Milk is bad for you?

Discussion in 'Biology & Genetics' started by EddyNashton, Jun 26, 2016.

  1. EddyNashton Registered Member

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    Since it seemed like an interesting Topic. I did not think everyone was going to get emotionally attached to "Milk". It seems a little irrational.

    Im sorry if I expected more than Emotionally idiocy from a science forum, I wont make that mistake again.
     
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  3. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    I make no excuses but say I am sorry I acted badly.
    Alex
     
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  5. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    I think you need to reflect upon that.

    The natural world is not quite so black and white as you suppose.


    Great. But a total red herring.

    Chocolate is harmful to dogs, therefore we shouldn't eat cereal.

    People are the only ones who cook their meat over a fire too. So what?

    Food is not contagious. Me drinking milk does not make you sick.


    I still don't get your point. What do you suggest should be done differently? And why?
     
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  7. Ivan Seeking Registered Senior Member

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    Where we meant to eat sugar? Sugars are contained in many natural foods - all vegetables and fruit - but it is killing people. It is one of the biggest health issues going. Some scientists have even suggested that it should be regulated like a drug because it is a drug and a huge detriment to public health. But we basically run on sugar.

    So were we meant to eat sugars? Should we put a ban on glycolysis?
     
  8. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    I submit to all that we change the word "meant" to "evolved". What are are "meant" to do or be is a discussion for the religion forum.

    Species tend to fall into two groups: specialists and generalists. Koalas are an excellent example of specialists. As long as their food supply is avaiable, they will fluorish, but in a changing environment, their speciality will be a liability. The planet has gone through many cycles of stability and change - both types have their heyday.

    We are evolved as omnivores. We eat lots of things. And, like other ominvores, we are able to adapt to new food sources as we expand both geographically and in numbers. That is one of the traits that makes us successful.

    We are also outgrowing our ancestral food sources. There are 7 billion of us, and there aren't enough plains with grasses and berry bushes for all of us. The only way we could keep eating the same thing we ate 50,000 years ago is to have the same population that we had 50,000 years ago - before the invention of agriculture.


    So, should the human race eat a diet of a few very specific things? Should it not adapt? Should it stagnate? That's not what humans are "meant" to do.

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  9. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    All my dogs like milk, Cats like milk also
     
  10. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Heretic! Don't you know cats are carnivores!??
    Carnivores are meant to eat meat!

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  11. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    No one here is "emotionally attached" to milk. Some people drink it. Some people eat it in products like cheese. Some don't. That's fine.

    Your anger at the idea of using it does seem odd, though.
     
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  12. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    Of course! Our ancestors had to eat everything that they were capable of digesting, just to be able to survive. Sugar is a fabulous source of calories, it doesn't need to be chewed for an hour to break it down (like raw meat, in the long era before fire was tamed, so there was no way to cook ANYTHING), and you don't have to chase and kill an animal to get it.

    Many species of animals can eat sugar, even if it isn't one of their primary food sources. The artiodactyls (hooved animals with four toes--most of the grazing animals) and perissodactyls (hooved animals with five toes, a small group of grazers comprised of the rhinoceros and a couple of other animals). And of course, most of our closest cousins, the other primates (monkeys, apes, etc.) love sugar.

    Even many carnivores will happily eat sugar. Your dog (a subspecies of wolf) will, although your cat won't, because for reasons unknown, the feline tongue does not have the taste buds for "sweet."

    Our species might very well not have survived if it weren't for berries and other plants with high sugar content.
     
  13. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    Ivan: You may be confused by the phenomenon of lactose intolerance. Lactose is one of several types of sugar, and a significant portion of the human race do not have the enzymes to digest it--basically the populations that never developed dairy farming so they didn't need it--the Jews, many of the people in southeastern Europe, and the people of the Western Hemisphere who hadn't gotten around to taming their grazing mammals. Nobody was brave enough to try to tame a moose, a mountain goat or a bison, although the Incas domesticated the llamas, which unfortunately produce so little milk that it's amazing that their calves don't starve to death.
     
  14. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    I can drink milk and digest it. I'm not lactose intolerant. I didn't adapt to being able to drink milk because I rarely drink it. I can drink it however.

    Humans are able to eat many foods and are very adaptable in that regard. Milk and cheese are no different than many other foods.
     
