why we need ghosts

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There's nothing wrong with it. That's the point of my post.

Oh, and welcome to the forums.

 

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You don't believe in Darth Vader - but you believe in extraterrestrials. Because those two things are different in your mind.
You don't believe in Casper the Friendly Ghost - but you believe in ghosts. Because those two things are different in your mind.
You don't believe in the Christian God - therefore you don't believe in God. Because those two things are the same in your mind.

That is the disconnect in your argument.

 

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Both are paranormal (or supernatural if you prefer.)

There are thousands of instances of "proof" for God. In the Roman Catholic religion alone, there are about 12,000 saints. To become a saint, a candidate must demonstrate a "true miracle," all of which are investigated by the Vatican and its agents.

There are hundreds of bits of proof for things like ghosts, spirits, poltergeists etc. that have been investigated by for-profit TV shows and paranormal investigators who make a living doing such things.

That doesn't mean that you have to believe only in God and not ghosts (or vice versa.) Or neither, or both. It just means that they are both the same basic phenomena - paranormal or supernatural beings that can't be explained by science. And they both have similar levels of proof, applied with similar rigor. In both cases, the proof comes from people who very much want to believe in the thing they are investigating.

My beef with MR is that he regularly uses arguments against (or for) one or the other, but then disregards his own arguments when applied to the other side.

 

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I think that's where this comes in:

 

Absolutely. And if you want to claim ghosts (or God) exists, this is a good forum to do it in.

But still, in any forum, no matter how science oriented, it doesn't work if you regularly change arguments:

"God listed the seven deadly sins! That's your guide! Anyone who commits them goes to hell, and is a horrible human being who should be treated like the scum they are."
"But you told us you weigh 350 pounds and you really like to eat. Isn't that gluttony?"
"That's not a sin. I am a good person. "

 

They're still obsessed with making me look like a bad person. It's the classic relentless ad homing and making it personal by the skeptics in lieu of having any real argument to make. I'm used to it.

 

I've always enjoyed your threads and insights, MR. They're fun. Things can get a bit too serious on here at times.

 

False. Real argument has been made, multiple times. You have not addressed it, instead preferring to ad hom skeptics. We're used to it.

How do you distinguish (in that video, or any other) between an act of God and an act of a ghost?

Your silence on the question, and your vociferousness on anything that deflects from the question, speaks in your stead.

 

Officially returning this conversation back to the original topic before it got derailed with off topic God talk and personal attacks on me by the skeptics. Here's that compelling video again. What do you think of it?

 

Looks like air opening and closing a door. We get that in our chimney damper all the time, even when we can't perceive any wind.

 

I've never seen air repeatedly open and slam shut a fire hose compartment door in a closed up hallway ever. Have you? Why did it suddenly stop when the cop got close to it?

 

Perhaps you have lead a too sheltered life? I'll stick to my previous draught reasons from somewhere or other.

 

I have seen several doors like that (access doors that open on shafts) slam open and closed repeatedly in a closed hallway, yes. I have never seen that particular door doing it.

One important clue is the large vent in the door, indicating the door must regularly pass large volumes of air. If you don't latch it closed, you'd expect to see it doing its own thing.

 

There'd have to be an air input hole in the compartment to blow the door open. It's not there. And that's not a vent in the door. It's a hole, which further makes air pressure building up on the inside of the compartment impossible. Furthermore, there's no air in the hallway to slam the door shut. Everything's closed up. Wind doesn't happen in closed up hallways.

 

There are quite a few explanations for it.

A prankster, a hoax, wind, God.

Do we have to take this up in the Jokes/Conspiracies/Earth-Sciences/Religion forums to discuss any hypotheses other than ghosts?

Anyway, since there is no indication whatsoever about the cause, it is pointless to pretend to hypothesize which explanation is more likely.

 

This is off-topic. Any discussions about air movement or wind should be taken up the Mechanics or Earth Sciences forums.

 

?? The fire riser is right behind it. That's a pipe that brings water from the bottom floor to the top. There are gaps around it. That makes it a shaft.

That's also why there's a big vent hole. If you DON'T put the vent hole there, then when there is a pressure difference (due to an open window somewhere, an HVAC imbalance, an elevator moving between floors etc) you get whistling as all that air moves through the smaller vents and/or the edges of the door. That's also why you have to keep it latched.

So you believe that a door with an opening in it could not be slammed open or closed by wind? LOL!

Wind happens quite a bit in large buildings, because pressures are different. And if you close up everything except for one fire-riser access door, the wind in that area can be quite strong.

 

Air opening and closing doors with no one present is an established phenomenon, demonstrably repeatable by independent third parties in a controlled setting.
Ghosts are not.

 

What did the cop report say?

And who was taking the video?

So should have two reports to quote

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Not enough air input to account for the opening of the door with a hole in it. Pressure would have to build up inside the compartment. That's not happening.

No wind source inside the compartment to push its door open. No wind source outside the compartment to slam its door shut. No wind period.

No..no wind in a closed up hallway. This is basic common sense. No source for the wind. No exit for the wind. No wind.