Amnesty International and Hamas

Discussion in 'World Events' started by BenTheMan, Feb 19, 2009.

  1. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    No you blow up schools instead.

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    Starve babies, kill old people and torture the innocent.

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  3. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    That's not only essentially dishonest quoting, but even as it stands it doesn't show any defense of Hamas rockets as claimed.
     
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  5. 1100f Banned Registered Senior Member

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    It went like this:
    Q- Do you condemn deliberate targeting of civilians?
    A- Yes
    Q- Do you Condemn Hamas for deliberately targeting civilians?
    A- I find it really odd that you consider the Hamas' hope that the rockets will hit somebody in their frustration with their situation as targeting civilians, but the IDF throwing missiles with white phosphorus at schools, hospitals and refugee camps as not.
    Which means: "I do not condemn Hamas for deliberately rageting civilians, I do condemn Israel for what Israel does."

    you wanted an example of supporting Hamas using rockets, not an example of condemning Israel.
     
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  7. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    I don't think Hamas can be excused for their human rights violations. I just think that they fall very low on the priorities of issues to be addressed. Without liberty, there can be no rule of law. You understand that the Fatah are also Palestinians and these kinds of violations create more discord within the Palestinians. As one mother said, I have one son who is Hamas another who is Fatah, who do I go to?

    What I am pointing out is that its relatively common in such situations. And not something that can be addressed when they are not even recognised as a people or a state.
     
  8. 1100f Banned Registered Senior Member

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    807
    And if you read the entire thread, you can see that I wanted to make you condem that deliberate targeting of civilians and you refused to do this. You didn' want to condem the deliberate targeting of civilians by hamas. This is called supporting hamas using rockets for targeting civilians.

    If you think that my example is not a good one, please say that you do not support hamas targeting deliberately civilians.

    Please a simple yes or no:
    Do you support hamas deliberately targeting civilians?
     
  9. Buffalo Roam Registered Senior Member

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    Yes SAM, you were saying? Children, the old, even those who are providing fuel to Gaza:

    :bugeye:

    On Mar 26, 2001, a Palestinian sniper took aim at 10 month old Shalhevet Pass, who was sitting in her stroller. She was fatally shot in the head. This was hardly an “accident.” She was the target, even though her father was standing right beside her.


    March 5, 2003, Palestinian terrorists chose to bomb Bus 37 in Haifa shortly after school let out. The bus is on a school route and 9 schoolchildren were among the 17 killed in that attack. Dozens of children were wounded.

    On May 2, 2004, terrorists ambushed the car of Tali Hatuel, who was 9 months pregnant, and shot her and her four young daughters, aged 2, 7, 9 and 11. It was daylight and the terrorists obviously knew they were killing four small children because they shot them all at point blank range.

    June 1, 2001, a Palestinian terrorist chose to detonate himself among a long line of teenagers , their youth clearly visible to him, at the Dolphinarium disco in Tel Aviv. 11 teenagers under the age of 18 were among the dead.

    Mar 2, 2002 - Outside of a Jerusalem synagogue, a terrorist detonated a bomb next to a group of mainly women standing outside with their young children, several in baby carriages . The victims: Shlomo Nehmad (40), his wife Gafnit (32), and their daughters Shiraz (7) and Liran (3); Avraham Eliahu Nehmad, (7), Shaul Nehmad (15); Lidor Ilan (12) and his sister Oriah (18 months); Tzofia Ya'arit Eliyahu (23) and her son Ya'akov Avraham (7 months); and Avi Hazan, (37). The Fatah Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade took responsibility for the attack.

    Aug 19, 2003 - Twenty-three people were killed, including 7 children when a Palestinian suicide bomber detonated himself on a No. 2 Egged bus in Jerusalem's Shmuel Hanavi neighborhood. The bus was filled with children. Hamas claimed responsibility for the attack. The child victims: Shmuel Taubenfeld, 3 months, of New Square, New York; Shmuel Zargari, 11 months; Tehilla Nathanson, 3; Issachar Reinitz, 9; Avraham Bar-Or, 12; Binyamin Bergman, 15; Elisheva Meshulami, 16.

    November 20, 2000, terrorists attacked a bus carrying children from Kfar Darom to school in Gush Katif. 5 children were injured, many of whom had limbs blown off.

    Nov. 10, 2002, Revital Ohayon, 34, and her two sons, Matan, 5, and Noam, 4, were shot to death by an Al Aqsa Martyrs Brigade terrorist who broke into their home at Kibbutz Metzer.

    May 9, 2001 — Yossi Ish-Ran, 14, and Kobi Mandell, 14 , both of Tekoa, were savagely beaten to death with stones in a cave about 200 meters from the small community south of Jerusalem where they lived.

    May 22, 1970 - Avivim, Israel
    Palestinian terrorists attack school bus , killing 12 (9 of whom were children), and wounding 24.

    May 15, 1974 - Maalot, Israel
    PFLP terrorists held children hostage in a Ma'alot school . Of the 27 Israelis murdered, 21 were children. 78 were wounded .

    July 8, 2003

    Mazal Afari, 65, a resident of Moshav Kfar Yavetz, east of Netanya, was killed and three of her grandchildren were lightly injured when a suicide bomber detonated his explosives inside their home, causing it to collapse. Initially police thought a gas balloon had exploded, but later discovered explosives and a switch among the rubble. Representatives of Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the blast, the first since the start of the Palestinian cease-fire.

