NO, not good enough. Didn't your President say, "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence"? If we are going to encumber one man with such a burden, then we must be very sure our claims and accusations are in fact accurate and supported by evidence. Read this extensively, and then form a conclusion. http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/osamatape.html Above all, study Bin Laden in the video where he admitted to planning 911 to his other videos. They look similar at a quick glance, but when you study it for a short span of time, it is inevitably true that the man in that video is not Osama Bin Laden.
So I do not want my country to get into the position India was in, banning books - fiction, novels, stories - to keep local crazies and cultists from killing their neighbors over them. How do we, as Americans, prevent Islamic fundies from creating that situation in the US? Can we get a little help, here, from the non-crazy Muslims? I don't see any help from CAIR - quite the opposite. I keep trying to point that out to Sandy - her favorite President and her most despised religious group are thick as thieves (thick and thieves).
Well isn't restricted travel to Cuba, banned economic or financial dealings with Iran, Palestine, sanctions against countries that don't kowtow to US policy, invading countries that won't play ball as bad? Freedom of expression goes both ways and if you demand people respect your values, you also have to consider theirs. Or agree to their not respecting yours either. How many cable stations play English al-Jazeera?
Iceaura, after all the questions I posed to you, is this the only response you can give me? Please provide some proof of CAIR's supposed extremist nature. We can discuss each point one by one, systemically. This thread is about CAIR, let's get back tot he topic shall we. Please provide some actual proof that Wahhabis are fundamentalists, i.e. analysis of their scholars and some books. Muslims all over the world, and even in America, view him as crazy. We don't associate with him, much less view him as a model to emulate. I, nor most of the Muslims, would care enough to hurt him, let him bring his own undoing. He has no right to represent us. There are plenty of other popular imams and scholars who you can point out.
So what? I should want CAIR in my neighborhood because I can't go to Cuba? Things are bad enough. We have Scientology, and there's no getting rid of it. No one wants another cult religious sect's political hit squad setting up shop in their town. You're doing fine. I couldn't add a thing. What exact percentage of you folks is "most" ? How many of the lunatics who think Rushdie "represents" Islam to anyone, who are all bent out of shape because of something he wrote in a novel, who regard him as a "traiter", do we have to worry about, if we let CAIR and the people it represents run around without sane adult supervision ?
The important difference is that if a guy murders another guy for sleeping with his wife, there's no ongoing threat. A blip on the news, a trial, and the matter is closed. But terrorists are organized groups of murderers. They must be handled differently. Hype is always saying that terrorism should be handled by police, the way we handle murder or any other crime. But the justice system is designed to handle isolated incidents, not organized killers. The discovery process that is a part of every trial would destroy every source we developed to fight terrorism. The concept that it is better that 1,000 guilty men go free than that 1 innocent man be wrongfully convicted doesn't work when those 1,000 guilty guys are carrying suitcase nukes.
mad can you prove their are people running around with suitcase nukes or are you just fearmongering for shits and giggles?
Iceaura, if you are not going to post any criticisms of CAIR along with proof, then why exactly are you here? I am ready to defend CAIR from any accusations given, provided, someone offers some proof of wrongdoing from them. Madanthony, I am afraid you have the wrong thread, we are talking about CAIR.
from their Alerts Archives: Incitement Watch: Why Islam Didn't Conquer the World link indeed this is in need for an alert :bugeye:
So far, so good. You've done a great job of delivering CAIR's reaction to Salman Rushdie, handling complaints about CAIR's funding and sectarian associations with touchy overreaction and appeals to the authority of clerical bigwigs, responded to everything with belligerence and "why are you here, none of that is illegal, etc etc", and in general convinced me that you are a genuine reperesentative of CAIR and its positions. The question I would like you to answer, if you can, is exactly how many of the Muslims CAIR represents were included in that "most" who would not actually do violence to Salman Rushdie, and how many were not. That is a matter of concern to me, and many other Americans. We have many novelists, and many Muslims, and we want all of our Muslim, ex-Muslim, and apostate novelists, poets, moviemakers, etc, to be safe from nutjobs and religious fanatics. How many of CAIR's represented sect do we have to watch out for, and supervise, and restrain ?
/sarc Yes, because site restrictions as determined by political correctness and latent bias are such damning evidence of hate. Could these sites point out where the hatred was? Or did they rely on their computer programs to tell them? /sarc off
Your ignorance must be phenomenal http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/6181949.stm http://www.mideastmonitor.org/issues/0705/0705_4.htm http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/6182125.stm
Omar Ahmad, Co-Founder of CAIR: "islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faiths, but to become dominant. The Koran, the Muslim book of scripture, should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on Earth." http://www.anti-cair-net.org/ Next. Rather, it's not that muslims have "abandoned him", but that there exists a fatwa for his death. It would be fine if islam merely abandoned him; regrettably, there still is a great deal of islamic interest in his life, and in taking it. Their basis is extremism, their objective is extremism, and their modus is religion. People are abandoning them in droves (one would hope) because it's becoming increasingly clear where their sympathies lie. Really?? To be replaced by what, then...ah. Never mind. I think I know. Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image! Like the right to sue individual citizens who alert the authorities about suspicious persons, if those persons are muslim, and for the rights to silence any critics of political islam, sharia, and dhimmitude. Of course, CAIR is blissfully happy about those who criticize other systems, naturally. "They aren't a theological or ideological organization"? Tell me: exactly how stupid are you, DH? Their raison d'etre is islam, but you seem to think they're not a theological organization?? Again:
Ooooh, argument from the majority. Wait, wait, I have the perfect response: no, everyone but you is blind! Yeah. I'll write that one down in my personal dream diary. Next.
LMAO - oh yeah. No theological or ideological motivations there, eh? Thankyou Mr. Spock. Continue scans. I'm going down to the planet; or it's going down on me.
Hey, its you who's defending an overtly extremist separatist hate site, not me. I think the fact that it is blocked, is sufficient to qualify it as a hate site. I'm only surprised it took so long for them to smell the bullshit.
YES, good enough. Videotapes, a passport at the site, passengers phoning their families as they attempt to retake the plane, planes on videos crashing into things, Osama taking responsibility for the attacks, widespread cheering of same attacks in the islamic world. Extraordinary evidence. I did, and rapidly concluded that it was possibly the most vapid analysis ever. Based on some wild suppositions about the differing appearance of "mad Osama #3" (which sounds like a disco track from Damascus), the author concludes that it's not the same idiot, despite the fact that it obviously bloody is. It's only "inevitably" true if you're basically an islamic supremacist douchebag. Here's a question: how do you know the other Osamas are the real deal? Maybe they're the fakes, and #3 is the real one. How do you know? Have you met OBL?
Rather, it's you that's defending an overtly extremist organization. But I tell you what: shut down all the radical groups running around beheading and oppressing people, and we'll shut down all the "extremist" sites criticizing islamic politics and society for doing so. Fair? Or CAIR? Ah. So the fact that Bush hasn't been impeached is proof of his inculpability? That was a quick flip. Not to worry. The blockings are being steadily...what's the term...reverted back to the status quo ante.