God: Pro-life?

Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by eddie monkey, Mar 15, 2003.

  1. eddie monkey FU Registered Senior Member

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    Every Church that I know of opposes abortion vehemently, but let's look at the Old Testament. From my religous studies I know that God ordered the Jewish people to attack neighboring tribes and practice what was known as "the ban," a ruthless pillaging of cities. Part of the ban was taking swords and cutting open pregnant women and removing the fetuses to prevent the child from growing up and taking revenge out on the Jewish people (most likely killing the mother in the process).

    So, does God support abortion?
     
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  3. Bebelina kospla.com Valued Senior Member

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    That's an impossible question to answer.
    What the church thinks and what everybody else thinks, are all part of "God". Paradoxes seems to be the food for thought we are supposed to eat.
     
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  5. Taken Registered Senior Member

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    For the sake of the argument at hand we would first have to assume everything MAN did in the name of God was in fact inspired or ordained by God. I can only speak for myself when I say thats a bandwaggon Im not willing to catch a ride on.
     
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  7. Bebelina kospla.com Valued Senior Member

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    I don't think we can ever detach ourselves from "God", since in my opinion what we call God is just the sum of all that is, a collective consciousness where all thoughts are formed together.
    So even the "bad" actions made in the name of God, are actually Gods will, otherwise they would not happen.

     
  8. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Bebe

    I don't think we can ever detach ourselves from "God", since in my opinion what we call God is just the sum of all that is, a collective consciousness where all thoughts are formed together.

    Instead, why don't we just detach ourselves from the label' "God" so as not to cause confusion.
     
  9. Taken Registered Senior Member

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    I see your line of reasoning and in that aspect I have to agree. But if you subscribe to the seperation of the physical element and the spiritual element and realise that the desires that will harm another are driven by physical needs and the desire to do well and passion are driven by the spiritual. Call it soul, spirit, concouse..or any other term. I see our conection as spiritual, our physical connection is based solely on composition and source & that it houses the spirit that binds.
     
  10. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Taken

    But if you subscribe to the seperation of the physical element and the spiritual element and realise that the desires that will harm another are driven by physical needs and the desire to do well and passion are driven by the spiritual.

    I would separate the two, that is, if one were shown to exist. The spiritual has not been shown to exist, neither have souls. Everything which you describe is of a physical nature – good or bad.
     
  11. Taken Registered Senior Member

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    Go to icu...does a beating heart or even brain waves constitute life as such as you are alive? Can we transport life from one physical body to another? There is an undeniable element to life beyond explainable chemical reaction.....Even Einstein recognized and took joy in that...was he an irrational heretic?

    PS...allow me to once again reitterate that invisible gravity was in place and working perfectly even befor we had an equation to define and quantify it.
     
  12. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Taken

    Even Einstein recognized and took joy in that...was he an irrational heretic?

    It really is interesting how many people love to use Einstein in there analogies, yet can never come up with any valid cites.

    allow me to once again reitterate that invisible gravity was in place and working perfectly even befor we had an equation to define and quantify it.

    Please tell me then, what is the equation for souls and/or spirits? How do you define and quantify them? Are they also working perfectly?
     
  13. Taken Registered Senior Member

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    599
    Had a man not reasoned there was a force he could not comprehend at work and seek to define it we would have no equation for gravity. Not ALL men agreed with him that there was anything there to define...but he persisted untill he was victoriouse and all those in opposition, thinking him a fool, stood in awe.
    NO, we can not define or quantify life or a soul...but there are men who believe a force exists and they persist in trying to define it. Perhaps one day one will perservere.

