo Hong KongYesYes HungaryYesYes IcelandYesYes IndiaYesYes IndonesiaNoNo IranYesYes [6] IraqNoNo IrelandYesNo Isle of ManYesYes IsraelYesYes ItalyYesYes JamaicaYesYes JapanYesYes JerseyYesYes JordanNoNo KazakhstanYesYes KenyaNoNo KiribatiYesYes KuwaitYesYes KyrgyzstanYesNo LaosYesNo LatviaYesYes LebanonNoNo LesothoYesNo LiberiaNoNo LibyaYesNo LiechtensteinYesYes LithuaniaYesYes LuxembourgYesYes MacauYesYes MacedoniaYesYes MadagascarYesNo MalawiYesNo MalaysiaYesYes MaldivesYesYes MaliNoNo MaltaYesYes Marshall IslandsNoNo MauritaniaNoNo MauritiusYesYes MexicoYesYes MicronesiaNoNo MoldovaYesYes MonacoYesYes MongoliaYesNo MontenegroYesYes MoroccoYesNo MozambiqueNoNo MyanmarYesNo NamibiaYesYes NauruYesYes NepalYesNo NetherlandsYesYes New ZealandYesYes NicaraguaYesNo NigeriaNoNo NigerNoNo NiueYesYes North KoreaYesYes NorwayYesYes OmanYesYes PakistanNoNo PalauYesYes PanamaYesYes Papua New GuineaYesNo ParaguayYesYes PeruYesYes PhilippinesYesNo PolandYesYes PortugalYesYes QatarYesYes RomaniaYesYes RussiaYesYes RwandaYesYes Saint Kitts and NevisNoNo Saint LuciaYesYes Saint Vincent and the GrenadinesYesYes SamoaYesYes San MarinoYesYes Saudi ArabiaYesYes SenegalNoNo SerbiaYesYes SeychellesYesYes Sierra LeoneNoNo SingaporeYesYes SlovakiaYesYes SloveniaYesYes Solomon IslandsYesNo SomaliaNoNo South AfricaYesNo South KoreaYesYes South SudanNoNo SpainYesYes Sri LankaYesYes SudanNoNo SurinameNoNo SwazilandYesNo SwedenYesYes SwitzerlandYesYes Syrian Arab RepublicNoNo São Tomé and PríncipeYesNo TaiwanYesYes TajikistanNoNo TanzaniaYesNo ThailandYesYes Timor-LesteYesYes TogoYesNo TongaYesYes Trinidad and TobagoYesYes TunisiaYesYes TurkeyYesYes TurkmenistanNoNo TuvaluYesYes UgandaYesNo UkraineYesYes United Arab EmiratesYesYes United KingdomYesYes United States of AmericaNoNo UruguayYesYes UzbekistanYesYes VanuatuYesYes VenezuelaYesYes Viet NamYesNo YemenYesNo ZambiaYesYes ZimbabweNoNo
Why is it so? Is it so dog eat dog that folk cant see helping others to be the decent thing to do... Is it that they dont want the illegals, white trash or anyone who is not white to benefit from a free system? It just seems so mind numbingly wrong. How do folk approach free health care.. Do they say the country cant afford it or that God will sort it out?...I am just curious how folk justify being against free health care. The only folk who benefit seem to be insurance exectutives and the paper pushers in the system....how much do they pull out of the system I wonder and could that money better used see a more compassionate health care system. Who loses if free health was adopted by USA? Alex
What puzzles me is one (out of many) objections of Americans is in simple terms "why should I pay for someone's else's health care?" But they take out insurance for other events. If they pay to insure your car and never use it you are paying for someone's else's car repairs Australia has about a 2% health care tax and more if you earn over a certain amount where it is considered you should take out private health insurance So you pay 2% tax plus more if earn over a certain amount OR you pay 2% tax plus your own health insurance Problem Private treatment has, I think, far to high copayments NOT covered by insurance On the plus side (sort of) for those paying private health care, a serious event will see them in public health care because very few private health care facilities have the range of equipment required Once stabilised sure move to private care So if America had a ?% of wage tax taken to cover universal health care (plus extra % over wage level) there is nothing to stop those who consider they need extra health care to take out there own cover One poor aspect of universal is overuse by patients and doctors. Doctors can be monitored. Little harder to do with patients but not impossible Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
The thing is, universal health care has been shown, time and again, to be cheaper overall than what we have now, in no small part because a single, centralized entity would have the bargaining power to help drive some of these ridiculous prices down. Case in point - a bag of IV Saline costs between 50 cents to a dollar to manufacture, yet it costs a patient over a hundred dollars in the hospital, before accounting for the costs to have a nurse put the IV itself in! This article is a bit dated, but: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/27/health/exploring-salines-secret-costs.html Provides a terrifying insight into just how fucked our health care billing system truly is.
