Men and their deteriorating moral and family values.

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Greatest I am, Mar 13, 2012.

Page 2 of 7
  1. GeoffP

    GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    22,087
    Well... it is kind of a progression here.
     
    GeoffP, Mar 16, 2012
    #21

  2. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  3. Bells

    Bells Staff Member

    Messages:
    24,270
    Interesting..

    But then:

    Tell me, do you teach your sons to view women and men as being 'skanks and whores'? Since you sit down with your sons to talk about the 'skanks and whores' they went to school with, I am assuming you have also taught your sons who classifies as a 'skank' and a 'whore'? How exactly did you explain that to your sons?

    What kind of parent teaches their sons to view their fellow human beings in such a fashion?

    You see, I find it interesting that you rant about how parents allow their children to act and yet, here you are, talking to your son's about the children they went to school with and you describe them as 'skanks and whores'..

    I take it if your sons turn out to be misogynistic twats, we can blame you for that? Because you not only allowed them to act that way, but you also taught them to be that way by teaching them to look at women (and men) as 'skanks and whores'.

    Much better to allow our male children to view girls and women as 'skanks' and 'whores'.

    Because to be a real man and a real 'head of the family', one has to teach one's son's about the skanks and whores their children go to school with. To be a real man, one must teach one's son that the girls they go to school with are 'skanks' and 'whores'.

    By talking to them about the skanks and whores they went to school with?

    Is that setting a good example? To view women in such a way?

    Wow..

    It is truly a miracle that you can type with your knuckles dragging along the ground like that. Really astounding..

    Certainly.

    Because there will always be boys and men out there who were taught by their fathers to view women and girls as 'skanks and whores'..
     
    Bells, Mar 16, 2012
    #22

  4. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  5. Cifo

    Cifo Day destroys the night, Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    685
    What you say is absolutely true, but now the pendulum has swung to the other extreme, and children and their well-meaning protectors have far too much power. True, years ago, if kids said that Father Murphy or Mr Smith touched them or that their parents abused them, they'd get a smack and a reprimand for saying such awful things about supposedly good people.

    But now, as we have seen, well-intentioned protectors will as much as psychologically abuse children until they invent stories to tell these protectors what they want to hear: that their daycare providers molested them, etc, etc. Or kids will threaten adults with false molestation/abuse claims if they don't get what they want. Allowing children to wield such near-absolute power is also abusive to the children.

    And it's guilty until proven innocent (and such proof is next to impossible), which both the kids and the adults know, and which undoubtedly has led adults to plead guilty to a lesser and included charges (such as indecent assault instead of rape, or assault and battery instead of indecent assault, or pleading to three counts instead of the original ten, etc) in hopes of having some sort of life to live. Hopefully, they don't end up on a sexual offender registry.
     
    Cifo, Mar 16, 2012
    #23

  6. Google AdSense Guest Advertisement



    to hide all adverts.
  7. billvon

    billvon Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    21,644
    Since birth control requires education, and is a lot more complex than abstinence, your argument doesn't hold much water. And especially given that:

    1) sex today is potentially more deadly than it was 100 years ago and thus
    2) parents have to talk to their kids MORE about sex today than ever before
    3) abortion rates are down and
    4) teen pregnacies are down

    I'm not too worried that "parents just don't care." Some, of course, do not - but fortunately those are in the minority, and per the data, that number is dwindling.

    Of course some fail to do that, but that's far from a new issue - and given that teenage pregnancies are going down steadily, there are fewer of those irresponsible parents nowadays.

    =====================

    Rebecca Wind

    February 19, 2004
    U.S. Teenage Pregnancy Rate Drops For 10th Straight Year
    Rates Declined in Every State and the District of Columbia

    In 2000, 83.6 in 1,000 women aged 15-19 became pregnant-a 28% decline from 1990, when the teenage pregnancy rate reached a high of 116.9 per 1,000 women. Declines also took place among all racial and ethnic groups and in every state in 2000, according to new data from The Alan Guttmacher Institute. The teenage birth and abortion rates also declined between 1990 and 2000. (Pregnancies are calculated as the sum of births, miscarriages (including stillbirths) and abortions.)

    Teenage pregnancy rates in 2000 varied widely by state, ranging from 42 pregnancies per 1,000 women aged 15-19 in North Dakota to 113 per 1,000 in Nevada. The rate in the District of Columbia was 128 per 1,000.

