Defining the noun "Liberal"

Discussion in 'Ethics, Morality, & Justice' started by Bowser, Nov 18, 2016.

  1. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah, all you need do is google.

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  3. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    That's your belief, but that doesn't make it true. It's a common right wing meme. I just gave you a number of examples of "conservative" universities": private universities that are very conservative. And I have repeatedly asked you you mean by "liberal" and you haven't been able to answer that question. How do you know what liberalism is if you cannot define it? Is it anyone who isn't a Republican or anyone who doesn't subscribe to your brand of "conservatism"? And if so, why is that bad?
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2016
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  5. Bowser Namaste Valued Senior Member

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    The "Echo Chamber." There are so many more readily available on YouTube. All you need do is take the time to watch them.

     
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  7. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    Transcript, or forget it.

    Your childlike vulnerability to video manipulation is obvious, but there's no reason the rest of us have to suffer.
     
  8. Bowser Namaste Valued Senior Member

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    Well, let me offer another. The whole controversy revolved around Halloween costumes. And, yeah, they are Yale students. For f*** sake, what the hell is going on in our universities?

     
  9. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah, you still have your head in the right wing echo chamber. You take a few seconds of video and you infer all this stuff for which you have no evidence. In the video you just referenced, it was maybe 10 seconds in which an insult was made and a person lunged toward someone. You have no idea who the parties were or what the disagreement was about. As has been repeatedly pointed out to you, facts matter and you have none to support your many assertions.


    You have been shown numerous examples of right wing attacks on the media from legitimate sources, all of which you ignored, and instead you keep focusing on these specious anonymous video clips posted on the web.
     
  10. Bowser Namaste Valued Senior Member

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    Well, you people need to "decolonize your mind." I'm not making this this stuff up. It's coming out of higher education. I can only assume it's what is being offered as education.



    Do you really need a "script" to understand how we are cheating our youth?
     
  11. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    No you are not making that stuff up, but you are misrepresenting it. You have yet again referenced a specious video. You have taken it out of context and misrepresented it as representative of the whole, and it isn't.

    You should ask yourself why is it the American right is so heavily dependent upon deception.

    I can point to a number of Republican congressmen who have said stupid things which run contrary to science. For example, many Republicans don't believe in evolution. They believe man and dinosaurs coexisted.

    Despite overwhelming evidence, Republicans don't believe the science of climate change.

    Many Republicans believe women who are raped cannot get pregnant, and I can go on and on about the many non-scientific beliefs right wingers hold dear.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2016
  12. Bowser Namaste Valued Senior Member

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    How much must I show you to make you a believer. Here, a protest over a "Safe Space." Berkeley no less.



    We're doomed if they ever enter society.
     
  13. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    You will never learn what is going on at our universities until you learn to read essays and reason with words.
    Give up on the stupid videos. They only confirm that you have no conception of liberalism whatsoever, and are getting your entire political viewpoint from the intellectual equivalent of laundry soap ads and James O'Keefe documentaries.

    Here's a genuine liberal, talking about somebody you've heard of: Bill Clinton.
    Now: do you think the Clintons - either of them - are liberals? Why do you think that?

    Here's another quote from a genuine, vetted, solid core liberal:
    Now: Do you think C students at Yale are liberals? Do you have a general notion of who goes to Yale, and what kinds of business and government higher-ups currently and recently in the news are products of a Yale education?
     
  14. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    And how is that evidence of anything other than a youthful protest? How is that evidence "lefties" are becoming more extreme as you have alleged? How is that evidence "lefties" are trying to suppress the press as you have alleged?

    Unfortunately for you and your fellow right wing zealots, facts and reason still matter.
     
  15. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    I find it odd that so many far right conservatives cannot process information unless it is in video or talk radio format. I can read a lot faster than I can listen to a video or a radio show, and it takes far less bandwidth to read text than to watch a video.

    Perhaps it's the difference in how conservatives vs liberals think. I find that liberals tend to gather information from a wide variety of sources; conservatives prefer to be fed their opinions in a two to ten minute video, with voices, music, emotional content and images carefully chosen to create the correct opinion.
     
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  16. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Staff Member

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    #NeverTrump

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    Liberalism, historically speaking, describes the endeavor to open the benefits of civilized society to more and more people.

    Conservatism, historically speaking, describes the endeavor to reserve those benefits of civilized society as privileges of a few supported by the efforts of many.

    This is why, as Marx and Engels put it, "The history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles."

    Once upon a time, when certain issues were settled, conservatives would grudgingly concede, and then add a petulant, "because you say so" idea. You know, like equality includes the right of a woman to control her body enough to refuse sexual intercourse: Okay, fine, but only because "feminists" and "liberals" say so. Over time, it seems conservatives have come to believe their own delusion.

    That is to say, FIRE, as an organization, merely went after a "because I say so" standard. Someone writes an insupportable thesis on the basis of because they say so, the only apparent reason they don't get hired is because of political bias, and they know that assessment is right because they say so, and the only real equality is to make room for deliberately crafted misrepresentations alongside genuine academic study ... because they say so. Generally speaking, FIRE is one of those frivolous lawsuit manufactories by which a conservative can demonstrate the lie about Republican politics appealing for tort reform.

