ArAb SpAcE pRoGrAmS! wHy NoT!

Discussion in 'World Events' started by Shadow1, Mar 7, 2010.

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yes or no?

  1. yes

    1 vote(s)
    20.0%
  2. no

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. yes but not now, it will take time

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. maybe in the next 50 years

    4 vote(s)
    80.0%
  1. fedr808 1100101 Valued Senior Member

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    6,706
    It should be done by the end of the year, but it will only be fully operational when they finish the rocket to lift the orion capsule.
     
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  3. soullust Registered Senior Member

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    yeah that is pretty cool technology, and being able to stay on the moon for a week at a time is impressive, here is a cool vid on it.



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQs75eX9oNE
     
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  5. fedr808 1100101 Valued Senior Member

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    6,706
    wow, that is a really cool vid.
     
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  7. Pasta Registered Senior Member

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    188
    /agree

    Humanity is stagnating here on Earth. There's a whole universe out there.
     
  8. fedr808 1100101 Valued Senior Member

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    6,706
    Bull, were not stagnating here, were growing and thriving faster and better than ever before in human history. Yah there have been down sides, but there are also many upsides.
     
  9. soullust Registered Senior Member

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    1,380
    I think man should, learn more about our own planet first, damn we still don't know whats in the deepest parts of our ocean, and we want to send people to mars ?
    :shrug:
     
  10. fedr808 1100101 Valued Senior Member

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    6,706
    your barking up the wrong tree, I happen to think that the idea of us being able to form a colony permanently of any significant capacity within 100 years is ludicrous.
     
  11. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member

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    well, we can do both, but the top priorities for now, is to solve our earth resources problems, if you look deep, you'll find that we have all we need from resources, we have alot, we can get 100% satisfied, each country, can be at least 70% satesfied, but only if we used the recycling, the economising, and to respect what nature give us, and not take from it till reach the case when nature can't regerate it self, so, first we should take of our planet more, but also i'm not against the space exploration, i mean, the haul world can do both, economize, and go green, and explore space, and try to colonize, and explore deep oceans, we can do all just if helped each other.
     
  12. Pinwheel Banned Banned

    Messages:
    2,424
    Maybe we should launch Tunisia into space, land it on the moon.
     
  13. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member

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    i didnt mean to leave people on there, i meant a small base for equitements yes, and somr robots explorers to explore the moon more, and maybe find some materials on it.
     
  14. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member

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    4,160
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    lol
     
  15. soullust Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,380

    If we as a planet get over waring and become unified, then i think we could get there easily within 100 years. (To mars).

    But for now we should be devoting our selves to mining the moon, which will eventually lead to an under ground, Network of roads which we can start building a small colony, and Growing Plants up there using solar powered lights, i mean with The moons atmosphere the solar energy must be massive. (We need to spend much more research to wards solar energy). Eventually we could build an under ground Eco system on the moon.
     
  16. soullust Registered Senior Member

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    Easyer said then done, There is far too much tension in the world right now. I just hope it doesn't take ww3 to bring truly peace to this planet.
     
  17. fedr808 1100101 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    6,706
    soullust it is quite literally almost impossible to create a mining colony on the moon in the next hundred years.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2010
  18. fedr808 1100101 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    6,706
    Here is a post that I had made in another forum regarding the same topic, so a few of my statements may have been directed at people that asked questions or said things about them:

    We should not be funding NASA for colonization or mining, because the second the tax payers realized that not even their grandchildren will recieve any payoff from it they are going to stop the funding. It will be creating a fantasy dream and in ten years when it pops it can threaten the future of space exploration for decades to come.

    We should be funding NASA because we want to achieve short term goals, like 40, 50 years. The fact is the idea that NASA can realistically colonize anything in 100 to 200 years is absurd. Look at the ares V, the largest rocket to make it this far in design. And it could not even come close to being able to start a significant colony on the moon, it would take dozens of missions to ferry supplies and it's cargo, while larger than anything else, is tiny for the mission at hand. We could establish a temporary base, as in a base that is only populated when a scientific team is on the moon for short periods of time, but the idea that we could keep it going indefinitely with the Ares V is pretty silly.

    We don't even have the concept for a rocket able to colonize the moon.

    The first flaw is that the moon is a hellish place. The fact is that the astronauts will be facing two week long lunar winters and two week long winter summers, each one at their own extremes of the scale. Second off, there is no escape plan for a colony. The only way to leave the moon is to have an orion space ship in orbit to pick up the return ship from the lunar lander. You cannot keep an orion capsule orbiting indefinitely to operate as an escape ship, namely because you need someone in their to pilot it while it is orbiting and the most their supplies would last is a week or two.