  15. Edont Knoff Registered Senior Member

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    We talk about cow milk. Which isn't meant for us as are the eggs, the meat, the plants, the fruits, the mushrroms and almost anything else that we eat. We eat a lot of things which are not made for us, and we live well with that. Humans are omnivores and can digest quite a lot of food.

    People who are lactose-tolerant can drink milk and digest all milk products.

    This question is too broad. "People" are not this uniform. Some people can digest milk, for them milk is perfectly fine. Other people cannot digest milk, for them milk is obviously not healthy (it makes them sick).

    For those who can digest milk, milk will deliver a lot of high quality nutritients. In so far, I dare to call milk "healthy" for this group of people. But "healthy" is a broad and blurry word again, like "people" is too broad for this discussion, so we might have to narrow this down to get better answers.
     
  16. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    Almost all people of northern and western European ancestry are born with a metabolism that can easily digest milk. It doesn't matter if you never eat it. The ability is still there.
    I'm not sure what you mean by "adaptable," but many humans do, indeed, have problems digesting certain common foods.
    As I've already noted, a large percentage of the human race do not have the enzymes in their metabolism to digest milk. They can eat it, but it causes tremendous flatulence and others will be reluctant to socialize them if they do try to eat it.

    I am one of those people. My ancestry is 1/2 Slavic, 1/4 British and 1/4 Jewish. The Jewish people did not develop dairy farming until very late in their history, so many of them don't have the enzyme to digest milk. I was able to drink milk until around age 25. At that time my Jewish DNA apparently began to override my European DNA. It began to produce horrible flatulence, so my friends were not very happy about it. Within two years it became so uncomfortable to ME, that I had to stop drinking it at all.

    Since most Americans regard milk as a staple, there are plenty of companies that manufacture milk with the enzymes already mixed in. This didn't start until I had stopped drinking milk for many years, so I don't miss it and I never tried any of these products. Nonetheless, I know quite a few people who assure me that it really works--although not for everybody.
     
  17. Michael 歌舞伎 Valued Senior Member

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    I believe most people stop producing lactase upon weaning, but if you're not weaned, you may continue to produce the enzyme your whole life. Even low levels are sufficient to break down all lactose.

    As an aside, I buy and drink unpasteurized milk. If you haven't had raw milk before, one thing you'll notice is the "milk" smell missing. It may or may not taste much different. I think it tastes different because the smell is different. Actually, IMO, normal milk smells as if it's going off, although I can drink it just fine, I prefer unpasteurized.
     
  18. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    It's considerably more complicated than that. See the Wikipedia article on lactose intolerance, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lactose_intolerance

    For example, if lactose is not digested in the small intestine, it passes into the colon, which is full of bacteria that have absolutely no trouble breaking it down. The problem with this is that, although you are finally able to digest the lactase and get the nutritional benefits, the bacteria's way of breaking it down produces an enormous amount of gas!
     
  19. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    So what is wrong with it .One way or another the sugar will be converted into CO2 and H2O
     
  20. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    Nothing is wrong with it. I'm not the one who said that humans weren't made to eat milk.
     
  21. Ivan Seeking Registered Senior Member

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    No, you just didn't understand my point. Sugar is one of the biggest killers going but we also live on sugars, which I already said. My post was intended to be ironic to make a point.
     
  22. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    That was certainly how I read your post. The idea of banning glycolysis is a bit of a giveaway (durrh).

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  23. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

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    The reason for this is that our metabolism was "designed" for our Paleolithic ancestors, for whom every day was a contest to try to find enough food to survive. To find a source of sugar--an immense source of calories, which under normal circumstances were not easy to find--would have been cause for celebration!

    But the Neolithic Revolution--the discovery of the technology of agriculture, which happened only a mere 12,500 years ago--began to change this. Our distant ancestors learned how to domesticate animals for their meat, and also how to cultivate certain plants that were very generous sources of nutrition. Berries and other plants whose fruits are high in fructose were, of course, the Stone Age equivalent of gold!

    It wasn't until the Iron Age, which dawned roughly 1000BCE, that our ancestors were able to construct tools that allowed them to cultivate plants which were too difficult to work with, using the older, less sturdy and less precise tools made of bronze.
     

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