Having our cake and eating it too I grew up in a small town in Oklahoma at a time when it was not completely unexpected to see horses used to pull wagons and plows. These horses were fitted with a head harness that placed leather shields next to their eyes that prevented the horse from seeing to the side. The horse was blinded to anything but straight ahead, and thus they were not distracted by anything but doing their job; pulling the wagon or plow. Our educational system is designed to produce graduates who are prepared to do a job. Mental blinders are set in place such that the graduates do not waste time looking to the left or to the right, but look straight ahead at doing their job. This is what industry wants and this is what graduates of schools and colleges are prepared to do. Perhaps this is necessary. Perhaps, however, we can have our cake and eat it too. If our graduates recognize that they are not prepared, after graduation, to become critical minded independent thinking personalities they can set about immediately upon graduation to preparing them self for that role. After they have gotten their job they can devote a small amount of their time to becoming that critical minded and independent thinking personality. I suggest that one of the important things that they might usefully do after graduation is fill in that vast area of ignorance left by our vocational institutions of education; they might usefully start reading history and studying Critical Thinking. History will give them a comprehension of how our society arrived at its present position and CT (Critical Thinking) will prepare them for learning how to think and to make good judgments.
Most areas of education, sciences, etc take a lifetime of dedicated study to master, if they can master it at all. Yet you want them to also learn all of the other areas of the sciences? When will they have time to do that? Baron Max
The saying was originally, "You can't eat your cake, and have it too". Which is a true conundrum. The bastardized version of "You can't have your cake and eat it too" make no sense at all. There is an implied passing of time there that makes having a cake and also eating, not just likely, but a necessity. You must first have your cake before you can eat it. But once eating it, you no longer have it. Please help to restore this wonderful quote to its original, and meaningful state. Let's stop the madness, one cliche at a time. Edit: A quick search for the curious: http://listserv.linguistlist.org/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0206c&L=worldwidewords&P=92
Hmm, I think I disagree. The added "too" implies that there is no passage of time. I.e., "too" implies quite strictly "at the same time". Baron Max
Some people are stupid enough to go through with it. Other people recognize the faults in modern schooling, saying something like "you don't learn anything in school", and drop out. The stupid ones are the smart ones, see? So basically, the people who go through universities are not likely to see the need for such skills..
Funny, I just went to lunch and came home with some cake (honestly, it is vanilla with chocolate icing, my wife got a slice of coconut cream). I have it, and I can eat it too! But I can't eat it and have it too. The etymology on this phrase is clear, the current way of saying it is not the original way of saying it. Baron, I'm begging you, please help me in righting this wrong.
I think that our educational system has made us neurotic. Being neurotic is summarized by the statement made internally by the child who says "No father you will not have to punish me, I will punish my self." We make a similar statement regarding our educational system that has so suppressed our natural inclination to learn freely we are neurotically saying internally "No teacher you do not need to punish me I shall not learn on my own, I shall not learn anything that you have not given me to learn." Our educational system has made us fearful of learning anything that a teacher has not given us to learn.
"Made us"? Didn't make me anything. And the instinct to learn only what people, generally thought wise, think of as important, is pretty useful. It's not punishment we fear, but time and effort wasted on unimportant issues. We fear of looking stupid more than pain.
We have, since birth, learned what society expects of us and we fear that we will not be what "they" want us to be. It takes a great deal of independent learning to "know our self", independent learning is something we have been taught not to do.
"we"? "society"? "they"? You speak like you are trying to find some type of cult, and are trying to find members. "WE must unite against THEM!!! THEY make US weak!!" You're the one doing the brainwashing. Shut up. Stop running agendas here.
academic institutions are associated with education & learning what else is associated with learning? With most people not much. In my mentality these institutions are almost irrelevant to the big picture. But that's because we are of the few that have climbed high enough to see over society's imposed taboos. After graduation is so late to start thinking these things. The sooner the better because it is easier to overcome less social conditioning than more. It needs to happen on the elementary level, thats where the most impact will be. Legalize :m: while we're at it
