Body Signals Redux: Proving Mormonism

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Billy Baxter, Dec 30, 2016.

  1. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

    Dear god in heaven please answer me this, when I ask a set of perfectly logical questions why am I given just a link?

    From past experience the link is unlikely to answer all the questions.

    I've given up going to links in isolation.

    Those which follow answers I respect.

    Those links I treat as further reading.

    Are those who just post links lazy or what?

    Thanks for your attention. Over and out.

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  3. Truck Captain Stumpy The Right Honourable Reverend Truck Captain Valued Senior Member

    translation: i don't have empirical evidence or proof, so i will say that i had devine inspiration and that is good enough to trump logic, evidence and common sense in my world

    i've read religious texts from more beliefs than just yours...
    what they all have in common:
    1- never, ever challenge the leadership to provide evidence of a claim
    2- belief over evidence

    that tells me that it's a con job - and that someone wants to control me and manipulate me. if this were not about your belief or religion then you would automatically argue against it as fraud
    EXAMPLE - someone asks you to just take them on faith with regard to the stock market or putting large amounts of money into an "investment" of some sort
    if you're a church or true believer, this is OK to do - but if you're not of the "faith" then it's a con (AKA-Fraud)

    what the holy horsef*ck does an illusory being need golden plates with historical knowledge for?
    there is absolutely no evidence for angels existing, but now you say that said delusion took away the only physical evidence that possibly could have validated the leaderships position???
    ... yeah, like i said: fraud
    calling bullsh*t on this one: i know two in my area that are polygamists that also have the blessing of the church, being leaders of the local and all...
    you telling me the home office doesn't know about this?
    it's not like it aint on their official paperwork, bubba... it's condoned for them because they make the church lots of cash. period

    we aint as stupid as you think
    i can make the same claim about serial criminals...
    so what's your point?

    this is like saying people who like the colour black are super-intelligent. there is no correlation between liking any random colour and their education or likelyhood of intellectual prowess.
    in fact, i can also state that 100% of all serial killers are exposed to dihydrogen monoxide. does that mean every person exposed to dihydrogen monoxide is going to be a serial killer? i can truthfully state that every mormon is also exposed to dihydrogen monoxide as well... so will they all become serial killers?
    because they learned that targeting the illiterate, unexposed, youth and underprivledged is the best way to spread the disease of religion... it's taught in every other religion as well, from the other Abrahamic religions to Druidism

    for the record - i don't think you're "gullible and incapable of rational, objective thought just because I'm LDS"...
    i think you're gullible and incapable of rational, objective thought just because you've demonstrated the complete lack of logic, evidence based learning or common sense in this thread alone.
    Xelasnave.1947 likes this.
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  5. Truck Captain Stumpy The Right Honourable Reverend Truck Captain Valued Senior Member

    actually, you can prove he was a liar simply by seeking adjudicated records

    there were warrants he fled in Ohio accusing him of illegal banking and banking fraud. (why did he flee if he was innocent? it's far easier to get evidence supporting your position back in those days - simply have enough eye-witnesses)
    they were found guilty in absentia
    their flight to avoid arrest and incrimination was also illegal, mind you

    so that alone demonstrates he was a liar and fraud... but there is more!

    Smith also advocated premeditated homicide in the name of his deity

    he fled another banking fraud arrest in MO (fraud seems to be a running trend here... and no one thought perhaps he was also "fraudulent" in the religion? - LOL)

    he also threatened Justice of the Peace Adam Black with armed men! Black was elected to a Judges position (sounds really holy to me... ) and this constitutes a few nasty felonies

    Smith was indicted by grand jury on the charge of treason. Illinois officials charged Smith with incitement of a riot and later, treason against Illinois.

    so yeah... he was a liar, cheat, fraud and all around adjudicated known repeat criminal!
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2017
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  7. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

    Yes but other than that he was a good man.
    Just because he lied and cheated, committed fraud, and acted badly this is no reason to say he was not telling the truth about the angel and the gold bible and the fact that there are 20 million folk who believe him proves he was you think I could become a prophet?

    Thank you for confirming my suspicions that the man was a liar I thought he was and clearly the evidence says he do believers side step the facts?
    It is sad.
    They can't face the truth what is wrong with them?
    Like my mate who would not believe his missus had left him.
    I wonder how the faithful side step all these unpleasant facts about the liar who founded their religion.
    Sad so very sad.
    I worry about the children who have to grow up in such a situation.
    Truck Captain Stumpy likes this.
  8. Truck Captain Stumpy The Right Honourable Reverend Truck Captain Valued Senior Member


    very true
    look at the typical society today in the US
  9. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

  10. Billy Baxter Registered Senior Member

    Is there any empirical evidence that you know how to spell "divine"?

    capitalize that letter "I" if you want to be taken seriously in academia....

    I dunno, I think you're pretty stupid.

    ...and try capitalizing the first word in every sentence, idiot.
  11. Billy Baxter Registered Senior Member

    Also, JS was never convicted or indicted of any crime, O ye judges, hypocrites! For with the same measure you mete out to your fellow man.... need I finish?
  12. Kristoffer Giant Hyrax Valued Senior Member

    I still maintain my position that Al's on the highway to hell.
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  13. MacGyver1968 Fixin' Shit that Ain't Broke Valued Senior Member


    That's $25,000 in today's money. Guess you were wrong.
    Truck Captain Stumpy likes this.
  14. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

    Hi Billy
    I find it funny that you can be critical on such small matters and pick up on what is out of place but yet you can be conned so easily on matters that are absolutely beyond belief.

    Joe Smith was a liar I can not understand how you can overlook that fact.

    Honestly do you really believe an angel first gave him this gold bible and then after translating it by putting his hat over his face then gave the golden bible back.

