Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by Wisdom_Seeker, May 17, 2007.
Whats the use to us of those Jerks having SuperNatural Powers ?
Anyways they are already dead.
Log in or Sign up to hide all adverts.
What about Mosses or Muhammad or Bahá'u'lláh or Joseph Smith Jr, etc... any of those guys make it to the "enlightened one" status?
thats some good input there, you profound wisdom holder. lots of people are already dead but there teachings and findings live on,
da vinci .....................................or fuck em there all dead?
yeah joseph smith was enlightened but the people that believed him sure wasnt Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!
Supernormal powers are simply byproducts of a higher dhyana....anyone and everyone has them already.....
Supernormal powers are not a sign of enlightenment...the only real sign of the highest perfection is if you're no longer able to experience even the slighest, smallest, most infinitesmal degrees sufferings....free at last...
U mean they have taught how to get those powers ?
So how come i am still unable to do some of those things ?
Those jerks did some magic tricks to impress people like u bak then, That makes them real historic THUGS.
Have you ever tried to get rid of all your insecurities and defiling impulses? Have you ever tried meditating or concentration or anything? No, well then these powers are basically impossible for you....
The Buddha said there was no point in doing miracles because the skepitcal would insist that no matter what you were doing magic tricks...
i went to buddhas birthday celebration yesteday in L square london, it was quite good, i cant see why there was a police presence there though, not as if the peacefull buddhist gathering was going to break out in a riot.
Perfect. 'defiling impulses.' A good summation of the hypocrisy at the heart of Buddhist. Let go and accept everything OUTSIDE you but make sure to hate certain things INSIDE you.
A dualism claiming to be a monism.
A replacement of (amongst other things) hatred directed outward with one directed inward
as if those were the only two options.
What are you talking about? Its more like let go of everything inside of you and remove everything you hate inside of you....after this how can fear, anger, sorrow, anxiety, etc...exist if the cause of these things (defiling impulses) no longer exist?
Mosses had an Egyptian Pince education, with access to the highest secrets of the priests, he was an iniciate in the cult of Isis, yes of course I think Mosses was a Buddha.
I didn´t heard of Bahá'u'lláh before, but after a little research, I found his words ammong the words of the enlightened souls:
" ...is not the object of every Revelation to effect a transformation in the whole character of mankind, a transformation that shall manifest itself both outwardly and inwardly, that shall affect both its inner life and external conditions? For if the character of mankind be not changed, the futility of God's universal Manifestations would be apparent."
"Know thou of a truth that the soul," Bahá'u'lláh confirms, "after its separation from the body, will continue to progress until it attaineth the presence of God, in a state and condition which neither the revolution of ages and centuries, nor the changes and chances of this world, can alter. It will endure as long as the Kingdom of God, His sovereignty, His dominion and power will endure."
Bahá'u'lláh states that: "the peoples of the world, of whatever race or religion, derive their inspiration from one heavenly Source, and are the subjects of one God."
So yes, I believe Bahá'u'lláh was a Buddha too, I also believe Acharya Rajneesh (aka Osho) was enlightened.
You see, the message is almost the same. They all knew a higher truth that cannot be put into words, they try not to explain God (impossible), but they come with a message of love and encourage people to "know thyselfs" in order to reach this divine knowledge that comes from God, and we can only find it deep within our inner most selfs.
See the parallels between Bahá'u'lláh and what Osho teaches:
"How can one become enlightened in one single moment? One can, because one is enlightened -- one just has to recognize the fact. It is not something that happens from the outside, it is something that arises from the inside. It has always been there but you were clouded, you were full of thoughts."
"Enlightenment is nothing but your becoming light, your inner being becoming light.
Perhaps you are aware that the physicists say that if anything moves with the speed of light, it becomes light—because the speed is so great that the friction creates fire. The thing is burned, there is only light. The material disappears, only immaterial light remains.
Enlightenment is the experience of an explosion of light within you.
Perhaps your desire to be enlightened is moving with the speed of light, like an arrow, so that your very desire, your very longing becomes a flame, an explosion of light. There is nobody who becomes enlightened, there is only enlightenment. There is only a tremendous sunrise within you.
I must have come across hundreds of mystics describing it as if suddenly thousands of suns have risen within you. That is a common expression in the mystic's language, in all languages, in different countries, in different races.
Enlightenment simply means an experience of your consciousness unclouded by thoughts, emotions, sentiments. When the consciousness is totally empty, there is something like an explosion, an atomic explosion. Your whole insight becomes full of a light which has no source and no cause. And once it has happened, it remains. It never leaves you for a single moment; even when you are asleep, that light is inside. And after that moment you can see things in a totally different way. After that experience, there is no question in you.
