Militan Islam and Counter Effects

Discussion in 'World Events' started by Eluminate, May 31, 2004.

  1. Eluminate Registered Senior Member

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    This thread is not on good or bad or whatnot its just about reactions by countries that have been hurt by the wahabistic(militan islam) extremists and how policies within those entities change to counter that.

    This is sort of an action / reaction timeline that reflects on measures taken in jest to terror acts and etc...

    Russia is prehaps one of the most effected countries and has the most terrorist acts after Israel I fathom but there has been several shifts in ideology and reverberations. For example the policy towards islam as whole has turned from neutral aiding to neutral/negative external and punishing/suppresing internal. There has been an increased campaign to ban wahabism by several high ranking people within the gov't. The structure of the proposals was fairly open ended and in essense would be applied depending on the officials administering the proposed legislation. The kicker to the whole thing is that it would be up to them to determine who is a wahabist muslim and who isn't which would in essense apply to all muslims. This legislation is catching a slow moving support on the upper circles and in some areas of the duma but its all up to the pres.

    China and Thailand both have muslim minorities with some elements of extremism on both parts. In Thailan recently in the muslim south there was a botched muslim uprisal that was uncovered by their own co-religionists to show that they support the govt. Punitive actions have been very reared in accordingly and a permenent garrison within the region will probably serve for a long time to be on the safe side. The policies will probably become slightly negative toward the muslim groug. In China a big suppressive action rather quietly has diluted the sianking province by the insurgence of settlement of han chinese to over 50% of the total populous and any action by the muslim minority has been suppressed. It has recently been magnified slightly unde the banner of war against terror and more settlement plus punitive actions to keep the muslim minority in the region in constant dilution to reduce the possibility of any uprising which could be aided by the border drug states like tajikistan etc...

    (P.S. I personally hope they ban wahabism in Russia which would in effect make all muslims fall under the law and make punitive action to suppress terror much easier to conduct. Also I think that sometimes there should be harsher measures in response to a terrorist act like anihilating the whole extended family of the terrorist in question so they couldnt collect the reward for sacrificing their life to kill non-believers and would make it redundant to do so.)
     
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  3. Kiwi123 Banned Banned

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    What percentag of them are considered "moderate"?
    As in Hater Hitler-ist "peaceful" Mahathir of Malaysia for example?
     
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  5. Eluminate Registered Senior Member

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    I figure about 20% of muslims are moderate and about 60% are militant with 20% in the middle.
     
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  7. travis Registered Senior Member

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    Seperate the beliefs from the actions. They have the right to believe anything they want, just as you have the right to believe the government and the media if you wish. When someone makes a physical act of aggression, they are no longer peaceful.
    Suggesting that we should take military action against someone because their beliefs don't suit us is a double edged sword.
     
  8. otheadp Banned Banned

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    what about bin-Laden? he has probably never physically hurt anyone but his ideology inspires millions to kill and die
     
  9. Undecided Banned Banned

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    I am pretty sure that UBL killed some Soviets...
     
  10. Undecided Banned Banned

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    Also doesn't Russia have one of the largest growing Islamic community? With ethnic Russians converting?
     
  11. Eluminate Registered Senior Member

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    i think u have a misconseption there they aren't converting... its only protrayed that way. Its just the muslim minorities such as tartars practice it and it looks like the russians are converting. I think by last census it was about 8-9 million muslims in russia. most of those are tartars and people on the fringes as well as other ethnic minorities.
     
  12. Undecided Banned Banned

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    Well from the report I saw many ethnic Russians are converting to Islam as well. Tatars were already Muslim I believe, so I don’t know where you got that nonsense from? Secondly Islam is the fastest growing religion in Russia and most of the world for that matter. Your argument thus has very little validity.
     
  13. skywalker 3 @ T M 3 Registered Senior Member

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    I am just gona throw some links with numbers of muslims in russia and CA states.

    http://atheism.about.com/library/world/KZ/bl_RussiaIslam.htm


    http://countrystudies.us/russia/40.htm


    http://www.cdi.org/russia/johnson/5521-6.cfm


    The number in Russia alone is about 14 plus million over all around 50 plus million about 10 years ago. I never knew the stats untill just now. Quite interesting to me.
     
  14. Eluminate Registered Senior Member

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    the official figure is 8-9 million by the last census which occured only a short time ago.....

    tatarstan cannot secession from Russia... it is completely encircled furthermore over 50% of the republic is non-muslim.

    I could say that moscow and st.peter are being ethnicly clensed and tatarstan as well. You forgot to mention the 15-20%+ of the population movement with nationalist ideals oposed especially towards islam and things associated with it.

    Those reports are 10+ years old I read throught them I agree with some parts but some trends have drasticly changed course.
     
    Last edited: Jul 25, 2004
  15. Preacher_X Registered Senior Member

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    i dont get what this statment means, can someone help me. is it because they like Islam or hate it.

    "So delighted were the Russians by their achievement that, to this day, many churches here feature a standard Orthodox cross with one slight addition - an upturned crescent at its base, Islam symbolically vanquished."
     
  16. buffys Registered Loser Registered Senior Member

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    is that based on anything or are you just pulling numbers out of the air?
     
  17. Undecided Banned Banned

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    What do you think Buffy's?
     
  18. buffys Registered Loser Registered Senior Member

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    I assume the numbers are pulled from his ass but I haven't looked into any statistics so to be honest, I have no idea.
     
  19. johnahmed Registered Senior Member

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    yes Russia has a significan muslim minority with converts to islam and low russian birth rate making islam second largest faith
     
  20. Eluminate Registered Senior Member

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    no buffy i used those from an almanac for 2003 or 4 dont remember honestly but i looked up stuff online for censuse which was conducted in november of 2002 and I m pretty sure my numbers are closer then urs. Yes its the 2nd biggest faith and probably is growing but I would have my doubts if other religions arent growing either considering most of the country still consider themselves apathetic to religion and act athiesticly.

    Personally I notice tendencies of suppression and counter-islam growth that are being instituted. For example the whole of Turkish-Mesketin Populous about 13-15k is being deported wholesale to Philadelphia from Krasnodarsky Krai (I m from that region btw). This deal took several years to accomplish but recently was concluded and they are being sent out to Philly by air transit. *I SWEAR I M NOT MAKING THIS UP*
    http://www.ntxe-news.com/artman/publish/article_18276.shtml
    this isn't exactly a good thing but I can understand why. Basicly the North Caucases are being inflitrated by Islamic Wahabism thats paid for by saudi money and this creates a civil warfare type of situation by which they hope to keep it going in a chain reaction until more and more succamb to their beliefs or are forced into it. Krasnodar is in that area but its a very very Russian province especially if you consider the cossack mentality that settles there. Eventually some of these muslims woulda succambed to saudi money and created terrorist acts which woulda created a splinter effect of their whole community being killed off by ordinary citezenry. Trust me it woulda happened. This prevented all of that.
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2004

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