Covid-19 Virus Vàriants?

Discussion in 'Biology & Genetics' started by KUMAR5, Jun 13, 2021.

  1. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    You don't understand evolution.
    Are you really telling yourself that these questions come from "deep thinking?" They come from ignorance. Remember when you didn't understand that the adaptive immune system responded differently to viruses than to bacteria? That was not deep thinking. That was not you being incisive. That was ignorance.
    Your adaptive immune system is really not like a mugger. They are different.
     
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  3. KUMAR5 Registered Senior Member

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    Do you feel that evolution support only growth not survival? If it also support survival, it will also oppose all such odds which will come into the way of one's survival.

    We may have non-specific and specific immune system. Non-specific does not discriminate in any foreign substance but specific one can discriminate in all types of foreign substances...may it be virus, bacteria or other or even in their variants(if not in between every individual germ).
     
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  5. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Again, if you are asking that question, you don't understand evolution.
     
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  7. KUMAR5 Registered Senior Member

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    "Evolution is the change in the characteristics of a species over several generations and relies on the process of natural selection"

    To achieve it, whether survival and growth for a change are not basics?

    Say for example, if a Covid Virus will not survive and grow(replicate) how it can evolve or become a variant?
     
  8. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    But sometimes you defeat him, and he leaves, and acquires superpowers, and comes back to defeat you.
    Sometimes you THINK you defeated him but he shows up again right before the final scene.
    Sometimes it's really a vast government conspiracy that makes you THINK you were attacked, when actually you are living in the Matrix.
    And of course sometimes you're attacked by a giant robot that can turn into a truck.
     
  9. KUMAR5 Registered Senior Member

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    In short, multiple possibilities or POVs are linked to everything unless it came to absolute level. Hence deep and mutiple thinkings are always needed for absolute understsnding a thing still under prócess.
     
  10. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Nope. Not even close.
     
  11. KUMAR5 Registered Senior Member

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    Coming back to OP, what can be the basic or true reasoning to getting covid virus variants? Nature, interventions or both?
     
  12. KUMAR5 Registered Senior Member

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    Btw, can declared more efficacy of one vaccine be really compared and justified with other vaccine whose efficacy is declared lesser or all vaccine's efficacy can be similar. Because to make one-to-one, head-to-head comparisons between vaccines, they need to have been studied in the same trial, with the same inclusion criteria, in the same parts of the world, at the same time and with no other variant of virus is exposed anywhre where trials are conducted. Had it happened? If same inclusion in all trials are not happened and obiously these may also be different in real world field applications, how efficacies can be well justustified?
     
  13. KUMAR5 Registered Senior Member

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    Delta Plus Variant


    Delta plus variant is causing lot of worry here although it is not yet become VOC due to low incidence in India.
    It is thought to be more serious and Antibody Cocktail treatment may be ineffective on it.

    However other big worry is, can it show any significant immune escape?
     
  14. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,994
    That is not quite true. There is often powerful selection against organisms whose particularities of code or phenotype make them more vulnerable to accident, including deleterious mutations.
    Are you confusing Covid with AIDS?
     
  15. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    20,163
    The factors that drive natural selection are myriad, and include random or semi-random processes. (Weather, natural disasters, accidents etc.) However, the process of natural selection is not random - it selects for the ability to produce viable offspring, which is very deterministic.
     
  16. KUMAR5 Registered Senior Member

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    No, it is suspected with Delta plus virus.
     
  17. KUMAR5 Registered Senior Member

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    If so, how variations in offsprings can happen? Few offsprings are weak other strong. Moreover disadvantageous generic variations like hybridization should also be happening. In nature, every being is dependent of other being so both weaker ones and stronger ones are needed to sustain the nature. How logically, nature then can only select all fittest?
    In short, Logically, I feel that natural selection may not only be meant for advantageous surrvival it shoukd also be meant to provide needed food to sustsin the nature eg. Fruits.
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2021
  18. Vmedvil Registered Senior Member

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    The Weaker variants die more easily and thus are less likely to reproduce, especially in viruses. In humans if some woman sees a dude that is a freak of nature due to mutation then she is less likely to have sex with him thus he is less likely to reproduce. The weaker variants go extinct! On the opposite side of the spectrum if you have a dude that is really attractive because of mutation of proper genes then all the girls will have sex with him and he will have 90 children thus passing those adaptive mutations to all of them. In the case of viruses adaptive mutations will allow more virions to make it to reproduction in cells evading the forces that are against them, more reproduction = more adaptive the mutation. These are simple examples of how this plays out in humans and viruses.

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    Last edited: Jul 2, 2021
  19. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Random mutations. Mendelian inheritance. Things like that.
    By killing off the weakest before they reproduce. Their genes are not propagated.
    You may feel that, but your feelings are incorrect. Many fruit plants evolve by becoming attractive to herbivores, who eat the fruit and thereby spread the seeds (and provide manure) for the next generation of fruit plants. Being eaten by a herbivore is a win for fruit plants that propagate in this manner.
     
  20. KUMAR5 Registered Senior Member

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    Fruits are good example, meant for both food and for survival by dispersing its seeds. Accordingly these are also naturally selected. Hence, mostly, nature or natural selection should be meant for both purposes not just for survival. Indirectlly, food is also meant for survival. We do not see, nature is only one sided. It is both compassiate and cruel. Accordingly, natural selection should be there. Few are selected for food other for survival. Survival is infinite so the foods.
     
  21. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    20,163
    There is no "both purposes." The fruit we are talking about evolves to be more edible so more of its offspring survive. It's survival.
     
  22. KUMAR5 Registered Senior Member

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    So, it may suggest advantageous(more edible and more tasty) foods and advanyageous survival is linked with each other. Probably there is a miss in understabding natural selection in full.
     
  23. KUMAR5 Registered Senior Member

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    Hence, logically, it appears quite possible', whatever needed to sustain nature and its balance is naturally selected. Mostly, we look only one side of it i e. Survival of fittest. But this may not be sufficient to sustain and balance the nature so we may also need tó look other angles. One such sngle is providing sufficient food to sustain the fittest ones.
     

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