Three Claims of Uniformitarian Naturalism

Your actions suggest the opposite..else why the photos re the desert trip?

One thing you don't seem to accept is the proposition of backing up a claim.

If you don't understand that do you just believe anything you are told?

And I don't want to prove you are wrong that is your job. You moved on from Santa ...have you?..god is like a santa for young adults..they get stuff but finally they learn to follow the facts and discover that is just a stage we go thru...it's good because you learn to think rather than blindly follow nonsense..if you can be conned so easily with the god story don't plan on being able to keep any savings as you need to be able to think...religion is no doubt nibbling away at your cash. Heck of you want to make a million you target believers..just look at the con artist preachers..as I said it's all in front of your nose so maybe you could ask why you just won't see that you have been conned..tell me the cash you lose to religion is somehow right.
Alex

 

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I feel obligated to present evidence where someone claims there is none. Not proof, evidence. But I know it is their choice to decide what, if anything, they might choose to do with it.

Some use the Mountain of God to change their own lives around, and others blow it off completely.

It is their choice. What they decide to do with it is completely up to them. That is the reality.

Why must I prove all of my beliefs, when no one else on earth can prove all of theirs?

Thanks for your concern, Alex!

 

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Those are the words of someone who has denied themselves an education in the very basics, exuding ignorance who tends to describe scientific explanations in a childish, immature fashion.

Those are the words of someone who has allowed religious dogma to poison their minds.

Those are the words of someone who has chosen delusion over reality, myths and superstitions over facts and understanding and insanity over sanity.

 

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No, you present no evidence of any kind, you present assertions, ignorance and extremely poor analysis of anything scientific.

 

I agree, I regard Con Artist Preachers as being particularly wicked human beings.

I wish there was a way to strip all of them from their money and power.

The leader of Scientology, David Miscavige, may be the worst of them all, and that’s saying something, as he actually physically strikes and abuses his own followers. He engages in financial and physical abuse, and in the mental rape of his own people.

I think he must be a Sociopath.

Why do we hand over positions of power to Sociopaths? Seems like it happens over and over again. Hmmm... maybe Survival of the Fittest? Nah! Might makes Right? There have to be studies on this!

And the United States government even protects him.

Robert Tilton
Kenneth Copeland, likely demon possessed
Joel Osteen
Benny Hinn
Mike Merdock
And many, many others...

All Sick!!!

Jesus warned the world centuries ago that they would exist and that they would deceive many.

Jesus described them as being like Wolves who would seek to devour there own people, while masquerading as innocent Sheep.

 

You do not have to prove your beliefs, you do not have to make them known to others however if you make a claim you really must expect that you will be called upon to support that claim with evidence and here you should note even the simplest of evidence must meet certain reasonable requirements.
You make a claim your father was saved by God. That is a big claim, if for one moment we entertain the proposition that there is a creator who created the universe which is big beyond comprehension, you expect others to accept your claim that this creator intervened in things to save your father while ignoring millions of others ..you expect such a huge claim to go unchallenged...think about that for a moment and try and get a perspective on such an arrogant claim...let's back it off a little with this example...I roll up here and say Donald Trump did me a personal favour by sending me a rare book that I had been searching for and sent it on military aircraft to avoid it getting lost in the post...that is a pretty big claim and I am only claiming an inside track with the president of the United States who of course is a mere nothing in comparison to a creator...would you not have questions for me? First what was the book..but then..how come the President of the USA took time out of his busy day to do you such a favour...President sending a book is a very big deal but absolutely nothing in comparison to your claim that this creator who must be a billion times more important than every president king and queen in all of history personally stepped in to save your father...now my claim is rather unbelievable don't you think and yet you have convinced yourself that this creator trumped my example ..really can you not see just how delusional your claim is and why anyone hearing it will insist on evidence..talk about name dropping..yet all you theists are just so casual about claiming this creator does your bidding. ..the pity is you can not see how ridiculous your claim is...it is child like...and clearly you just not have thought of the huge claim you make..where were the reporters? Where were the headlines?..and try to think if my book from the president arrived in a military jet, a minor event compared to yours...do you think it would be on tv..do you think I would be somewhat famous...and that is just a president sending a book..your claim..the creator of the universe saved my father from death...honestly can you not fathom why that is just delusional nonsense..I don't have to add that there is no evidence for this creator but simply on the basis he may exist your claim is just so absolutely over the top it is insane...
So tell me again that the creator of the universe saved your father and be serious and grown up and honest.
Really mate if you don't get it now you are crazy...sorry but just think about your claim.
And what you miss is everybody does have to prove their claims and you being so casual in offering such a childlike dismissal shows you just do think things through at all...perhaps you can point out all these people who do not have to prove their claims..who are they? Can't you see saying something that is nonsense is just nonsense and will be only regarded by others as nonsense...you just can not say stuff that is not true and think your statement has created the facts..that is insane..really it is insane.

