Hillary - the VP

Discussion in 'Politics' started by kmguru, Jun 4, 2008.

  1. kmguru Staff Member

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    Any prediction before Hillary accepts it. There is a push in this idea...
     
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  3. VRob Registered Senior Member

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    Nope. Especially after last nights despicable speech she gave.

    Obama doesn't need her. She will do more to energize the Repub base, turn off the Independents who support Obama, than any positives she brings.

    Oh.... and yes. The majority of her supporters will, in the end, support Obama without Hillary on the ticket.

    Biden or Webb.
     
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  5. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    No, I don't think Obama is that dumb or that desperate. Last night watching Fox, they were very scared. Their worst fear, Obama, got the nomination. The comparisons between McCain and Obama were stark and if you are a Republican very scary. Republicans are convinced they are going to loose.
    If you add Hillary you energize the Republican base and weaken his positon. In addition to errant pastors, he will have to deal witih errant husbands (wittness latest Vanity Fair article) and an ambitious running mate. These are distractions he cannot afford, but would delight the Republicans. Hillary is not an oustanding orator. She does not have a great record in the Senate or on any of the issues. They only thing she brings to the ticket are ovaries.
    There are a lot of other potential running mates with ovaries that have a lot less baggage, and could really help Obama win and carry out his agenda.
    Moreover, they have different campaign styles. Obama wants to run an energizing and morally correct, unifying campaign. Clinton has no such concerns. She has run an old style Republican/Bush type campaign (divide and conquer)...not compatible with Obama or his message.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2008
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  7. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Obama is between a rock and a hard place: if he chooses Clinton as VP he unifies the party but loses independents, if he chooses someone else he might keep independents but a large percentage of disenfranchised democrats won't vote, or worse vote for mccain.

    In short my bets are on mccain winning the election.
     
  8. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    She would help him but he could run without her, either way I really don't think whatever he does really matters for I think the country isn't going to elect him no matter how hard the Democrats try to push him into office as their :front man".
     
  9. VRob Registered Senior Member

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    658
    Apparently you missed Gomers speech last night. They'd have been better off with a tape recording and a cardboard cutout.

    I understand the racist issues we face in the General election, but they will be offset by the fact that Obama is the best candidate this nation has had in almost 50 years.
     
  10. Syzygys As a mother, I am telling you Valued Senior Member

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    As much as I might agree with the rest of what you said, first you are wrong on this one, and second, why would it matter?

    Hillary is a pretty good speaker specially without notes. But most politicans read their speeches, so it doesn't really matter. Last time I checked, I don't remember any spiritlifting Cheney speech and he still has been a VP for 7 years...
     
  11. kmguru Staff Member

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    11,757
    By now, it should be clear that 50% of the democratic and independent voters are for her. That is a very powerful block. It is not about her. The voters want inclusion. If not, the voters who may hate Obama may go for McCain, the only other choice.

    Obama may not need her but definitely needs her voting block a 50% without which, say good bye to the Presidency.
     
  12. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    I cannot see these people voting for McCain unless the want Roe v Wade overturned. The Supremes are very close to total Republican Domination. So if these hillary supporters want a Supreme Court that will take the women's movement back two decades, then they should vote for McCain...absoutely!
     
  13. kmguru Staff Member

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    11,757
    It is less about Hillary and more about Hillary supporters which is a very large voting block in all ket states. Whomever ignores them would do so with their own peril....
     
  14. clusteringflux Version 1. OH! Valued Senior Member

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    McCan't Vs yOmama?

    Republicans are convinced they've already lost. They have no candidate running.

    Anyway, there is a rumor that Obama would ask her but only if she agreed to decline.
    As stupid as this sounds, it's completely believable out of idiot politicians.
     
  15. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    22,910
    She has less than 50 percent. You are not counting the caucus states in that number and they went for Obama. But still she has a large number of folks that voted for her. A substancial number were old Clinton party supporters and those will quickly move to Obama. What percent stays with her will be substancially less.
     
  16. kmguru Staff Member

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    11,757
    Most Males and 50% females do not care about Row Vs Wade.
     
  17. 15ofthe19 35 year old virgin Registered Senior Member

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    I can't imagine how infuriating it must be to be a Democrat today. Hillary and her supporters are so angry, so bitter, that they are willing to hand McCain the election just to spite the Obamaniacs. It reminds a little bit of 2000 when the McCainiacs were threatening to do the same thing to Bush, but in the end they mostly caved and voted for him. That race was over long before the summer, but because this one has drug on for so long I'm not certain the primary hangover will be completely gone by November. That could spell doom for Obama.

    I think his best chance is to publicly put some distance between him and Hill, but privately reach out to her for her nod of support. He may still be able to catch some fish on her side of the boat, but publicly he should probably be pretty quiet about it for the summer. Both sides need a collective cooling off period. There is just way too much emotion right now for any rational meeting in the middle to beat McCain. If you've ever stumbled on to hillaryis44.org, you know what I'm talking about. That place makes the du look reasonable.

    I don't see her as a veep. Too much ego.
     
  18. VRob Registered Senior Member

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    Bullsh!t!

    Obama will get the majority of the Dems who are now supporting Hillary. The others aren't needed.

    And your numbers on the Independents who are supporting Hillary are from which fairy tail book.......?


    It most certainly IS about her.
     
  19. kmguru Staff Member

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    11,757
    I was talking about the popular vote - one vote, one person that may come handy in general election, though American system is royally screwed up. You can win on popular vote and still lose the election....
     
  20. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    I think Obama is going to wait it out, until after mccain announces his VP before he announces his, the longer they wait it out the more polling can be done to accurately determine how much damage to the party has been done.

    It should be noted when Bill Clinton got the nomination a significant percentage of democrats said they would not vote for him, then again Bill's race was not as close nor did he have a section of supporters who confided in him solely for having ovaries.
     
  21. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Yes you can win the popular vote and loose the election. But that is not what we have here. The popular vote measure is meaningless, because of the caucus state. If you use estimates in the caucus states, which is all you can do in order to have a valid comparison, hillary looses in a landslide. If you do not attempt to adjust for Michigan and the caucus states, as is the case with hillary, the popular vote numbers are pure unadulterated bull shit...to be frank.
     
  22. one_raven God is a Chinese Whisper Valued Senior Member

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    13,433
    This is what I said in two of the other threads that asked this question:
    I honestly don't think that race is as big of an issue in this as some people seem to think.
    Of course there are people that won't vote for a black man, but not enough to be concerned about.

    I personally am a big Obama supporter.
    I am just as strongly opposed to Hillry being president.
    She has no chance in hell of getting my vote, even if she had Obama as a VP.
    Her being his VP, on the other hand, would not sway my vote away from him.

    I think one of the big reasons people can't stand her is that her ambition overshadows her judgement and she is only out for Hillary.
    Accepting the VP slot could only help that image.

    Besides, all the people who would vote for her just because she is a woman will vote for him just because she is a woman.

    So many people have stated that if she wins the nomination, they would vote for McCain.

    The party is split between the two of them, but him having the top spot and her as #2 wouldn't make enough of them leave the party to have any appreciable impact.
    If he picks her as a running mate, and they get enough people energized to vote (which I think they will) they are all but guaranteed the win.

    If he doesn't, some Hillary supporters will cross party lines, and McCain stands a good chance.
     

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