The Times are a changing.

Discussion in 'World Events' started by Saturnine Pariah, Feb 11, 2014.

  1. Saturnine Pariah Hell is other people Valued Senior Member

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    Last edited: Feb 12, 2014
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  3. Saturnine Pariah Hell is other people Valued Senior Member

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    Well, America you're making some progress but you've still got some catching up to do.

    These Countries are far more ahead of the United States: They all outright legalized gay marriage.
    The Netherlands: April 1, 2001
    Belgium: June 1, 2003
    Spain: July 3, 2005
    Canada: July 20, 2005
    South Africa: November 30, 2006
    Norway: January 1, 2009
    Sweden: May 1, 2009
    Portugal: June 5, 2010
    Iceland: June 27, 2010
    Argentina: July 22, 2010
    Denmark: June 15,2012
    Brazil: May 14, 2013
    France: May 29, 2013
    Uruguay: August 5, 2013
    New Zealand: August 19, 2013
    Britain (England and Wales) (Not Yet in Effect)
     
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  5. CptBork Valued Senior Member

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    Homosexuals and heterosexuals the world over are united in their dislike of Vladimir Putin; he did rights activists outside Russia the biggest favour they could have ever asked for. Gay rights issues have even had a substantial impact on elections in socially conservative Alberta, Canada, where the right-wing Wildrose Party was defeated by the more centrist Progressive Conservatives largely because of some bigoted anti-gay comments one of their members made right before the election, comments their leader now terms a "bozo eruption". Even most people not generally familiar or tolerant to alternative lifestyles don't appreciate loose cannons stirring up unnecessary trouble and causing unnecessary suffering. In the next elections, virtually ever political party in the province from left to right is planning to run on a platform which makes a hard push for gay votes.
     
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  7. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    In the U.S., politics often operate from the bottom up, rather than top-down. Gay marriage has been advancing steadily and is now legal in 17 of the 50 states. The nation's capital, Washington D.C. (the District of Columbia is not a state, is not located within a state, and has a unique relationship with the federal government, but has considerable political autonomy) legalized it in 2009. At that moment, gay marriage was legal in the three capital cities of North America: Washington, Mexico City and Ottawa (it was already legal throughout Canada).

    This parallels the battle for decriminalization of marijuana. Medical use is legal in several states (I can't find a list) and recreational use is legal in Washington and Colorado.

    This is a big country and sometimes laws work their way up instead of down.
     
  8. Username Registered Senior Member

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    No one cares except gay people who think they are being discriminated against.

    … and if you are gay and think you have been neglected of your rights then more power to you.

    They aren’t going to be handed to you in America. You have to earn them like every other person, race, sex and nationality has in years past.
     
  9. CptBork Valued Senior Member

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    Yes, and if only rape victims would also understand that they don't have any rights until they earn them, they'd have a much easier job of defending themselves and overcoming their well-deserved shame. Thank you for telling it like it is, citizen!
     
  10. Saturnine Pariah Hell is other people Valued Senior Member

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    I guess America has not learned from it's history of discrimination against minority groups that over time those groups will fight for their rights and disrupt the established order and challenge the status quo. It's sad really,it's no wonder the US was ranked 7th in terms of human freedoms.
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/09/world-freedom-index-2013_n_2440620.html
    America, home of free-ish
     
  11. wellwisher Banned Banned

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    The separation of church and state, should make it illegal for secular to enforce gay marriage, since marriage is a religious concept. Trace the history of marriage and one can see that secular borrowed this ritual from religion, in violation of separation.

    When a nativity scene migrates from religion, to the secular of a town square, this can be beat back, if someone complains. Even though this merger of church and state had been done for centuries, it does not matter, since it violates separation. How is this different? I can handle civil unions since this is a secular concept and does not try to violate the separation of church and state.

    If this violation is allowed to stand, then there is no legs to forbid prayer in schools, since this was integrated by secular centuries ago along with marriage. Religion needs to show the dual standard of the liberal scam.
     
  12. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    Bingo again, for the L word.

    Actually you are quite wrong to presume marriage has a religious origin. It existed in antiquity independently of organised religion. Read the history of marriage here for example:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriage

    It is primarily a social custom and a legal status, both developed for the security of the children of the marriage. Religion has subsequently commandeered it, but the notion it was religious in origin is a myth, propagated by religious conservatives.
     
  13. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    There is no law that forces religious institutions to perform gay marriages. The word marriage has come to mean something other than a wedding in a church, and many laws depend on whether people are married or not. When you want to get divorced, where do you go? To a church or a lawyer?
     
  14. CptBork Valued Senior Member

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    Well if it upsets you so much, then what we should do instead is enforce separation of Church and State by removing any legal recognition or tax exemptions for religious marriages, and for legal purposes only recognize unions on a purely secular basis when they conform to the secular system's requirements. Christian Churches can happily marry exclusively heterosexuals, good looking people or whatever standard they wish to hold, movie theatres can hold Jedi weddings, and we can all live in an equal society.
     
  15. Aqueous Id flat Earth skeptic Valued Senior Member

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    You mean no one but homophobes and voyeurs care about what goes in the bedrooms of private people.

    The point is that gays are not alone in thinking that; all thoughtful people know that it's historically true. Hence the US Congress, the Supreme Court, the Dept of Justice, the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, the agencies that handle housing discrimination claims, and all related agencies, have passed statutes and regulations and judicial doctrines which protect gays from further abuses.


    Wanna bet? Check the above laws I just cited. It's a done deal. You're just living in the homophobic past.

    How has a gay person, denied housing, employment or status in the military any different from a person denied the same on account of race or gender.

    Anyway, you've admitted your mistake by using the word "sex". To be denied a right or privilege "on account of sex" is not limited to "on account of being biologically female". Its the language used to protect gays, lesbians and transgender people as well.

    I gather your homophobia stems from a fundamentalist Christian attitude. Nothing like using religion as an excuse for hating people. I guess it even makes you feel justified.
     
  16. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    21,635
    Agreed. Ban marriage of any type from consideration by secular authorities. Instead, churches marry people, and that marriage has zero legal relevance. People can then go and get civil unions from the state that grant them what we consider "marriage rights" - the right to inherit, the right to make medical decisions, the right to custody etc. The civil union, likewise, has no religious relevance; it just confers legal status.

    Thus people can get married, or form a civil union, or both, or neither. Up to them.

    Exactly. End marriage as a secular concept and the problem goes away.
     
  17. Username Registered Senior Member

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    Homophobes is a made up word used by those who think they are being discriminated against.
    Can you give one example where someone in America was chemically castrated or was sentenced to death for being gay?
    I will wait for your response.

    Can you give one example of where someone who was gay has been denied housing or employment status .... besides in the military, and if you want to give examples of the military then go ahead, I won't stop you.
    Where have I "admitted my mistake of using the word sex"? I would really like to know. There is a clear distinction between biological sexes of male and female.
    Again, your idea of homophobia steams from your own imagination of what you choose to "think" or "believe" about others.
     

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