Every single preacher teacher and sage of religion are con artists make no mistake..firstly they con themselves ignoring the evidence that gods are merely a human invention... secondly they con themselves that if there was this great creator that Earth could be somehow special..do you think the universe was made just for us? Of course you do ..the observable universe has a diameter of some 95 billion light years and it was made for us..to think such is insane...
Having conned themselves they then con others..that is the truth available but you of course will ignore it.

They are able to exist because no one questions the good book, no one can make the effort to study the history and trace the invention of gods.
They exist because people are gullible and lazy just like you..

Again history shows there most certainly was no Jesus. History shows that Jesus and the multiple human gods were inventions based on astrology.
That is a fact which you will ignore ... they worshipped the Sun then they invented human gods and gave them attributes of the Sun..it's not rocket science it is just fact.
There is an enlightenment that awaits those who reject superstition and fantasy ...a level of being way beyond anything you can imagine.
As I said you can believe what you wish but when you come here and make unsupported claims you will not get away with that and unfortunately if you put your beliefs on the table I for one will have them for dinner. You have a great day and try and read some science, astronomy, biology,geology, ..anything to educate yourself you may not believe this but you don't not live 2000 years ago nor do you need their simplistic explanations of the world..illness is not due to demons, you can't beat your slaves within inches of death and you don't stone bad kids or weekend workers..and we know that a man can't live in a whale for three days..you can make a list..such a book could not and was not inspired by God.. I do think if other books can be perfect we could expect at least that from a book inspired by God.. could he not have inspired the editors at least to correct the writers when they go it wrong...think mate.
Alex

 

Alex my friend,

I have seen you repeatedly make the claim that God does not exist, so please go ahead and prove your claim. I await your proof.

Seti

 

So, you say God healed your father via miracle, yes.

What makes your father so special?

 

Yes, God healed my father, immediately after prayer at home. What is the big deal? It was only one of the many miracles that God has done for thousands of people worldwide. Accounts of miracles go back for thousands of years throughout recorded history.

As I have said in the past, all it takes is one miracle to falsify Atheism.

 

Where's the one?

:EDIT:

You didn't actually answer as to why your father is so special.

 

I never claimed that my father was special, only that God healed him.

And that one miracle, in my personal opinion, falsifies Atheism.

 

So, you had a vendetta against "Atheism."

 

No, I just don’t think that it explains reality well.
And I also don’t think that it is a provable position.

 

So, what is "Atheism" then?

 

I am pretty sure it describes a person who claims to know that there is no God.

How would you describe Atheism?

 

Well, let's put that one to the forum.

I think atheist/agnostic have very skewed meanings.

 

Ok

 

I'm more a "we don't really need any God" type of bloke...It is a superfluous concept.
But question if you are game enough to answer it....
You said somewhere earlier in the piece, you acept that each has their own opinion and you are not that concerned about the opinions of others here on a science forum...or words to that effect. So, as I've said to other religious preachers that inevitably adorn science forums, why do you come here? Why don't you preach to converted folk about your beliefs? Why are you [seemingly] trying to convert us evil atheistic bastards?
I certainly don't go to any religious or ID forum preaching the superfluous nature of any deity or ID?

 

Easy. I can back up anything I say else I don't say it...the truth is most important to me.

First are you prepared to accept that the rules of evidence as would apply in your country or mine that will apply to a criminal conviction ..they should apply..I mean if the courts of our land will accept the method I apply will that be good enough for you?