    At any rate, David French, formerly the president of FIRE, was also a face of the #NeverTrump movement among conservatives, as some elitist newspaper columnists such people attend whenever the content suits their fancy tried to recruit him↱ to run on a third-party ticket.

    No, Bowser, you've shown your problem runs a lot deeper than that. Like the time you pretended to not know what rape culture was, ignored the answers people gave you, and then proceeded to Google the question with the result that the only information you managed to find was false-pretense political ranting. In fact, you're kind of reliable that way.

    But that's the problem with being so lazy.

    You don't write arguments because you don't know how. And that ignorance leaves you with nothing more to argue than telling people to watch this or that bigot lying to people via YouTube, or sending people off to read someone else in lieu of actually putting some effort into expressing yourself.

    In my lifetime, the parents that preceded me underwent a practical transformation: "No!" and, "Don't hit!" became, "Use your words".

    In our adulthood, Bowser, I would encourage you to use your words.

    But that requires effort, I know. And, yeah, we're already aware that putting some honest effort into your agitation is just too much to ask.

    Do you have anything more than sloth and propaganda? Are you capable of using your own words to write an arguable thesis?

    Seriously, all we know about the case you're presenting is that you're exceptionally lazy and gullible, at best.
     
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  17. Bowser Namaste Valued Senior Member

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    You might disagree with my view that the Left is moving us backward, segregating people into groups, but I think it's a tragedy. Worse yet, it's taking place in our schools.

    Just one more , Tiassa. Why use my own words when others can say it so much better?

     
  18. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Well, here is the thing, you have been repeatedly asked to support your "view" that the left is moving us backwards with, you know, evidence and reason, and you have provided neither. It would be easier to agree with you if you could support your "view" if you could back it up with evidence and reason. But you can't. That should bother you, but it doesn't.

    Then why do you need to say anything at all if others can say it so much better?
     
  19. Bowser Namaste Valued Senior Member

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    I've given you visuals and the voices of others to illustrate the problem. I can't say it any better or offer any better evidence than what is already abundantly clear. There are those who want to save the Left from its excesses and bring it back from the abyss. It really is in the hands of those who claim to be Liberals. The change will not come from the Right. My fear is that the Left will double down and make matters worse, further isolating themselves from the larger public.

    The Left is at a crossroad in history. It's being rejected now and may never recover if it can't redefine itself before it's too late. That's all I'm trying to say.
     
  20. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    You have given nonsense, and nonsense isn't a substitute for evidence and reason.
     
  21. Beer w/Straw Transcendental Ignorance! Valued Senior Member

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    Trump. The apocalypse.
     
  22. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    There are no such excesses in the US, and the people who think there are just drove the country into the ditch. All you can do is hope it's not too deep, abyssal, so that in a couple of years we can pull it back out - for the third time in my life.

    Just to houseclean: In addition to the US Left not exhibiting excesses, the Left is not in the hands of the Liberals; neither the Left nor the Liberals have anything to do with the wingnut drivel videos you post here; you don't know what the Left is, and your suppliers of illusion have wrecked any hope of your ever knowing what the noun "Liberal" designates; and so forth: but the more important issue is your refusal to read and write. Videos are a manipulator's toy, the easiest way to take advantage of the rubes in flyover land. You apparently have no defenses, intellectually, against those moving pictures. You must learn to avoid them.
    And you are not making sense, is what we are trying to get you to recognize. The US Left is in exactly the same position it was in after Reagan won in 1980, and W won in 2000. It's the country that faced a crossroads, a couple weeks ago, and took a turn into the nearest ditch. The Left, and the Liberals will help (because the US Right has gone fascist, and made itself a common enemy of all decent people), is once again facing the task of digging and pulling and winching and getting the bus back on some kind of road.

    It's not a "crossroad", it's a ditch. And nobody's facing it: the country is in it.
     
  23. Capracus Valued Senior Member

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    1,296
    And why is a predominance of liberals in professional academia a problem? Because they’re primary goal is to promote their political ideology? Think again.

    Professors are overwhelmingly liberal. Do universities need to change hiring practices?

    By Neil Gross

    Colleges and universities should expose students to a diverse array of ideas. But — here’s the first misunderstanding — just because most professors are liberal doesn’t mean the average student is being force-fed liberal ideology.

    In interviews I conducted with professors, I found that a large number teach on highly technical subjects where it would be downright weird to let politics enter the classroom. As one engineering professor put it when asked how politics factored into his work, “a chunk of metal doesn’t have politics.”

    In the social sciences and humanities, where political views are more relevant, I found very few academics whose stated goal was to sway students to their side of the political aisle. The vast majority of professors focus on teaching students the subject matter of their fields as well as basic skills such as analytical reading, writing and critical thinking. If current events do come up in classroom discussions, the usual pattern is for professors to promote what they see as open conversation.

    http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-e...conservatives-hiring-20160520-snap-story.html
     

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