Religion and women.

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Xelasnave.1947, Jan 12, 2021.

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  1. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    I didn’t say it should.
    I said it naturally occurs, and as a result, it ends better for the the children.
    Again you twist my words.
    So discard the truth because it gets in the way of what you want. It called “denial”, your staple diet.
    You tell lies bilvon.
    You twist my words then pretend that’s what I meant. Even in this exchange you have lied.
    It is as if you’re part of a cult, or something

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  3. river

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    There was a time in our ancient history of Humanity when Women were respected by Men . And Men were respected by Women .
     
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  5. Sarkus Hippomonstrosesquippedalo phobe Valued Senior Member

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    When do you think that period was, river?
     
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  7. river

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    Greeks
     
  8. Sarkus Hippomonstrosesquippedalo phobe Valued Senior Member

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    Ah, yes, ancient Greece, where mostly women never acquired citizenship and were usually excluded from the democratic processes of their respective city/state (e.g. Athens).
    There were certainly some cities / states where women were treated far better, with a relatively good level of respect (compared to most), such as Sparta (although even there still excluded from politics. And from the military. They were, however, afforded respect for being the mothers of the soldiers, and because of the lack of men following a period of war, they ended up owning quite a bit of property). But on the whole, the states and cities of ancient Greece were pretty dismissive of women's rights, especially when compared to men.
     
  9. river

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    So I'am wrong then .
     
  10. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    For reference, here's what I said your position was: (my words) " . . . so they should stay at home and be mothers, and the man should be the head of the family."

    Here are your own words: "Man naturally heads over his wife and family, and his wife naturally understands that as she now has a child to develop. It is better if the man provides for his family, so that his wife can be a full time mother, for the sake of the child, and the structure in which the child is to develop."

    So again, you state that the man should provide and the woman should stay home and be a full time mother.

    Do you now deny you wrote those words?
    Your angry outbursts are always amusing. I especially enjoy them when they come right after your claims that women are overly emotional.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2021
  11. wegs Matter and Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    I believe it is to show that God has a certain “order” or structure in mind when it comes to a husband/wife relationship. But, men should also learn to live humbly and learn with humility. Learning was not generally encouraged for women by Jewish men - this could be cultural norms that would seem outlandish today. If a husband forbids his wife to educate herself on different matters, should she follow? No offense Jan, but you take advantage of this Scripture (it seems) that God has somehow given you license to treat women as inferior to men. That passage is not what it means.

    Paul uses the Adam first, Eve second as sort of a rule of thumb for how women should be considered in society. God created them both to be treated equally though, as part of a healthy society.
     
  12. parmalee peripatetic artisan Valued Senior Member

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    Yikes! You may just have exposed Jan as the pathetic, flabby "girlie man" he truly is, as opposed to the "real man" he fancies himself.



     
  13. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    • Please do not tell lies knowingly. That is a breach of our site posting guidelines.
    Either you’re lying, or you don’t understand English.
    I didn’t give an opinion on how man or woman should live. If I didn’t use the word “should”, why do you insist that I did

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    Can’t you work with what words are there?
    It is becoming clear that you are reacting to your assumptions. You are not thinking clearly.
     
  14. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    Wow!

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  15. Jan Ardena OM!!! Valued Senior Member

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    Do you accept the rule of thumb to be the right way? Or do you think God didn’t didn’t understand what He was doing?
    Do you understand God to be a He?
     
  16. river

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    Both of you , Jan Ardena and Billvon sort it out . Discuss . Where are you both at .
     
  17. river

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    Highlighted

    I do .
     
  18. river

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    The best religion includes women on equal grounds , with men . Respect .

    Humanities Evolution . The Best of Both , Together .
     
  19. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    What a dishonest hack you are, ignoring the entire substance of my posts to you in order to post this one-liner, along with your nervous tic.

    To keep asking "But how am I sexist? Show me what I've said that is sexist!" when several people have, in detail, explained it with reference to specific examples, is the behaviour of a troll.

    You're doing that in response to my posts, in response to wegs, and in response to Bells. That will stop, one way or another.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2021
  20. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Moderator note: Jan Ardena has been warned for trolling. He is a repeat offender in this regard.
     
  21. wegs Matter and Pixie Dust Valued Senior Member

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    That ''rule of thumb'' also includes men loving their wives, as Christ loved the Church. That means, you would be willing to die for your wife. Are you? That means you will consistently, persistently put your wife above your own needs. Do you? I believe that relationships, whether long term or marriage, should be complementary - men dictating to women, isn't what that passage means. It's a two-fold passage, and often times, men who are believers leave the part out about how they need to model Jesus. But they're totally on board with women being submissive. Of course, we are human Jan, so we all fall short - but striving to be more like Christ by his grace, is what the faith is about.

    I do, in terms of a triune God - Jesus was male, and part of the trinity. Sometimes people refer to any god as 'he' as was customary to say ''mankind'' at one point, instead of ''humankind.''
     
  22. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    Nothing could possibly have given you that impression. Only a dishonest troll would post that kind of thing, like you are.

    Add one more to your list of unsupported sexist claims.

    Respond to my posts, where I pointed out how your attitudes work and where they come from, and what they imply. Stop being a dishonest hack.

    Your comments have been picked apart and closely examined in all their nuances, by several people in this thread.

    Don't tell lies, Jan.

    The only person who has consistently ignored comments in this thread is you, as you know. Stop being a dishonest hack.
    Yes you do. Several people have pointed out precisely where you have "issues", with examples from your own writing, as you know.

    Stop being a dishonest hack, Jan.
    But you do. You implied that you yourself "head" your wife and daughters in your family, because they are women and are too "emotional" to act rationally. They need you to be the "sensible" one, I assume, because they are only women and not as capable at that as men.

    "Keeping them in their place" is a hateful action, Jan. It is oppressive. You seek to exert power over women by limiting the roles which you will recognise as legitimate for women to a few that you specify - such as providers of "progeny" and keepers of your house.

    Treating women as property is hateful.

    You should wake up and stop that appalling behaviour, now.
     
  23. James R Just this guy, you know? Staff Member

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    You first, Jan. What are your thoughts on these verses?

    I assume you approve of them, seeing as you thought them important enough to introduce to this thread.

    Explain to us why you approve of them.

    Try to be honest. Don't be a dishonest hack.
     
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