    Second, why the hell would we mine the moon? That seems to be a pretty idiotic waste of money. The only things that cost a lot of money to mine or drill for, and that are efficient to extract and process, and that would make it worthwhile is oil, coal, natural gas, or any sort of fuel. And I hate to be a downer, but there's never been anything alive on the moon, none of those things exist in any amount. The only thing that would make sense are precious metals and the fact is they are such a pain in the ass to process, like it takes a ton of gold ore to make an ounce of gold. Besides the fact that doesn't anyone see it somewhat silly that a space organization whose dedication is to space exploration be forced to mine for precious metals? They wouldn't so that leaves the private industry.

    Third, the only realistic way metals would be mined is by private industries. And the fact is that the private industry's space solutions suck. They suck terribly, they can barely make it to the space station. The idea that in twenty years they could be out there mining minerals is idiotic.

    Fourth, the only realistic way to transport people and materials to and from the "colony" is through a massive dedicated spaceship. It would need to be at least twice to three times as large as the international space station, be many times more massive, have the biggest engines, the biggest cargo bays, the largest interior space, and the largest of everything ever to be put into space. It could not be launched from the ground because the sheer idea of that being remotely possible is silly. It would need to dock with the international space station, the fact is that the ISS would need to be equipped with massive fuel pumps, living quarters, storage areas, hell, it would need to at least quadruple in size, function, and life support ability. It took twelve years to get the ISS to the place it is in right now and it's not even quite finished yet. Imagine how long it would take to build this space ship and the upgrade to the ISS, I would guess thirty to forty years at least. Besides the fact that nobody has ever even designed a space ship that is to be built in space, that will dock at a space station, fly to the moon, stay in orbit for the necessary months at a time, and come back to do it all over again and do it for decades.

    Fifth, in order to resupply and unload this space ship we would need to design an all new rocket, it would have to be a new space shuttle because the fact is it would take orion dozens of launches and landings to unload it. It would still take a space shuttle like craft more than a dozen launches to unload let alone resupply the damn thing.

    Sixth, the economics of the whole thing make zero sense. Iron would be the most likely thing they would mine for and the fact is that scrap iron (which would be of similar value to the iron ore they mine) trades for eighty dollars to four hundred dollars PER TON. The cost for six apollo missions ended up being 83 billion dollars ADJUSTED for modern day inflation. Considering we'd be building a much more massive rocket, space station, lunar lander, space ship, and enclosures, we can probably guess just the cost of BUILDING these things would be in the hundreds of billions let alone just researching the tech to do it. Probably 500 billion dollars would be the total cost of the entire project before it even set foot on the moon. So can somebody explain to me how it is realistic to spend 500 billion dollars to mine something that is worth only 80 dollar per ton to 400 dollars per ton anyways?

    Seventh, the arguement that we are overpopulating the earth and need to expand to space is pretty silly if not completely arrogant. Our population is what? 6 billion people? How many people would have to be moved to a colony on the moon in order to actually make a dent in that. I would say around a billion people, or at the least 750 million people. That would mean making an enclosed bubble the size of a country. And lets remember that we would have to bring everything, even the freaking dirt! The lunar soil never had anything organic in it, it would have near zero nutritional content for crops and plants. That means that for the necessary farms we would need to transport tens of millions of tons of soil to the moon.

    The fact is that even if we were willing to do these things, we don't even have the technology ready to attempt them in any way.

    Anyone that tells you it is realistic to colonize the moon in less than 100-200 years is either high or trying to sell something.
     
  19. soullust Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,380
    Fed i agree with you 100 %.

    If it is just NASA involved, but if we worked as a planet then things may get done faster, Problem is with all these damn terrorist groups, and moronic governments (North Korea,Iran). I don't see us doing anything for another 100 years or so either.
     
  20. fedr808 1100101 Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    6,706
    Look here soullust, I am one the biggest advocates of the planet uniting under a scientific banner. Im actually one of the few and one of the first here that believes it to be possible.

    But to get a colony in 100 years done even with the whole world helping is impossible. There are certain things that fundamentally take a while to accomplish, it doesnt matter how much effort is put in you cant rush them. The fact is to make a feasible long term colony is impossible. To get humanity to unite in 50 years alone is just as unlikely.
     
  21. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member

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    lol, hope no ww3, the ww3, would destroy life on earth,

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    and tension? not where in my area and my continent side, also, just keep your self open, and don't brain wash your self with media and proganada stuff, keep it clean, and open
     
  22. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member

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    ok... ... ... but i'm really surprised you didnt say islamic terrorist!!! :jawdrop: wow, inless your forgot to say it
     
  23. Shadow1 Valued Senior Member

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    haha, i bet you can never unite the hall humanity, but if you mean unions yes, large unions, and then an international unions that contain all those unions,

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