    Declines also occurred among adolescents in all racial and ethnic groups. The pregnancy rate among black women aged 15-19 declined 32% between 1990 and 2000 to 153 per 1,000 women; among white teenagers it declined 28% to 71 per 1,000. The rate among Hispanic teenagers fell 15% from 1992-2000 (following a brief increase from 1990-1992) to 139 per 1,000.

    Previous research suggests that both declines in sexual activity and increased use of more effective contraceptives are responsible for the continued declines in teenage pregnancy. An analysis by researchers at The Alan Guttmacher Institute found that about 25% of the decline in teenage pregnancy between 1988 and 1995 was due to decreased sexual activity, while 75% was due to more effective contraceptive practice. This analysis utilized sexual behavior data from the 1995 National Survey of Family Growth (NSFG). The next NSFG has not yet been completed.
    ==============================
     
    billvon, Mar 16, 2012
    #24
  8. aaqucnaona

    aaqucnaona This sentence is a lie Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    1,620
    It is insane for a man to just walk after inventing the wheel. Times are changing and we must change too. We cannot expext to become better if you try to pull ourselves back. You are talking about rustic, archaic and often useless ideas such as absolutism of parents, the idealism of patriarchy and absurd morality - you would next consider the rise of the informed non-believers, now 1.3 billion in number, an abomination! I understand the world isnt what it used to be and it damn well isnt turning out to be what you wanted, but the path we are on seems to be the path of tomorrow. Please forgive my arrogance, but we are the future and if you dont like, give us a better way than the one we have! Dont complain, do something, come up with some ideas that can compete with and prove themselves better than progressive, individualistic and scientific sceptical ideology that seems to be taking hold of the of the masses. If your ideas are indeed better, we will undoubtedly accept them, I atleast will. But the old ones have already been rejected - because they are no longer good enough or proper enough!
     
    aaqucnaona, Mar 16, 2012
    #25
  9. Bells

    Bells Staff Member

    Messages:
    24,270
    Who is this "we" of which you speak when you say this:

    But now, as we have seen, well-intentioned protectors will as much as psychologically abuse children until they invent stories to tell these protectors what they want to hear: that their daycare providers molested them, etc, etc. Or kids will threaten adults with false molestation/abuse claims if they don't get what they want. Allowing children to wield such near-absolute power is also abusive to the children. ​


    I would like you to provide evidence of this extraordinary claim. I am sure since you are so sure, there would be a plethora of scientific research into this. So please provide links to some such findings from such studies.
     
    Bells, Mar 16, 2012
    #26
  10. Arioch

    Arioch Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    2,274
    @Bells --

    Of course Cifo won't provide the citations you request because they don't exist.
     
    Arioch, Mar 17, 2012
    #27
  11. Bells

    Bells Staff Member

    Messages:
    24,270
    Well Cifo had better provide proof of his claims that parents psychologically abuse their children until the children make up claims that they have been abused and/or that children make up abuse stories so that they can blackmail people to get what they want, or he can retract. His claims that "as we have all seen" is interesting as I have worked with many child abuse cases and frankly, I do not see what he purports that "we have all seen". Quite the contrary. So I await his proof of his very broad claim with a lot of interest.

    So Cifo, can you please provide proof that parents psychologically abuse their children until the children cry abuse by others (such as daycare workers, etc) and also proof that children will make up abuse stories to blackmail people so that they can get what they want? Such claims do have to be backed up with evidence.
     
    Bells, Mar 17, 2012
    #28
  12. Cifo

    Cifo Day destroys the night, Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    685
    Here you go. I don't know where you were in the 1980s and 1990s when all this was going on. A couple of the cases were very prominent in my area, and as a father of young children back then, I took a keen interest in the hysteria that was being uncovered about these crazy accusations and convictions.

    Day-care sex-abuse hysteria, perhaps the most obscene hysteria was the Wenatchee child abuse prosecutions involving 43 adults arrested on 29,726 charges of child sex abuse, involving 60 children in 1995.

    No Crueler Tyrannies. Try watching the one-hour video of Pulitzer Prize winning author Dorothy Rabinowitz on this webpage. She can't remember some facts, and she get a few wrong, but she describes the essence of the hysteria well enough.

     
    Cifo, Mar 17, 2012
    #29
  13. Bells

    Bells Staff Member

    Messages:
    24,270
    Did you actually read the first link you provided?

    The wiki link which detailed the mass hysteria of the 80's and 90's? It started when mentally ill people made the first accusations and spiralled from there into the moral panic that followed.

