Constructing Time from an Axiom

Discussion in 'Pseudoscience' started by Willem, Apr 30, 2019.

  1. Willem Banned Banned

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    Note that item 12 has changed due to consistency with Special Relativity.

    12.........Define "time interval" = Delta t = 1/[(1/N) \sum \limits_{n = 1}^N n(T_Sf - T_Si)]...............…........................….0-11
     
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  3. origin Heading towards oblivion Valued Senior Member

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    Thread reported so that it can be put in the correct section. My preference would be the cesspool, but it is not my call.
     
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  5. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    ... wrong thread.
     
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  7. Willem Banned Banned

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    The new 12 plus another construction about advancing when encountering a physical space node would be consistent with Special Relativity.
     
  8. NotEinstein Valued Senior Member

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    Sure, that's "regular intervals", but they have nothing to do with time or angular momentum.

    So the planet earth is partially imaginary? Since it's a sphere (very roughly), and you are claiming spheres are partially imaginary.

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    No, I don't. I can simply say that time is fundamental, and there's nothing more that needs to be added.
     
  9. Willem Banned Banned

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    Forget the angular momentum definition. Item 5 has changed and item 4.1 was added:

    4.1...…..Construct "Physical Space" = S_P = CxC/Im C.....................................................................A1, 0

    5...……..Let P_T advance by one (rotate relative to S1,2,3) when encountering a space integer coordinate and let the rotation be a quantum rotation. Call this dynamic "Sub-frequency" = T_S.............................................................................................................................…A1, 4, 4.1

    No, we were constructing special spheres that still have coordinate axises.

    If time was definable with just one axiom (A2: Time exist.) it would not need to depend on anything else, but you can't define Time like that.
     
  10. NotEinstein Valued Senior Member

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    So your argument turned out to be circular (again); glad you're seeing that too, now.

    What do you mean by "/Im C"?

    I'm getting lost by all the revisions you are doing. Can you post the complete revised argument?

    What are spheres without "coordinate axises"? How are you the spheres you are constructing "special"? And how does this address what I said?

    Right, but you've failed to produce such an argument up till now.

    Please explain why not.
     
  11. Willem Banned Banned

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    The Imaginary Axis.

    Here is the complete revised argument:


    A1: Complex numbers exists. Call this C.

    Index.....Statement...…………………………………………………………………………………….. Reason
    0......…...Import all mathematical operations...................................................…......Plato's Forms
    1...…...….Construct S = C x C.......................................................................................A1, 0
    1.1...…….S is 4 dimensional....................................................................................…...1
    2......…...S can transform...……………………………………........................................……...A1, 1, 0
    3............Construct two Riemann Spheres in S, call it RS x RS..............................…..A1, 0
    4............Isolate the Riemann Circle of S_3, 4 and call it P_T.................................…A1, 0
    4.1......…Import all physical terminology...............................................................…..Plato's Forms
    4.2...…..Construct "physical space" = S_P = CxC/S_4.......................................…...…A1, 0
    5......…..Let P_T advance by one (rotate relative to S_1,2,3) when encountering a space node of integer coordinates and let the rotation be a quantum rotation. Call this dynamic "Sub-frequency" = T_S
    ........................................................................................................................….............A1, 4, 4.2
    7......…..Define "Change in Sub-frequency" by T_Sf - T_Si…………………………………....4
    8...........Let S_1,2 be perpendicular to S_3,4.................................................................1
    11..........Construct {for all n = 1 to N: n(T_Sf - T_Si)} . Call this "Changes in Sub-frequencies.
    ..........................................................................................................................................5,7
    12.........Define "time interval" = Dt = 1/[(1/N) \sum \limits_{n=1}^N n(T_Sf - T_Si)]
    ..........................................................................................................................................0-11
     
  12. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    You still haven't commented on Plato's Forms to my satisfaction.

    I'm not special, just interested
     
  13. Willem Banned Banned

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    You read wrong my RSxRS has the two coordinate axises projected on them.

    They have infinity at the north pole.