    If you say you do and accept such a lie why would you even bother about the niceties of grammer?

    I think the propogation of Joe Smiths lies is evil and his control from the grave over people is proof that your mob are far from inteligent. One is considered inteligent if one can seperate fact from fantacy and clearly your mob are knee deep in fantacy (fraud and lies).

    And now doubt you teach these lies to children so I ask how can you do that? How can you look in the mirror and tell yourself you are a good person when you turn your back upon reality and hold the delussions of a liar, cheat and fraudster as believable, and teach children those lies.

    What you do is very wrong and it is sad you cover your eyes to the truth.

    I hope I have not offended you that is not my intention but you must ask... Why would I pick upon such small points and yet ignore the fact that I will tolerate a horrible lie told by an obvious fraud liar and overal a bad man... Why.
    Sorry forgot a "?".
    Truck Captain Stumpy likes this.
  15. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

    You talk nonsence here Billy, quoting from the book of mormon, the book that liar Joe Smith dictated with his hat over his face so as to interpret an ancient language written on gold tablets he borrowed from an angel and gave back leaving no tangible evidence to support his unbelievable claims... Or did you think your sentence up for yourself.
    Truck Captain Stumpy likes this.
  16. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

    Yes he was. Not that it makes any difference.
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  17. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

    I know why old Joe had the hat over his face..he was hiding the big grin he had whilst dictating.
    He would not have been able to keep a straight face.
    A friend of mine suggested we form a religion his sole reason was there are fools out there who will believe anything.
    And how tempting it would be to someone always looking to make a quid (dollar).
    It comes from the numbers.
    You rent a hall which does not have to be prime position, you don't have to pay staff as there are plenty of followers to volunteer, maybe rent an organ and a PA system and you are set. So you get 100 in the hall maybe $10 a head, some even more, get numbers up to five hundred and you are starting to get into real good money and working only one day a week...ironically the one day God said to rest..well it is also said...there is not rest for the wicked.
    So if there are 20 million Mormons at only $10 a head that's what? $200,000,000 a week...I must be mate was right.

    Joe Smith you may have been a liar but you were pretty damn smart and the victims still have not figured that they have been conned.

    Maybe the man should be worshipped.

    Billy multiply what you give them each week by 20,000,000 and ask could that be a good reason to lie.

    Truck Captain Stumpy likes this.
  18. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

    I think that would be highly unethical.
  19. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

    Do you think so?

    I hope you won't infer from my mates evil thoughts that the most respectable Joe Smith was anything but ethical....not a man who was entrusted with custody of the gold bible by an angel.
    The fact he returned the gold bible is proof that he was an ethical man.

    Truck Captain Stumpy likes this.
  20. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

    With all that facial hair old Nick it send him back I reckon!

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  21. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

    I don't want to go to hell and be surrounded by all those religious folk.
    Billy obviously knows what God is saying to me, but Billy probably can't repeat the words in public.
    It just does not stop and that gets to me unfortunately and reflects in my intolerant posts.
  22. Truck Captain Stumpy The Right Honourable Reverend Truck Captain Valued Senior Member

    well, you just gave empirical evidence that you have no sense of humour... say it out loud "hillbilly" style
    you know... because i'm a mountain man and i love to poke fun at dialect every bit as much as stupidity of religious fanatics

    i'm not in academia, and i'm far too lazy to use caps

    but seriously - you can't argue from a position of evidence so instead you're gonna pick on my spelling and cap's?

    and that doesn't speak volumes to you about your delusional beliefs?
    ah, and here is the difference between us: you think i'm stupid because you don't like my intentional spelling/cap's gaffs

    i can prove you're a complete idiot simply by pointing to your own posts and your own words

    i would much rather be thought the idiot by a person like yourself (you're delusional and can't be trusted to find the pointy end of a fork) ....

    than be proven to be an idiot as you've just done.... and to the entire world to boot!
    really? challenge accepted:
    so, if i prove you wrong i can then consider you not only a hypocrite, but a liar and per your own measure and morality, as well as judgement?
    then you're simply a criminal by association as well as by bearing false witness by intent

    ol'e joey was convicted February 1837 0f Illegal banking with co-defendent sidney rigdon (found Guilty) and fined $1,000 ( a high sum considering the day)
    'Joseph Smith's Bainbridge, N.Y., Court Trials.'

    warrant for arrest:

    so as you can see... the public record, legal and historical documents of the day prove that ol'e joey was a convicted criminal

    you can hide from that all you want, but in the real world we call it a blatant lie and hypocrisy to state someone is not a criminal when they have a known criminal record. in court, this would be called perjury and misrepresentation of facts. of course, as an LDS member, you are representing your religion and you've just proven than there is no way to accept your word as factual because the direct evidence refutes your claims, therefore you represent that LDS members cannot be truthful regarding their cult leadership. as such, this directly undermines your intent to do any STEM or scientific course let alone represent your religion.

    all things considered, you (again) just demonstrated that you're an idiot.
    dislike me all you want - at least i know how to do research and i don't accept the delusional rantings of convicted frauds as factual
    you can't even argue that you were mislead because i already posted that he was convicted. you simply ignored it because you didn't want to believe it

    epic fail on your part, bubbette
    Xelasnave.1947 likes this.
  23. Truck Captain Stumpy The Right Honourable Reverend Truck Captain Valued Senior Member

    why is it unethical?
    it is exactly the same thing that any other religion does...

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    is it fraud?
    is it legal?
    actually, yes: so long as you're a "religion" then it's ok to be morally bankrupt and commit fraud in the name of your beliefs. AND all that is required to start your religion is to file for a 501(c)(3) and call yourself a religion (in the US).

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