bye bye

Yup I agree. Show us a fingerprint or even a wondrous work and I'm sure we'll be able to provide you with a more mundane and sensible explanation.

 

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What I'd like to know ...

.. is what killing people have to do with this.

Cris! How many times have I had to tell you? No killing people at Sciforums!

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Or did I miss something obvious again? Did you confess to murder? At any rate, Taken has taken my primary point about this topic and stated it very well:

I think that what disturbs me most is that after all of the words put out by the various spunks personas is that I still don't know exactly what the problem is. I see a lot of crap flying around, but the best I can follow it tells me that Cris is apparently a murderous devil-worshipper for the crime of (gasp!) answering a post. If spunks smuggled the child into a bar and the child stole sips from her drink, would she yell at the waitress?

I'm wondering if Tony1 has any hormone jokes queued up to aim at spunks.

thanx,
Tiassa

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I can not show you God, as I have said before. Each of us must make our own Spiritual journey and no one can do it for us. What I can assure you of is that if you keep looking for Him you shall indeed find Him.

 

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Believe me, I have looked, and so far all I've found is air. But as with all things, if you keep telling yourself he exists you will eventually believe it. Is that what you're getting at? Or am I missing something?

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Much like the laws of gravity...God exists even before we are able to discover or define Him. His existance is in no way related to your belief in Him.
He said seek and ye shall find...if you haven't yet, that doesn't mean you won't.
I too found nothing but air....to discover later after God made His presence known to me that I had been looking for what I THOUGHT was God, what I was TOLD and TAUGHT God was and had therefore been overlooking Him the entire time.
The best advice I can give to anyone is the very advice Jesus gave us all.. Keep seeking, keep knocking, keep asking.

Never stop learning and trying to be true to yourself, and keep your mind and eyes open to God not what YOU THINK He is or should be. The simple sincear frame of mind such as "God if you are in fact real, make yourself known to me that I may believe." Then stop trying to see what you expect and just wait upon the Lord.

 

I seek to find Matrix.

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Will I find it Taken?
That tht I haven't found it yet doesn't mean I won't, right?

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If Matrix does in fact exist then I would assume you would find Matrix if you did not cease in looking. But since I am not aware of Matrix, I can not testify on the behalf of it's existance.

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I can attest to Gods existance by my own personal experience and say that He is well worth anyones time to continue inquiring about.

 

Re: Tony1

*Originally posted by JesusSaves
Not so sure what pregnant women have to do w/ it. Please explain.*

Taken is pregnant.

*Originally posted by Avatar
Tony thinks tht pregnant women are selfish, self-serving, ignorant and mortal.*

Actually, I think your avatar is a portrait of your one brain cell.

*Originally posted by Taken
Here are people who supposedly believe God is omnipotent and unfathomable...and yet they preach fear of little demons and (hormones) and shun science as if they are afraid to be proven wrong. Turning a blind eye, screaming..."NO!, I don't want to see the truth...it might make me doubt!"*

LOL!!
You funny!
Is this a point?

*I say dig up the foundations of earth, explore the deepest reaches of the sea beds, journey to the furthest stars.*

I say, you do it; it looks like too much work for me.

*Originally posted by Cris
I'm sure we'll be able to provide you with a more mundane and sensible explanation.*

We'd prefer a correct explanation.

*Without an external independent objective mechanism to show that God exists you will have no way to know that your belief is not self-delusion.*

Without an external independent objective mechanism to show that science is valid you will have no way to know that your belief is not self-delusion.

 

well this is an interesting thread. ashley, if you can't faithfully represent what you believe, don't post. you by your harsh words are doing more damage to christianity than a thousand rational arguments.

greetings all. not new to forums, but i'm new to this one.

i guess i'm a seeker of sorts too... i have plently of thoughts on all these things, but we shouldn't lay ourselves open too quickly, right?

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i've never completely bought what i was told, but i guess there are a few things about atheism that i've never been able to accept.

the biggest one is this:

i was reading the newspaper the other day, and i saw this full-page article for some anti-depressant medication... you know, the ad where the first picture is black-and-white and mrs. jones is depressed, then the next is full color, and she's smiling and planting flowers (in make-up, of course).

and the ad says: (as i remember it) "you too can enjoy your favorite activities again!"

