What can we possibly say? At any rate, my condolences. Indeed, friendly-fire incidents do occur, and it is even more unfortunate that this took place in Helmand province. The United States had received criticism from Afghan local authorities, human rights groups, and British officials for excessive methods in air strikes which have resulted in "dozens" of innocent casualties. The American government accuses that the Taliban used these civilians as human shields. Additionally, NYTimes.com provides audio of an interview with reporter David Rohde regarding this story. There are some interesting considerations in that: Sorry it had to be your boys. We'll raise a glass over here. ____________________ Notes: Rohde, David. "U.S. Bomb Kills 3 British Soldiers in Afghanistan". NYTimes.com. August 24, 2007. See http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/24/world/asia/24cnd-afghan.html Rohde, David. "Back Story". Jane Bornemeier, ed. New York Times Radio. August 24, 2007. See http://graphics8.nytimes.com/podcasts/2007/08/24/25backstory-rohde.mp3
it wouldn't be the first time. nor, i doubt, the last. here, here. edit: war like sucks giant colostomy bags.
It is a shame this has happened again. Very sad but it has and will happen on both sides as everyone well knows. My condolences to their respective loved ones.
Sorry to have to troll this one, but someone needs to reign in the cowboy peeelots in U.S armed forces. They simply are trigger happy in my opinion. I don't know they details on this incident, but most of the U.S to Canadian troops FF incidents are all cowboy, hair-trigger deals.
Why is it always you yanks that fire on friendlies? Over here we think prior to unloading a clip, not vice versa.
I wonder what the average age of your soldiers vs our soldiers is. I think ours are younger and freak out easier. I sign papers as to whether or not they can recruit my son at his high school. He will be 17 this year.
Well, as I read it in the Dallas Morning News, the Canadians had been ambushed by some Taliban fighters and were in a world of hurt. They called in the US Air Force to save their asses. And in doing so, a few were hurt and/or killed by the resulting bombing and/or shrapnel. In other words, if the Air Force hadn't been called, all of the Canadians would probably been killed by the Taliban. What would you have done? Oh, but of course, your version would have been where everything was perfect and no one even got dirty, right? Baron Max
We're the ones called in most of the time for support, so obviously if an error were to occur, we'd be involved. However, when someone calls in an airstrike, it's the guys below that give the coordinates. - N
Baron Max: "Well, as I read it in the Dallas Morning News, the Canadians had been ambushed by some Taliban fighters and were in a world of hurt. They called in the US Air Force to save their asses. And in doing so, a few were hurt and/or killed by the resulting bombing and/or shrapnel. In other words, if the Air Force hadn't been called, all of the Canadians would probably been killed by the Taliban." That doesn't add up, considering that only one (count 'em, 1) 500-pounder was delivered. It's unlikely that it took out a superior force, and it's unlikely that it improved the situation for the UK (not Canadian) soldiers. If this really had been a Bravo Zulu engagement, we could best repeat it by equipping every soldier with jet-noise generators, and personal explosive vests to be activated in times of peril before the enemy. But I doubt it would go over well on the home front, even if the troops would go along. As it stands, I'm sure a lot of British FACs have second, third, and fourth thoughts about calling in American fast-movers when things get sporty. We've been consistently sloppier than the Brits with deliveries.
I dont know, they sort of do that here : I remember an armed forces open day trip during my school days, for all the branches of defence to sell themselves. I wanted to be in the RAF but was sort of put off when I learned how difficult it was to actually get to fly a kite. I also think 17 is about the age of sign up here too.
This is true. For that matter, fratricide incidents have been a fact of life since wars have been fought, but especially since the advent of combined arms. Modern tactics of information sharing do a great deal to mitigate them, considering the close proximity with which CAS aircraft operate to blue shooters on the gound below. If anything, fratricide incidents are less within the past six years than they have ever been since mankind has been at this sort of thing. The big difference now is that we learn about them a lot faster thanks to electronic media and the internet. There is also an element of inter-operability between allied militaries that crops up in these situations and can lead to disastrous results. No matter how much we train with each other, small deviations in procedure tend to always happen, and in the heat of the moment these can snowball. A wide majority of the time everything works out well, but once in a while it doesn't (like this). Also, unless something more specific comes to light, anybody who thinks these incidents are in some way indicative of a lack of restraint by US pilots really has no way to support their reasoning beyond personal bias. Uhh...I'm not sure where you're getting this information but the GBU-38s used for CAS nowadays are usually airbursted at around 10m, giving them a lethality radius of ~60m against personnel, which is decisive as hell.
E3R: "Uhh...I'm not sure where you're getting this information but the GBU-38s used for CAS nowadays are usually airbursted at around 10m, giving them a lethality radius of ~60m against personnel, which is decisive as hell." Not if you can't put it on target.
No public answers or leaks are available on that basic question yet. Since the US DoD is keeping to the policy of refusing to provide witnesses in foreign inquiries into such matters, and proceeding slowly and cautiously in the investigation, we (and more importantly the friends & relatives of the British soldiers killed) may not have any answers for a while: Geoff Ziezulewicz, Stars and Stripes: U.K. doesn’t expect help from U.S. in probe into three deaths As in previous cases, UK coroners will not be allowed to question American witnesses. they will be limited to prepared US Military presentations. Danielle Nuttall, Suffolk and Essex Online: 'US military will not go to inquests'
it wasnt a trigger happy incident this time, as far as im aware this is what happened in basic terms. our guys were storming an outpost, we engaged in a ranged gunfight witht he enemy. we needed assistance so called in for an airstrike. the yanks responded accordingly with the strike, but they were off target slightly and hit our guys. it has happened before more than once, in this type of war it can be expected from time to time, the communications between factions needs to be tighter knit. its just that the americans seem to engage in a little too much friendly fire on an overall scale. and it doesent look good for them. peace.