    Don't know what you are referring to.

     
  14. NotEinstein Valued Senior Member

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    So it's: "Construct "Physical Space" = S_P = CxC The Imaginary Axis"

    That's grammatically incorrect. Please rephrase or correct.

    I think you forgot to count a couple of axioms here, by the way.

    Transform how? Into what? I've asked you this before, and all I got in response was incoherent gibberish. After I pointed that you, you ignored the point, only to repeat yourself here. Please stop being intellectually dishonest.

    Erm… What do Plato's Forms have to do with physical terminology? Also, why don't you add the axioms you're importing here to the total count?

    Another revision? Where did the "/Im C" go? Was it incorrect (as I suspected) after all?

    This is incoherent: you are trying to derive the existence of time, so the words "dynamic" and "frequency" are meaningless. Once again, you are using a circular argument. In fact, it's one that I pointed out earlier in this very thread, which you couldn't address. Please stop being intellectually dishonest.

    And again: please demonstrate that this "time interval" you end up with is identifiable with (physical) time. Please stop ignoring important issues raised; that's intellectually dishonest.
     
  15. Willem Banned Banned

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    Since I am only using mathematical operators and physical terminology, I don't think it is necessary to include mathematical and physical axioms. These exists apart from anything needing axioms. I don't need the properties of the operators, just the operators themselfs

    By any conformal map or the Riemann Sphere.

    They are also ideas that fit in this category.

    It's an equivalent statement.

    Item 5 defines them.

    It ticks like a clock for anything moving in space. All objects move in space since there isn't a distinguished static point of space.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2019
  16. NotEinstein Valued Senior Member

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    Not really though. Things like equality (as in: the equal sign) are axioms, if I'm not mistaken. For example, see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axiom#Logical_axioms

    Erm… You are using the properties of the operators, so yes, you do need those.

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    That you have specified where?

    So they are irrelevant in that step. Why did you mention them then?

    Are you sure? The only definition of "/Im C" that you gave turned out to be gibberish.

    OK, so the words "dynamic" and "frequency" that you use may have nothing to do with the words "dynamic" and "frequency" as they are used in English and science. Why not pick different words to avoid confusion then?

    "Ticks" and "moving" presuppose time. Once again, you are using circular argument. Remember: you are trying to derive time. That means you cannot use anything related to time, because what would be begging the question.

    And thus time exists in a fundamental way. Which is the alternative I brought up, but you dismissed. Yet here you are, proving that time is inherent in the system of physics that you are using. So once again, your reasoning fails. (And since we're in the science-section, I get to note that I'm starting to get decent statistical significance on a pattern that I'm seeing.

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  17. NotEinstein Valued Senior Member

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    Also, any chance of you responding to my post #34? It's quite intellectually dishonest to just ignore the issues I raised there. (Edit: I'm starting to get statistical significance on TWO patterns, in fact!

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  18. Willem Banned Banned

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    So I need more axioms. It will be rewritten.

    Where should I specify them?

    I use terminology further on in the derivation.

    I did pick "Sub-frequency". Replace "Dynamic" with "Non-static".

    You omitted a devide by sign. After the following item they are equivalent:

    1.1...…...Label S by indices of axises S_1,2,3,4 in order: Re, Im, Re, Im…………………………………………………………………..1

    Replace with:

    13...…..Delta t advances like a clock and is consistent with Special Relativity...…………………………………………………….12

    In my next reply.
     
  19. Willem Banned Banned

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    That is circular.

    I don't have evidence it is just speculation.

    Can you prove that?
     
  20. Willem Banned Banned

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    What do you mean by "inherent"?
     
  21. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

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    I have given up reading this thread as my 3 neuron brain cannot stand the G forces coming from my impression of the head spinning in The Exorcist

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  22. Willem Banned Banned

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    It is not circular but for a given system you cannot prove which clock gives the correct time without my derivation.
     
  23. Willem Banned Banned

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    It is not circular but for a given system you cannot prove which clock gives the correct time without my derivation.
     

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