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    Shlomit Katz, 75 of Kibbutz Gvar’am, was killed while visiting Moshav Yesha in the Eshkol Regional Council. The deadly attack came four days after a mortar shell barrage killed Jimmy Kedoshim, 48, a father of four, as he stood in the yard of his house in Kibbutz Kfar Aza in the Negev.

    Apr. 9, 2008

    Two killed by terrorists in Nahal Oz

    By Yaakov Katz and JPost. com staff

    Two Israelis were killed when at least four Palestinian terrorists infiltrated the Nahal Oz fuel terminal from the Gaza Strip on Wednesday.

    Oleg Lipson, 37 and Lev Cherniak, 53, both residents of Beersheba, were employed at the terminal, which supplies the Gaza Strip with most of its fuel.


    Hamas and torture:

    http://www.humanrights-geneva.info/P...-Tortured,1974

    Palestinian Detained and Tortured in al- Mashtal Detention Center Dies
    16 July 07


    “ Palestinian Center for Human Rights - PCHR calls for opening an immediate investigation into the death of Waleed Abu Dalfa during his detention in al-Mashtal intelligence outpost, northwest of Gaza City, after he and his bother had been tortured by the Izziddin al-Qassam Brigades (the military wing of Hamas) which currently control the outpost. PCHR also strongly condemns arrests and detentions by the Izziddin al-Qassam Brigades, which are often accompanied by practicing torture against a number of detainees, and calls for stopping such illegal practices, emphasizing that Hamas’ military wing does not have any legal status that entitles them to arrest or detain people.
     
  10. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    More Zionist propaganda I suppose. How many Palestinians were maimed and murdered by the Israelis?

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    http://www.house.gov/apps/list/press/wa03_baird/morenews1/GazaTrip.shtml

    Like Israelis care so much for children in Gaza.

    Is that why 12 year olds are growth stunted to the levels of 8 year olds?

    Lets support the occupation because Hamas is so bad at governance. Duh!

    Since they are not "deliberately targeting" civilians, thats a bullshit question, unless you think they are aiming the rockets at someone. Otherwise, its just "collateral damages" Besides, Israelis have bunkers, early warning etc. What do Palestinians have? Not even an escape route. When Hamas locks up Jews in a compund and showers them with WP and 2000 lbs bombs, ask me again.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2009
  11. 1100f Banned Registered Senior Member

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    807
    I agree with you, they are not aiming their rockets on someone. They are aiming their rockets on civilian concentration. Don't you call this deliberately targeting civilians? (Ther are no military base at Sderot)
     
  12. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Look at what you are doing to them, how do you expect them to react? What are they supposed to do? They've been starving for TWO YEARS. They only get attention when they lob rockets. Otherwise they would all starve to death and no one would even notice.

    Don't expect me to sympathise with people who occupy others, I come from an ex-colony myself. You'll never convince me that occupation can be justified
     
  13. 1100f Banned Registered Senior Member

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    807
    You didn't answer my question:
    They are not aiming their rockets on someone. They are aiming their rockets on civilian concentration. Don't you call this deliberately targeting civilians? (There are no military base at Sderot)
     
  14. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    No I don't. They would not do it if they had freedom and safety. Palestinians are not exactly historically famous for being violent or aggressive.

    Its amazing to me that you think it even deserves consideration. Its like Nazis complaining about Jews fighting back.

    Duh? Of course they are, what did you expect? You're occupying and oppressing them!
     
  15. 1100f Banned Registered Senior Member

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    807
    So I understand that you support them of shooting their rockets
     
  16. 1100f Banned Registered Senior Member

    Messages:
    807
    lol
     
  17. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    No I support them for wanting to be free of occupation and oppression.

    Its not like peaceful demonstrations are treated any differently

    http://www.imemc.org/article/58069

    Also

    http://www.imemc.org/article/58005

    http://www.imemc.org/article/58806
     
  18. 1100f Banned Registered Senior Member

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    807
    You say that if they had their freedom and safety they would not aim on civilian concentration.
    Did I understand you?
     
  19. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    If they had their freedom and safety they would not lob rockets.

    They would have no reason to. They are not the ones talking to God.
     
  20. 1100f Banned Registered Senior Member

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    807
    And to which direction are they aiming their rockets?
    Do they fire their rockets in the direction of Gaza?
    Do they fire their rockets in the direction of the sea?
    Or do they fire their rockets in the direction of civilian towns (Sderot, Netivot, Ashkelon)?
     
  21. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    If they didn't lob rockets they would have freedom and safety.
     
  22. Buffalo Roam Registered Senior Member

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    16,931
    They would have their safety and freedom if they were not lobing rockets, again history shows who rejected Peace in 1947....

    The 13 countries (23%) that voted against resolution were: Afghanistan, Cuba, Egypt, Greece, India, Iran, Iraq, Lebanon, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Syria, Turkey, Yemen.

    Arab League Secretary, General Azzam Pasha declared "jihad", a holy war.

    He said, [B]"This will be a war of extermination and a momentous massacre which will be spoken of like the Mongolian massacres and the Crusades".[/B]

    The Mufti of Jerusalem, Haj Amin Al Husseini stated, "I declare a holy war, my Moslem brothers! Murder the Jews! Murder them all!"

    The armies of Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt and Iraq invaded the tiny new country with the declared intent of destroying it.


    Who is not talking to Allah? Muslims? five times a day they talk to Allah, every murder they commit is in the name of Allah, didn't Allah command that they should conquer the world for Him?
     
  23. S.A.M. uniquely dreadful Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah right, like for the first 40 years.

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    And in the West Bank, as noted above

    I don't know, can those rockets be aimed? I hear Palestinians get killed by rocket fire too. Are they aiming at them as well?
     

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