Enlightenment means being fully conscious, aware. Ordinarily we are not conscious and not aware. We are doing things either out of habit or out of biological instincts…
Just as Freud's conscious mind, unconscious mind, and Jung says collective unconscious mind, I say there is a superconscious mind and collective conscious mind. To reach to the collective conscious mind they are going to the roots and I am going to the flowers.
But they're all interconnected and all the devices and matters are to discover in you, something which is simply watchfulness.
For example, I can watch my body—certainly I'm not the body. I can watch my hand: it's hurting, but I'm not the hurt—I'm the watcher. I can watch my thoughts, then I'm not the thought. I'm the watcher and I can watch even the watcher. That is the moment beyond which you cannot go and enlightenment comes.
Enlightenment is simply that you become so conscious, so full of light, that it starts overflowing your life, your being. You can impart it."
I don´t know much of Joseph Smith, but ammong other quotes on which "mormons beliefs" he said:
"We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law."
I don´t dismiss the posibility of he being enlightened, but I really, really don´t think so. Because if a man gives you a series of texts on wich you need to believe, then he is giving you a belief system, and he becomes your enemy. That is not the case of enlightened masters.
I disagree Wisdom Seeker,
Not every spiritual teacher was a Buddha....it is clearly evident that Jesus, Gautama, Krishna, and Lao Tzu were probably Buddhas.....but Moses and Mohommad were obviously not....they were regular human beings influenced by other divine beings....just messengers of divine beings....they did not perform their own miracles but had other beings do it for them...and did not preach in the same way as Krishna, Buddha, and Jesus....
Who would you say was the last enlightened being (buddha) to walk the earth.... ?
St Francis of Assisi
Sure man, you can disagree, the fact is we will never be certain of that fact, not me and not you, so we can only asume.
For me, it is a 50/50 situation, they could have been enlightened, the same way as they could not.
I would say Osho (Acharya Rajneesh) was the last one (died in 1990) with the greatest impact on mankind´s destiny.
Although I think Osho was the last one that spoke loudly, and leaved a great legacy; I also think there has been Enlightened beings in every generation, including ours. So in fact, we could have encountered a Buddha in our life, but we "crucified him" by judging him. So from my perspective, is perfectly feasible that each of us could have seen a walking living Christ ammong us, and judged him with our egos, not letting the man even speak to us.
As they are different types of enlightened persons, ammong them, are the ones that keep their knowledge to themselves, there are others, that try to give us the message, but in a very difficult way for us to understand. And there are others, that succeed in teaching us.
Today, possibly, I´d say the following teachers are enlightened:
Sathya Sai Baba
There can be others, but I honestly do not know.
We have to take in consideration, that even if anyone can be a Christ, NOONE can be a Jesus, because even if we succeed in being one with the Cosmos, each of us is a very different individual. The key is acceptance.
Another thing that we have to take in consideration:
Imagine if we would have to teach the science of the colors to a blind person. It would be a difficult task indeed, to teach red, blue, yellow... to a blind person, how can you describe each color and how is manifested in the whole world?
That is the problem that enlightened beings encounter, it is very difficult to teach what enlightment is, to a person that have not experience it. So, like one of us trying to teach the colors to the blind, real communication does not exist, because the experiences are different.
So Enlightened beings are not here to teach us what enlightment is, but to teach us how to reach it. The thing is, there is not one path to reach it, there are paths towards enlightment as there are people in this planet.
There were probably innumerable people who achieved Buddhahood being Pratyekabuddhas but I don't think there were ANY supremely enligtened Buddhas who became world-teachers since Jesus himself....this calendar is marked by Jesus....
Yeah, but the reason I disagree is simply because people like Mohommad, Moses, and others do not match up the attributes of a Buddha...they were not God-men like Buddha, Jesus, and Krishna, who anyone can clearly know were Buddhas from their teachings and verbal utterances...
Moses was influenced by divine beings, as was Mohommad, but I wouldn't call them Buddhas....a Buddha (one who perfectly knows the truth) is rare in this world....a Samyaksam-Buddha (a Buddha who becomes a world-teacher) is even more rare......but every once in a while someone really does rise up with a perfect understanding of the truth....and perfectly teaches this truth....
So far, me.
Yeah man, I agree totally, but you are underestimating the fact of how normal people have change the scriptures to fit their own goals. Like for example, waht we know about Moses, he was a very influencial character, for me, it is no secret that there were Buddhas ammong the Egyptians, their High Priests were in one time, for real... But in 300 BC, Alexander the Great send to translate ALL of the Hebrew sacred scriptures with the 70 most wise men from Greece, but they BURNED all hebrew scriptures.
I bet they did this to control the knowledge of the people in a way or another, so I wouldn´t believe everything the scriptures say. The thing is, for me, because of the impact Moses had, I believe we could well have been an enlightened beeng, a Buddha.
Separate names with a comma.