Defending a Belief

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Bowser, Feb 21, 2018.

  1. Bowser Right Here, Right Now Valued Senior Member

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    I suppose that depends on your value of the outcome, of what did happen? As I said, good sometimes arises from bad. But then again, it's not all so much good. Look at the collapse of the Soviet Union--good for us, not so good for the Russians. Would it be honest to refer to current Russia as a Mafia State?
     
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  3. Bowser Right Here, Right Now Valued Senior Member

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    Good and Bad as a frame of reference. I'm assuming you have one.
     
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  5. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    I thought I had outlined why I liked not qualify things good or bad but you take it to a level I dont understand.

    Do you think I cant make something good out of ww2?

    Well I could but I doubt if you would enjoy my game.

    My idea using the "things just are" is a mechanism not to be judging this and that as it passes by each day...it deals with trivia.

    I thought that would be obvious but as you miss that let me point out...I like to treat things as "just are" because it allows me to avoid commenting on film stars, foot ball or the trending tweets...I see no need to waste time on forming an opinion on so much stuff...and I see others who get worked up over nonsemse really...kids wear their pants wrong...just is...I dont need to judge...its no big deal.
    Its a mechanism for avoiding judgement on mostly trivial mattets.

    Everyone must have an opinion ..why...I dont have opinions on many things and I feel better for not wasting my time.

    Why you have to bring up nazi stuff I really dont know I think it was highly inappropriate but I will treat your action as "just is" and not think anymore about it.


    This thread is about defending belief well I have no intention to defend my belief that most people judge situations when there is no need...I dont need to judge movie stars or football etc...just are...I really dont see a problem.. .


    Alex
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2018
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  7. Bowser Right Here, Right Now Valued Senior Member

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    I wasn't calling you a Nazi. I wanted to show that we all hold notions of "good" and "bad." We might agree on some and disagree on others, but they do exist, even if they are just concepts in the mind. The belief system is, I think, part of those fundamental relationships.

    Have a good night, X
     
  8. birch Valued Senior Member

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    5,077

    this is funny because you do that all the time. everyone does. do you realize what you post?
     
  9. birch Valued Senior Member

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    5,077
    so killing someone is neither good or bad. you just amazingly said that it would be okay to kill someone for no apparent reason or justification.

    oh mods?? why aren't they banished?? why are others banished for supporting unethical propositions??

    seems a bit strange. i suppose as long as you are not direct about having zero ethics then it's okay.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2018
  10. birch Valued Senior Member

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    5,077

    so your position is that it doesn't matter. why are others who are direct about their opinions on this forum banned? like the last guy who was an admitted white nationalist. at least there is something to discuss and debate that way. are the mods stupid or just hypocrites?
     
  11. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    I did not for a moment think that you were calling me a nazi...I would not give the name capitals for a start.
    As I said I thought it would be clear it is a mechanism to avoid un necessary judgement...and of course I understand there is good and bad...but most times we simply do not need to decide and can let it pass.
    Think of the kids pants thing...I have heard folk go on and on about it being bad, silly or stupid...and my approach is .." it just is" ...what should I care if they want to wear their pants on their head I really dont care...but many just waste time and mind space over it...it does not matter so why bother.
    Most of the worlds problems come from folk who are unable to resist judging others.
    And for the most part folk busy judging others could do well to look to their own problems and concentrate of improvement within.

    I dont quote the bible but one good part..at least I think it comes from the bible..is..judge not lest ye shall be judged...there is a message there that I seem to have singularly taken on.
    Alex
     
  12. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    5,246
    Get over it.
    If anyone could benifit from not judging I suspect it would be you.

    The times you go on and on judging others is frankly tiresome...Why the need?

    What qualifies you to judge so many things? so many people?

    What makes you think you are somehow better than other humans such that you are happy to measure them only by your standards.

    What is so wonderful about your opinion that puts up above others.

    If you just said to yourself..things just are I think you could avoid a great deal of stress.

    Yet you cant help judging others..how do you feel about kids wearing their pants so low...of course you will have an opinion...a judgement.


    You could take that wasted time and energy in judging others and constructively address issues you have.

    Think low self esteem as you try to elevate for some reason and thats my guess.


    My point is simple and it works for me but if you wish to judge me and that makes you feel superior well you know what my responce is...just is...I dont care you see...its your problem and although I hate to see folk suffer you bring the problem on yourself.

    Stop talking rubbish.

    Who are you to say to I have zero ethics..thats a lie.
    Its nonsense and beneath me to even respond.


    Do you even know what you are arguing against or for?

    Have I said something so bad?

    What have I missed to cause such an un reasonded response...if you are accusing me of something please be specific because I just dont get it.

    I use the mechanism mainly because I dont want to be bitter and twisted like so many people I see who cant help judging everything.

    Alex
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2018
  13. Michael 345 Home 2 days still jet lag sleepy Valued Senior Member

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    No real idea what you mean here. I guess mods have a framework within which they work. I would be surprised if the framework was written in an unbreakable code. I also guess if they step outside the code they would be informed of their transgression

    My PERSONAL view of posters - I don't do stupid. I do not care for what they post - on goes the iggy button

    It is NOT a judgement about good / bad and not really about stupid / intelligent

    It PERSONALLY does not interest me enough to follow what they post

    Ban posters / don't ban posters - if I have a PERSONAL option to iggy why would I care what the mods do

    Nobody is twisting my sac to be here

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  14. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    Do what all the time? Dont generalise be specific...

