The NSA is Coming to Town!

Discussion in 'Politics' started by wallarookiller, Dec 17, 2013.

  1. wallarookiller Registered Senior Member

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    18
    I'm sure everyone here knows all about the NSA and it's massive spying program. Well not everyone does. That's why the ACLU is campaigning to raise awareness. They just released this parody video of Santa is Coming to Town. It's pretty good actually.

    [video=youtube;8pcWlyUu8U4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pcWlyUu8U4[/video]

    https://www.aclu.org/secure/stopnsa?ms=oth_ acluaction_131212_stopnsa_yt
     
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  3. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    The NSA is not a bunch of annoying santas running around getting in your face. The NSA is mostly a bank of computer servers invisibly tracking everything you do and collating, compiling and deriving statistics off that and then flagging you if your activities statistically match patterns of interest... so if say you have two or more "Muhammads" in your contacts that you have emailed or call you will find your self getting anally probe regularly at every major US airport, thank you NSA!
     
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  5. wallarookiller Registered Senior Member

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    Well that's kind of the point of what the ACLU is trying to do. Bring the idea of what they're doing to the average American. Showing Santa's running around taking your picture and filming you makes more sense to most people than a giant computer bank in Utah doing massive calculations on you and everyone else looking for patterns.
     
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  7. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

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    The question is really who the NSA is spying on.
     
  8. Mazulu Banned Banned

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    Viewers of internet porn. The NSA knows what you like, wink, wink.
     
  9. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah but the server just is not as invasive and annoying as in-your face santas. I honestly don't have a problem with NSA mainframe watching everything I do over my shoulder, its a cold, emotionless machine, but I have a problem if actual humans are tracking me.
     
  10. Watcher Just another old creaker Registered Senior Member

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    The question is WHEN someone will do something illegal with that data, even if the current use falls within constitutional protection of privacy (which I doubt). That's the real problem. That data can be mined FOREVER once it is stored. Therefore it should not be harvested and stored in the first place.
     
  11. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Well why not just install more oversight?
     
  12. Watcher Just another old creaker Registered Senior Member

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    Not sure you are being serious with that reply. The dilemma is that in the US, administrations change, the overseers change, and the political scenery flip-flops frequently. Not to mention that the technologies for "data visualization" improve every day. Therefore there is not guarantee that such oversight would remain effective. However, if the data is not harvested in the first place, there is no concern.
     
  13. Syzygys As a mother, I am telling you Valued Senior Member

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    12,671
    It is easy, everybody. It would be interesting to know whom they are not spying on...
     
  14. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    So we should not harvest said data and just close our ears and eye to what ever our out there? I'm willing to take the chance some NSA goon is jacking off to my porn collection as long as there a good chance said goon can also thwart a terrorist attack. And that is, for good or bad, the logic of most Americans today and hence why most Americans don't really care about the NSA issue: they have balanced the idea that sure there phone and texting transactions are being watch, but as long as they keep the terrorist down, its worth it.

    What is needed is a convincing argument the NSA could use this so call 'meta'-data for Hoover/Nixon level corrupt nefariousness, so far I have yet to see it. Be imaginative tell me if you were a corrupt evil demon working in the NSA or above, say a Dick Cheney type, what exactly could you do with all that meta-data?
     
  15. Xevious Truth Beyond Logic Registered Senior Member

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    Electric, I don't like the idea that all this stuff was legalized by secret laws, or suspects showing up in secret courts. The more the US Government hides from it's citizens the more potential for abuse there is in such a system. I know your argument - "IF you aren't doing anything wrong you have nothing to hide." but since this information is SECRET and not public record, it would not be impossible for a highly placed politician to have embarrassing information manufactured and inserted into the NSA record, and then it be turned around and used for blackmail and extortion, or destroying your public image. Your legal record is supposed to be something free and easy to research and able to be held up to public scrutiny to keep your good name. But if you are smeared using secret information which they can't tell you how they got, how are you to defend yourself?
     
  16. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Well those are different issues, if the NSA can collect meta-data is a different issue from, "should they do so in secret" and "should suspect be tried in secret courts?".

    Sure sure but what exactly is being hidden right now? We know the NSA has been doing this, heck we even knew before Snowden!

     
  17. Xevious Truth Beyond Logic Registered Senior Member

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    The court of Public Opinion (open media) is a serious issue. Herman Cain for example was accused in the 2008 election of having an affair. The allegations were proven false, but it took Cain 4 years to clear his name and he was completely knocked out of the Presidential election. You don't have to have a legal case to ruin someone.

    EDIT: But you CAN shake someone up really badly using the legal system, even if you can't force them into jail.
     
  18. Captain Kremmen All aboard, me Hearties! Valued Senior Member

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    The NSA Computer analysing sciforums.

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!


    Cannot Com-pute. Insanity!
     
  19. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    By the logic (and rather truthfully) anyone can fuck with someone with false allegations, be it the NSA or some harlot, the NSA though has much more to loss. Frankly public apathy toward their doing could very easily turn to total outrage and condemnation but publicly and via the elected officials, we all agree the NSA doing are uncomfortable and just barely skirting the law, accual proof of abuse or corrupt could cause them to be burned to a grown by angry rioters (metaphorically)

    But Xevious I look into it and found something you might like: Take this case of the NSA tracking pornographic website viewing and lewd texting of 6 "muslims radicalizers" to consider ways of publically discredit them. Technically none of them appear to be US citizens, so, you know, "anything goes", but more likely most people don't give a dam because they are muslims and thus "terrorists" in the american public's minds. Of course the slippery slope remains that what stopping them from doing this to non-muslims, red blooded, "Fuck-Yeah!" Amerikans? Well aside for the law of course, but yes perhaps some more oversight is needed, but I would go as far as questioning spying like that on even foreigners, it just fucking low! Like scum of the earth, low!! Yeah sure it not like a drone strike I guess, but if they have done something that can warrant a drone stike then throwing some mud at them like publicizing what porn they download is just unnecessary... unless of course they are drone striking people that have not done or assisted terrorist in any way other then being fundamentalist Muslims, and being foreigners, because it goes without saying that if they are US citizens then we certainly can't drone strike them or throw shit in their face. That fucked up, we should only be able to drone strike people that we can get UN level approval for their assassination, regardless if they are US citizens or not, and certainly we should not be chucking shit at anyone because it is morally pathetic and should be beneath us!
     

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