    However, one thing you seem to fail to have noticed in your own link:


    Some studies have shown that only a small percentage of children produce fictitious reports of sexual abuse on their own. Some studies have shown that children understate occurrences of abuse.​


    One of the main aspects of those cases was not that the parents had coached the children, but actually the manner in which they were questioned by the police and the psychologists who were brought in to interview the children in each case..

    You have stated that parents psychologically abuse their children so that their children will accuse others of sexual abuse. The links you provided offered no proof of that. You also claimed that children fabricate abuse so as to blackmail adults to get what they want. Again, none of the links you provided show evidence or proof of that.

    The day care abuse cases cited on that page were at first started by people who suffered from extreme mental illness and the police and authorities questioned the children in such a way as to coach the children and influence their testimony. It is not the first time that society has seen a case of large scale moral panic in regards to satanic rituals. The Salem Witch Trials was another such case. Note the connection between the satanic day care abuse cases allegations and those of the witch trials..

    And something you also need to keep in mind when considering rates of false allegations when it comes to child sex abuse.

    Reporting rates may also be substantially below actual rates of abuse as many victims do not disclose their abuse, which may result in an overrepresentation of false allegations due to the inaccurate estimation of actual cases of abuse.​


    So can you please provide proof that parents psychologically abuse their children into forcing them to falsely accuse others of child sexual abuse and can you please also provide evidence that children make up instances of abuse to blackmail adults into giving them what they want. Thank you.
     
    Bells, Mar 17, 2012
    #30
  14. Cifo

    Cifo Day destroys the night, Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    685

    Bells, I never mentioned parents, mothers, fathers, guardians, etc psychologically abusing their children. You're accusing me of something I didn't do. Sound familiar?? QED.


    Bells. I forgot that this thread was on the same forum that you attend. As far as I'm concerned, you have abuse issues, because you and I have been down this road before without resolution. I forgive you, but that doesn't mean that I will continue to post here with you defaming me. I do not intend to post in this thread again. This reminds me of Gresham's law, "Bad money drives out good". In this case, bad posts drive out good.

    I am reporting your defamation to the moderators, and I will do so again if your defamation continues. You mental problems need to be kept on a very short leash. The solution to your mental problems is not for you to abuse others anonymously on the Internet.

    Bells, you are an abuser, and you need to recognize this and to address it. I'm sorry for you, and I'm sorry that you suffer from this sickness. Please seek professional help immediately.
     
    Cifo, Mar 17, 2012
    #31
  15. Greatest I am

    Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,740
    Do you know of any other time in history where parents cared so little for their children and morality and knowingly continued to drive their national debts so high that the upcoming generations knew full well that they would never be able to pay off their parents debts; thanks to the fact that their parents did not control their varied passions and self-centeredness?

    Not caring enough about our children and not controlling our various passions is certainly giving our children a good example. Not.


    We are destroying the very environment that they will need to live in as they pay for our abuses. Shame on us.

    All this goes against the old moral adage of leaving thinks equal or better than what we found.

    Regards
    DL
     
    Greatest I am, Mar 17, 2012
    #32
  16. Greatest I am

    Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,740
    I can only repeat.

    Do you know of any other time in history where parents cared so little for their children and morality and knowingly continued to drive their national debts so high that the upcoming generations knew full well that they would never be able to pay off their parents debts; thanks to the fact that their parents did not control their varied passions and self-centeredness?

    Not caring enough about our children and not controlling our various passions is certainly giving our children a good example. Not.


    We are destroying the very environment that they will need to live in as they pay for our abuses. Shame on us.

    All this goes against the old moral adage of leaving thinks equal or better than what we found.

    Further, are you aware of any other time where the PTA groups were advocating for dress codes so that tube tops and short skirts ridding up girl's asses will not be there to distract students from learning?

    Many already come out of high school being too illiterate to read let alone write college or university exams.

    How stupid do we want our children to be?

    Regards
    DL
     
    Greatest I am, Mar 17, 2012
    #33
  17. Bells

    Bells Staff Member

    Messages:
    24,270
    What defamation?

    Are you suggesting that my asking you to provide evidence of your claims is defamation?

    That's a new one, Cifo.

    At no time was my post attacking or rude to you. Quite the contrary. I merely asked you to prove your case in a polite and concise manner, which you failed to do.

    You, on the other hand, have just insulted and abused me, as well as defamed me and made some very serious allegations against me by saying that I am an abuser, and all without any form of proof or evidence whatsoever. So report me to the moderators if you wish. However keep in mind that they will read this whole thread, as well as my posts to you and your responses to me.