    You strike me as a decent person but you do go off half cocked.

    Re read what I said and take time to understand what I am saying and if you want to point out something specific you know I will be all ears.
    I try to be clear and simple but I accept you may get a message that I was not sending.
    But to say I have zero ethics has no basis and indicates you are going off at me but presumably thinking about some other negative experience...I dont know what you are thinking or who you are relating me to...but you have over stepped the mark with your lie that I have zero ethics or morals...stepped way over the line and I will not forget that.
    I can forgive you however.
    Alex
     
  15. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    I get it.
    Its the nazi thing is it.
    Is that your problem birch?
    I cant have my mechanism to deal with trivia unless I take on board that nazi is bad..I see.
    Take something trivial and use it to go political.
    Bowser look what you have done.
    Dragged the thread into the mud.
    Anyways I dont care about nazi and certainly will not let their stain on the world influence my trivial " it just is" stuff.
    Get over it.
    Are you so silly you think I dont know real bad when I see it...do you read anything I complain about re social injustice, animal cruelty etc etc...
    Give me strength.
    Alex
     
  16. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    5,246
    I did not.

    That is another lie.

    What is your problem?

    Point out where I said this or withdraw and appogise...please.



    Alex
     
  17. Xelasnave.1947 Valued Senior Member

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    Oh and I suppose my strong advocacy for the rights of women has gone un noticed also.

    Alex
     
  18. river

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    The individual does place credibility of scientific research .

    The problem is , who is doing the research ?

    The who is important , because they can be bias towards their wants outcome of the research .
     
  19. birch Valued Senior Member

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    5,077
    no. your reply is that you are not taking responsibility or ownership of your claim which is simply that it does not matter. that is what you said, not me. you are trying to turn it around that i'm being judgemental. you are being unreaistic. if you didn't exercise judgement of good versus bad, right or wrong then you could not survive or take actions to benefit yourself or others. or especially, stop yourself from actions that would harm versus benign or beneficial. you have to discern and discriminate. if you really want to get technical as the pretense, the key word is discrimination. we all must use discrimination on some level to make choices. so you are judgemental on many issues on other threads and topics. that is what i am pointing out yet you pretend that you have no opinions on right or wrong. but you actually do just as everyone else does.

    you also just pretend that i am the only one who uses judgement. there are people laying judgement all over the place on topics. have you read the politics subforum? how about threads regarding sexual harassment. i suppose that is wrong to judge sexual harassers, according to you but i'm the only one who judges, right? bullshit. your poor analogy of equating the rightness/wrongness of random killing versus people wearing their pants low is a purposeful false one. this is to ignore the issue and your claim.

    also, for someone who claims that nothing really is good or bad (which is ridiculously stupid farce on it's face), it's very clear that you are upset by my disagreement. if nothing matters either way, why are you so 'judgemental' about my opinion? you would like to pretend you don't make judgements but you do because you have feelings, opinions, values and senses just like anyone else.

    why you take that so personally offensive is ridiculous. i'm just pointing out a truth. you don't need to be upset at a truth that is not actually personal about you. it's just a general truth which you are refusing to recognize. lol
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2018
  20. Michael 345 Home 2 days still jet lag sleepy Valued Senior Member

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    If you really really want to get technical again good / bad do not exist as entities

    If you think you are discriminating between good / bad you are not. You are making a decision based on the information you have at any given moment

    Only in hindsight can ANY decision be looked at as being the mythical good or bad

    And even then it can fluctuate between the extreme values assigned to the sliding scale used to judge

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  21. birch Valued Senior Member

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    well, then don't use the pretense you don't judge then. it's that simple. if you are for women's rights, then that means you have made a judgement that misogyny is wrong. is there a problem? are you afraid to offend anyone, is that it? it doesn't matter as anyone's stand on any matter will offend someone out there or think you are being 'judgemental' (as in unfair or unjust or just none of your business).

    i recall you made some posts regarding your opinions on what should happen to pedophiles and 'wife-beaters'. that's a judgement. as well as your opinions on religion. that is also a judgement.

    geez. the point is rather simple and obvious. why you would be offended is beyond me.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2018
  22. birch Valued Senior Member

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    5,077
    yes, thank you for pointing out the obvious. the point was blatantly illustrated with the dynamite and nuclear weapons example. or did you miss that point? how something is used and for what purpose as well as why, determines the evaluation of good or bad and whom/how it affects. duh??
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2018
  23. birch Valued Senior Member

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    5,077
    i've seen this time and again on this forum where a compartmentalized opinions will be slated that there is no right or wrong to anything. if it was just pointed out that there is technically no right or wrong in itself without context, that would not be in error. these opinions are not slated for that meaning. it's meant to literally make the point that there is actually no good or evil in anything that occurs or one does. that is very much implicit in the statements. the stupidity is how they assume they are 'safe' in expressing that when it's not tethered to an actual event or issue. when it is the case, then they are on board right on cue with the status quo opinions, politicking and conventional social rules/moral mores.

    but then people really show their true opinions when they say nothing matters such as random killing or what the nazi's did and take it far. i personally don't believe random killing is right (not all killing) or what the nazi's did. that's a judgement. then they contradict themselves all over the place on the rest of the forum spouting how they disapprove/approve on the wrong or right on all manners of issues. and no one ever points out the bizarre contradiction.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2018

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