My claim has been that the god of the bible was an invention of the Sumerians and as an invention can not exist as a real entity in much the same way as Santa is an invention and does not exist in reality. Further that much of the bible came from the same folk who invented this god in the first place...do you know Where the flood story came from? Does it not perplex you to notice that in the bible the floor story is clearly cobbled together from three different sources? Does that mean there were three gods? Interestingly your god was actually one of three..you should learn this stuff..just think why atheists thinks theists are uninformed..dontvyou think it funny atheists know more about your religion than you do..that probably is why they are atheists because they know the truth not the nonsense you cherry pick.

If you want me to prove the above then tell me that you will accept a procedure that would be acceptable in a court of law.

I assume you must, but you may care to think about my claim, I made it because I can back it up, I made it knowing that written evidence exists that supports the claim if the form of clay tablets written by those who invented the god in the first place.

What I do not understand is given such information is only a couple of clicks away for you why do you feel it is necessary for me to do the clicking?
Do you think that somehow the facts will change as I relate them to you.

The facts are there for both you and me to see and you better understand just because you go thru life making wild statements, incapable of support, that the invented creator of the universe saved your father that my approach is the opposite..If I say anything it can be backed up as I believe that making any statement that you can not back up is no better than lieing.

In other words although I regard myself as a casual and uncomplicated person that does not mean I am casual with the claims I make and there is indeed nothing complicated for you to learn what I have told you is the case both as to the invention of the god of the bible and by whom and that Jesus is clearly another invention based in astrology due the humans wishing to replace the Sun as the center of worship.

Your problem is you don't know anything about the religion you follow.

Prove all of your claims.

Show that your prayers were answered by God...else don't name drop.

The fact is folk pray and if they get a happy outcome they claim gods intervention, well if it is so obvious it should not be difficult to prove and I will not hold you to a y proof greater than what our law courts would require and if you can't satisfy what a court of law would require you have nothing it is that simple and not to accept such a proposition means that you consider yourself not limited by the reasonable requirements of our laws...do you believe you are somehow entitled to be above the law?

You make the claim so prove it..and tell me this was your father being treated by a priest in church with holy water...or..by a doctor in a hospital with medication and tested proceedures..you may have prayed and he may have recovered but that does not entitle your to be a name dropper and claim you have the ear of god...or do you suggest you can get that from god but probably the president would not accept your phone call...time for a reality check mate. Further why does your lot claim miracles..we see situations where buildings collapse for example in Earthquakes and hundreds die but they find someone alive after days when they expect no more will be found alive..miracle miracle miracle go your mobs cries...so tell me why did this god apparently very calable saw fit to let the hundreds of others die...how do you rationally explain that..come on explain that ..could it be the claims of miracles are unfounded.

Anyways as I said believe what you want but if you think you can make ridiculous claims here and not be put on the spot you are as wrong about that as you are about your reality.

It saddens me to see decent folk like you unable to think, unable to read history that can only make you snap out of it but the terrible thing is you happily doom your kids to this superstition and denial of truth...not to mention you think you have the answers when you have never ever looked for them.

Anyways prove your claims or don't make them.

Now if you want to continue with me proving my claim why don't we back each other by way of a wager ..I mean if you want me to do all the work you could and should do it is only fair I get compensated. What do you think?
Alex

 

Alex,

Underneath most of the things you say is the following claim...

Claim 1
Nature is all that exists.

Please start with this Claim, and Scientifically prove it. Then we will be able to move on from there.

Let’s say that the word “Nature” means the Physical Universe and all things directly associated with it, like all matter, energy, gravity, physical laws, every atom, every subatomic particle, and everything else tied to the physical Universe whether known or unknown.

Or throw my stupid description out the window and we can use yours. We have to start somewhere.

Or, if you don’t believe in Claim 1, that is certainly fine as well. It appears to me that you do, however.

Such a Claim, should require proof before anyone should buy it right, especially here in a Science forum?

So far, no one has actually done this.

And proof really is warranted because there are so many written accounts of miracles running throughout mankind’s history, that are evidence to the contrary.

And also there is the fact that Atheism throughout known history and even up until today has always been a minority position.

Thanks,
Seti