    "A human being is a part of the whole called by us "Universe." A part
    limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and
    feelings as something separated from the rest -- a kind of optical
    delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us,
    restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons
    nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by
    widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the
    whole of nature in its beauty." -- Albert Einstein


    "It would be possible to describe everything scientifically, but it would make no sense; it would be without meaning, as if you described a Beethoven symphony as a variation of wave pressure." -- Albert Einstein

    "As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain; as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality."--Albert Einstein

    God doesn't play dice.
    -- Albert Einstein

    "Before God we are all equally wise - and equally foolish." --Albert Einstein (1879-1955)

    "There are only two ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle." --A. Einstein

    "Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence." --Einstein, Albert

    "What really interests me is whether God had any choice in the creation of the world." --Albert Einstein

    "If you are out to describe the truth, leave elegance to the tailor."--Albert Einstein
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2003
  14. Darwin Disciple Evo v CS advocate Registered Senior Member

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    The spirit or soul is an immaterial entity that exist from the thoughts and emotions of the human that possesses it. Can we prove thoughts and emotions? Perhaps not. Our interpretation of this world is based on our thoughts and emotions and we all live differently which leads to a varied look on life.
     
  15. Taken Registered Senior Member

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    One more tid bit of info...a much larger percentage of Scientist attend church on a regular basis than that of the general public. That is a valid statistic.
    So the very Men whose rational and concrete thinking, methods, and discoveries are used most often to back the NON belief in the existance of God are far more likely to believe that God does in fact exist.
    Just something to chew on.
    Peace.
     
  16. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Taken

    NO, we can not define or quantify life or a soul...but there are men who believe a force exists and they persist in trying to define it. Perhaps one day one will perservere.

    Who are these men?

    One more tid bit of info...a much larger percentage of Scientist attend church on a regular basis than that of the general public. That is a valid statistic.

    Can you cite this so-called, “valid statistic?”

    So the very Men whose rational and concrete thinking, methods, and discoveries are used most often to back the NON belief in the existance of God are far more likely to believe that God does in fact exist.

    That doesn’t make much sense at all. Rational minds think rationally, therefore they would not think gods existed since they know of no such evidence exists. What would give them reason to think gods existed?

    BTW – Einstein was an atheist. I think you read too much into those quotes and are taking them somewhat out of context in regards to this discussion.
     
  17. Darwin Disciple Evo v CS advocate Registered Senior Member

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    I think he means Christian Scientists.
     
  18. (Q) Encephaloid Martini Valued Senior Member

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    Christian Scientists

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    Isn't that an oxymoron similar to, "Jumbo Shrimp" and "Military Intelligence"?
     
  19. Darwin Disciple Evo v CS advocate Registered Senior Member

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  20. Taken Registered Senior Member

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    allow me to point out of christianity that if you do not define God by their terms you are not acceptably able nor welcome to carry the lable....nor would you want to given the state men have put it in. I for instance am considered "backslid" because I dared to question.

    Pagans are not "Christians"...not because they dont believe in something but because they dont accept the christian definitions.

    Einstein was willing to conceade to something larger...just not in the terms christians wanted him to. I NEVER said he was a Christian so no need to come to his defense on that one.

    I dont post all info to begin with since we were asked not to eat up the bandwith and because if you really wanted to know its a search engine away...this conversation has in fact been had citing that statistic on this very board before. Id prefer to be open to a discusion of ideas as opposed to a trial of prove every sentence for someones satisfaction. We gain so much more that way.

    So by your thinking...Columbus was not rational, Einstein was not rational, Newton was not rational....
    Can you prove to me you exist outside of some delusion I am suffering in an altered state of concousness?
    Its not a matter of proof, its a matter of being open to the possibilitys and searching out the plausibility of an idea that leads us to discovery...you my friend would have had Columbus' eulogy pre written and been found dead wrong at the end of his trip.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2003
  21. Bebelina kospla.com Valued Senior Member

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    Lovely Q.

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    Taken, when I said all that is, I meant all that is, the spiritual and physical existances and all in between, together.

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  22. Bebelina kospla.com Valued Senior Member

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    Well, if the word God is "taken" by the christians, what should one call it?
    All that is, collective consciousness, the sum of existance...they are all so long to write..and all the other labels already there doesn't quite match either, because they are often connected to a specific worldview that I can't share.
    Maybe we should just call it "it"?
     
  23. Cris In search of Immortality Valued Senior Member

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    9,199
    Or in other words NATURE.

    Which was pretty much what Spinoza said and to which Einstein stated was the god he believed.
     

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