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and i remember always being incredibly depressed when i thought of it. enjoy your favorite activities, puh-leeeeese. just like poor prometheus - push that stone, strain, sweat, get it to the top! now what happens next? ah, but you're not supposed to ask "what next"!! while it's up there maybe you can build something with it, or play with it... but it's all meaningless, and prometheus knows it.

that seemed to be the essence of the ad. "oh, that's ok that your life doesn't have meaning. by enjoying hobbies, you can make little moments of meaning in your over-arching MEANINGLESSNESS." well i'm sorry, but that's a poor comfort. don't feed me some crap about man helping man and taking care of the poor starving children in africa. that's just more "artificial meaning." Nietzsche was one of the few atheists that was willing to accept the implications of his beliefs. this is what he had to say:

“The Madman”
by Fredrich Nietzsche

Have you not heard of that madman who lit a lantern in the bright morning hours and ran to the market place and cried out incessantly, “I’m looking for God! I’m looking for God!” As many of those who did not believe in God were standing there, he excited considerable laughter.
“Have you lost him, then?” said one. “Has he lost his way like a child?” said another. “Is he hiding?” said a third. “Maybe he is afraid of us or has he gone on a voyage or emigrated?” So they shouted and shouted and laughed him to scorn. But the madman sprang into their midst, pierced them with his glances.
“Where has God gone?” he cried. “I'll tell you. We have killed Him, you and I. We are all His murderers. But how have we done this? How were we able to drink up the ocean? Who gave us the sponge to wipe away the entire horizon? What did we do when we unchained this earth from the sun? Where is this earth moving now? Where are we moving now? Away from all suns? Are we not perpetually falling, backwards and forwards, and sidewards, in all directions? Is there any up or down left? Are we not straying through an infinite nothing? Do we not feel the breath of empty space? Has it not suddenly become colder? Is not more and more night coming upon us all the time? Must not lanterns have to be lit in the morning hours? Do we not hear anything yet of the noise of the gravediggers who are burying God? Do we not smell anything yet of God's decomposition? God's decompose too, you know. And God is dead. He remains dead and we have killed Him. How shall we the murderer of all murders now compose ourselves? For that which was the holiest and the mightiest of all that the world has possessed has bled to death under our knives.
“Who will wipe this blood from us? With what water can we purify ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games will we need to invent? Is not this the greatest of all deeds to great for us to handle? Must not we ourselves now have to become God simply to seem worthy of what we have done? There has never been a greater deed. And whoever shall be born after us because of this deed shall be a part of a different history than all history hitherto.”
Here the madman fell silent and again regarded his listeners. They too were silent, and they stared at him in astonishment. At last he threw his lantern to the ground and it broke and went out…
(end quote)

this question itself does not drive me to Christianity (or any other religion) per se. but it drives me from atheism, because atheism has implications that i cannot accept. there MUST be more to life than this, it cannot be otherwise.

sorry it's such a long post!! looking forward to discussing it.

-bonsai man

 

Trees
by Joyce Kilmer

I think that I shall never see
A poem lovely as a tree.

A tree whose hungry mouth is prest
Against the earth's sweet flowing breast;

A tree that looks at God all day,
And lifts her leafy arms to pray;

A tree that may in Summer wear
A nest of robins in her hair;

Upon whose bosom snow has lain;
Who intimately lives with rain.

Poems are made by fools like me,
But only God can make a tree.

 

That's God

Who is the keeper of the gate? That's God.
And whom do seekers contemplate? That's God.
Whom do the sheep anticipate? That's God.
Who likes to set the record straight? That's God.
Who worked his arse off to create? That's God.
All fossils both in shale and slate? That's God.
Who sent His son to compensate? That's God.
For errors made before that date? That's God.
Who is both fisher and the bait? That's God.
Who doesn't seem to concentrate? That's God.
Who kills the sparrows by the crate? That's God.
Who did, with Mary, fornicate? That's God.
Who tends to do things rather late? That's God.
Who made this evil sinful state? That's God.
Who brings the blasphemer to their fate? That's God.
Who fries the sinners on a grate? That's God.
Who drowns His creatures when irate? That's God.
Who's body count does still inflate? That's God.
Who is this lying fraud? Oh wait, that's God.
Who is this tyrant coward, mate? That's God.
Who is the LORD of death and hate? That's God.

The Nantko Homepage

 

God doesn't exist,
but don't be too pissed;
it was never such a great thing
to bow to an imaginary king.
-- Gary Welsh

Forgive, O Lord, my little jokes on thee
and I’ll forgive thy great big one on me.
~Robert Frost