The point I was making is that some things are self-evident. You seem to have conceded that point. Religous experience is self-evident as well. One must learn to have religous experiences too. Thats why people (monks) spend years meditating (observing the mind). What is universally reported by people that undergo the necessary mental training is the perception of a self-evident truth which is beyond description by language. The similiarity of the reports across cultures and times lends further credibilty to their experience (mystic christianity's "description" of God is identical to buddhist or Hindu descriptions of "buddha-nature" or "Brahman") The doctrinal differences among these religions are of academic importance only, people who have experienced it firsthand all acknowledge that what is written in books does not even come close to the truth which can only be known through direct experience. I know I'm going to get alot of mockery for saying this but the only things humanity can agree upon is math and religion.