    So I challenge you, Cifo, to provide evidence that I am apparently an 'abuser', have 'abuse issues' and that I am mentally ill.

    I will be issuing you with a warning for your behaviour and if you wish to have that reviewed, you are free to contact the administrators of this site and seek a review. And don't worry, I'll be seeking a review myself.

    And just so you know, I am still waiting for you to prove your earlier claims, which you made in this thread and are now appearing to try to get out of it by making things up about me, which is tantamount to trolling, insulting behaviour and flaming.
     
    Bells, Mar 17, 2012
    #34
  18. Greatest I am

    Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,740
    Yes. Mostly from religions who refuse to give women equality because their good book tells them not to.

    As to my discussions with my sons on skanks and whores.
    They broached and talked of that and I listened.

    Try listening to your children.

    Attack me all you like. I do not care.
    It likely shows more your thoughts and action than mine.
    The message still remains true and accurate.

    Regards
    DL
     
    Greatest I am, Mar 17, 2012
    #35
  19. Greatest I am

    Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,740
    + 1

    I have not been a victim of my children but know for a fact that some of my friends have.

    Regards
    DL
     
    Greatest I am, Mar 17, 2012
    #36
  20. Bells

    Bells Staff Member

    Messages:
    24,270
    You see, here is the difference between you and I. You view it as normal that your sons would even view women as skanks and whores. And with your attitudes in this thread, it begs the question, where did they get such views from?

    If either of my son's ever came to me or their father to discuss 'skanks and whores', it would show that we had failed our son's fundamentally and we would have failed society and women in society terribly, because it would show to us, as their parents, that we have somehow missed our son's turning into misogynistic prats.

    You, on the other hand, seem to view it with a sense of pride that your sons sat down with you and talked about the 'skanks and whores' they went to school with. If my son's ever held that view of women, I'd be horrified, not proud.

    What is even more astounding is that you make sarcastic comments about 'the good book' telling men not to consider women as equals, but you also seem to believe that your son's viewing any woman as a 'skank or a whore' is perfectly acceptable. That you view women in that light, is hypocritical of you.

    Tell me, what is a skank and a whore? How did you teach your sons to identify women or girls as being skanks and whores? It is attitudes like yours, which you have unfortunately passed onto your sons, which results in men not viewing women as being equals..
     
    Bells, Mar 17, 2012
    #37
  21. Greatest I am

    Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,740
     
    Greatest I am, Mar 17, 2012
    #38
  22. Greatest I am

    Greatest I am Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    3,740
    My wife basically set those standard but they mostly learned from their peers.

    The fact that your children cannot recognize girls that dress like skanks and act like whores says that it is you who has failed your duty to teach your children what skanks and whore are.

    Are you suggesting that there are no skanks or whores in our schools?

    Regards
    DL
     
    Greatest I am, Mar 17, 2012
    #39
  23. Cifo

    Cifo Day destroys the night, Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    685

    I received your warning, thank you. I am now attempting to contact the owner of sciforums.com and will report this matter to the top.

    Not only did I prove my case by providing you with links to those day-care sex-abuse hysteria cases that "well-intentioned protectors ... psychologically abuse children", but I also explicitly showed you that I said "protectors" and that "I never mentioned parents, mothers, fathers, guardians, etc psychologically abusing their children". And yet you seemingly ignore this and continue to accuse me of something I didn't do. Does this sound familiar?

    Here, let me help you understand the difference between protector and parent.

    protector
    n.
    A person who protects or defends someone or something.

    parent
    n.
    A father or mother.

    If I meant "parent", I would have said "parent", but I never said "parent" and I wish you would stop saying that I did. I said "protector" as in "Child Protective Services", "Department of Family and Protective Services", and so on. The material in the links that I provided you clearly showed that it was these "protectors", including police and prosecutors (who swear to serve and protect the public), who psychologically abused children.

    In the one case that I pointed out, nearly 30,000 child abuse charges were dropped because the police or prosecutors or investigative arms of the court had obtained false memories from little children. Obtaining false memories from children means that the interviewer/abuser relentlessly coerced the children to admit to something that never happened. To do so is psychological child abuse.

    It is now a well-known fact that little children will eventually say almost anything to satisfy the adults around them. Thank God. Thank God for the sake of the children and the innocent victims.
     
    Cifo, Mar 17, 2012
    #40
Page 2 of 7

Share This Page