Not "free" . single payer Who loses-----------that's an easy one We in the usa spent twice, per capita, what any other country does on health care. So----------look at the system and the players The members of the AHA, AMA, insurance conglomerates, pharmaceutical companies and several exotic vacation spots all stand to lose ....................................... occasionally, someone screws up the paperwork, and I end up getting the bill once, for a cut on my hand, there was an item "suture material" price $49.00 on another occasion, I was billed $ 2300.00 for a 10 minute tracheal endoscopy procedure. ............................................ President Harry S. Truman proposed a system of public health insurance in his November 19, 1945, address. He envisioned a national system that would be open to all Americans, but would remain optional. Participants would pay monthly fees into the plan, which would cover the cost of any and all medical expenses that arose in a time of need. The government would pay for the cost of services rendered by any doctor who chose to join the program. In addition, the insurance plan would give cash to the policy holder to replace wages lost because of illness or injury. The proposal was quite popular with the public, but it was fiercely opposed by the Chamber of Commerce, the American Hospital Association, and the AMA, which denounced it as "socialism" These people can spend billions on lobbyist and pass the cost on to their consumers ..............................
"I stay in bed without realizing the bacteria I’ve inhaled is more lethal than the flu" - bad decision "I’m struggling financially and I’ve fallen behind on my ACA payments." - bad choices "My credit is awful." - bad choices "I have a massive, unpaid bill from a few years back when someone made international calls on my stolen phone." - which I apparently didn't have shut off immediately or contest the charges for, and probably should have had a prepaid plan, considering my other financial woes "She demands they do anything within their power to save me and puts up for the surgery, using her own credit." - her choice to make up for her child's bad choices
She certainly does not derserve any compassion and clearly the system that caters more for the hangers on than patients most certainly is beyond critism.... And one day when you make bad choices be happy that your plight is your own doing. Alex
You hit my favorite words. Personal responsibilty is what folk give up when they live in a religion...in my view (meaning only an opinion). The reason i get worked up is I have seen terrible situations where folk do not get a fair go ... Once I was without compassion and really believed folk deserved their lot..but getting more experience with time I realised thete are people who have great difficulty in managing for various reasons. ..I feel compassion for them as no one seems to care that they dont have the ability to get by like us who are successful will do. Alex
Sin isn't considered personal responsibility? Compassion equals giving to charity and personally helping. Not really forcing others to.
No the devil made them do it. I refer to statements like.. "It is the will of God" "God works in mysterious ways" "Only God knows" That sort of thing. True. Alex
You don't know many Christians, do you? "The devil made me do it" is often the excuse of criminals. Most Christians believe the devil can only tempt, not compel. Why do none of your referred statements support your claim?
I find it interesting that anyone could believe in the devil let alone think that such an entity could tempt one. So what do they say ...I was tempted by the devil but I resisted...and what do they say if they commit as you call it sin...the devil tempted me and I unfortunately fell into sin...of course a criminal will just say...the devil made me do it. But seriously do you believe that there is a devil that temps humans to sin.. I wont laugh honest.. Which claim do you want me to support..if we are to get anywhere generalizations wont cut it. Which claim do you want me to back up, make a list if you wish and I will do my best to back up anything I claim. Alex
No, why do you ask? First thing you said in that post. http://www.sciforums.com/threads/a-sobering-read.160514/#post-3502413