Errors in the Bible ?

Discussion in 'Religion' started by Ted Grant II, Dec 8, 2016.

  1. Michael 345 Valued Senior Member

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    Ummmm

    Religion cannot help BUT LIVE in the real world

    because the fake fairy tale world they preach about does not exist

    However living in the real world because you have no choice in the matter and being subject to the laws of physics in the real world

    does NOT mean religious pronouncements about a fake fairy tale make that fairy tale world REAL

    Produce a few inhabitants or the boss and

    religion can truely enter the REAL REAL world of science

    Continue (in your brain) to inhabit a fantasy and please don't be surprised or upset if people question your sanity

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  3. birch Valued Senior Member

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    I like to get to the heart of the matter. what is your real issue with religion, really? do you even know?

    what fantasy am i inhabiting? i think i'm more realistic than you. i bet you don't even know what bothers you about religion so much. the better question is to ask yourself what improvements do you think society will have if religion were eradicated altogether.

    a fake fairy tale world, as you say cannot be made by religious pronouncements, then what is your issue, problem or afraid of? or can it? that's why you are uneasy because in nature (the real world and bottomline) deception and lies also work, doesn't it? now, here's a thought: ask yourself who shoulders more the blame for that, religion or nature? i don't think you'll like the answer because you would have to blame the shitty universe and it's so-called perfect laws of reason and logic and truth that allows such and even be used for cause and effect just as any form of lies and deception whether in politics, interpersonal relations etc. just the fact people can lie and deceive is the crux of it.

    also, do you think people will automatically become better people and a better society just because they don't believe in a religion? do you think north korea is a good atheistic society? did not having religion make society better? is it sane? they just elevated a man to god like status like any despotic system. if that wouldn't work, people would do it another way or use another justification. how about nazi germany? were they good christians? lol. hmm..doesn't seem religion is the real problem thar, does it? how about human nature?

    once you stop pretending nature is some pure, sweet, ethical and ideal system, then you can figure it out. besides, people believing in the virgin birth, noah's ark etc and those fairy tales are kind of inconsequential these days and doesn't stop science and has little to no impact on people like you, unless you choose to be bothered by it.
     
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  5. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    Undoubtedly some truth in this but, I would say, true of all human institutions and by no means anything specific to religion. Your point about entitlement and hiding base motives is one of the things that scandalised Martin Luther when he visited Rome and led to the Reformation. Hypocrisy is a scourge, no doubt of it. I would maintain, though, that the core aim of most religions is noble: to provide a guide for living one's life, in a disciplined way that is thoughtful towards others. The fact that almost none of us can do it reliably is a fact of human nature.
     
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  7. Michael 345 Valued Senior Member

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    Oh dear I have set off a rant

    Briefly my real real issue with religion is

    ITS A CON

    Not only is it a con

    it's a destructive con

    Do I think the world would be better off without religion?

    YES yes yes a gazillion times yes

    Nature follows the laws of physics

    Neither of those have any human characteristics

    As such I do not assign to them any human attributes

    Will the human race still be flawed and imperfect?

    YES

    But at least it won't have religion egging on the imperfections

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  8. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Do you believe your world is more real then mine? I believe in God and the teaching of Jesus , I believe in science same as you but some more skeptical in some scientific theory which you believe .
     
  9. Michael 345 Valued Senior Member

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    Your real world is exactly the same as mine

    Your thoughts about Science theories and being skeptical are in line with most people's thoughts

    Although you might be skeptical about different theories

    Doing OK so far

    Now we part ways

    Feel free to have your beliefs

    Understand I am not condersending or granting you some sort of right to you that you can have any sort of beliefs

    Mearly I really don't have any views on your beliefs
    • As long as they do not affect me and by extension people I care about
    • As long as you keep your beliefs in your brain and understand we live in a secular society
    Go in peace

    Live long and prosper

    Etc etc etc

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  10. birch Valued Senior Member

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    my rant was the truth. you just ignored the examples i gave. i'm sure the roman empire was just rosy too with the colosseum and all. interesting all manner of destruction and evil existed still. btw, remember how they persecuted the christians because they were the ones who were saying it was not right to abuse people? now, those same persecutors are also the christains of today because they joined the fold and eradicated much of the heinous. you know why? because evil does not discriminate and it could be their head on the chopping block one day also. so they woke up to an improved system. whether it was done to just save themselves or for some that were more spiritually developed and understanding true empathy/message, it was a start. if it were not for the start of religion, there would have been no progress on the humanitarian front. religion was a primitive start of humans questioning itself also as well as the human condition. of course, just as with most things, it has imperfections, falsehoods, even contradictions which need to be addressed and should be taken to task. those who are of the same nature just use the negative in the books to justify the atrocious just as the good ones are against such. the proverbial pharisees vs the true christians etc.

    you don't understand how complicated it is. it is not just religion as a vehicle, that is just one aspect. it's nature. eradicating all religion just starts at base zero and that is base nature which is going to even have worse consequences and regressive. it is about improving and modifying the works and ethical teachings as people evolve, not rendering it completely meaningless and useless. you are too focused on the base physical. lifeforms are more than the physical but a continual process of evolution of the mind, emotions, ethics/spirituality and awareness of not only ourselves but others which has to start somewhere. you don't throw out the baby with the bathwater.

    also, when it comes to nature which you mistakenly too blindly rely upon like an unquestioned faith, lies and deceit do work and have impact. that's your esteemed nature/universal laws at work, btw and if it didn't have impact or power to affect, you wouldn't be here to discuss and argue against it. that's regardless of religion, that's the negative aspect of nature at work also. that is why you have people in even politics subforum in heated debates. the truth is there but doesn't mean it can't be sidelined or thrown asunder either. it takes vigilance,
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
  11. Ted Grant II Registered Senior Member

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    188
    Really ! A quick flick through the Bible will reveal that none of the 'chapters' have titles. I think you mean 'books'. In addition, I think you will agree that 'Genesis' is not the name of the person(s) who wrote the book. I suspect you are thinking of the four Gospels, headed Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. Most Biblical Scholars agree that these names were added by later scribes who copied the copies of the copies of the copies.... of the lost originals. Our oldest fragments of these books do not have any titles.
     
  12. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    ^^^
    Noble lies?

    <>
     
  13. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    Love thy neighbour? Whoever will be chief among, let him be your servant?

    Hard to call these instructions "lies", exactly.
     
  14. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Have you read the book of Proverbs ?
     
  15. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    ^^^
    Yes.

    <>
     
    Michael 345 likes this.
  16. Michael 345 Valued Senior Member

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    Another gotta moment dodged

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  17. Dinosaur Rational Skeptic Valued Senior Member

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    It is interesting that biblical authors were incredibly ignorant of the nature of their world.

    The Magi are described as traveling toward a star & arriving at the manger where Jesus was born.

    Traveling toward a star can only lead to the the North Pole or the south Pole. The apparent position of other stars is affected by the rotation of the Earth.
     
  18. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    It's pretty much understood that they followed the star in the evening sky, when they would normally be travelling.
     
  19. Dinosaur Rational Skeptic Valued Senior Member

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    From DaveC426913 Post 55
    The above was in response to my Post
    I wonder what path would result if a person walked toward the apparent position of some star other than Polaris or the Southern Cross.


    Does anyone have an idea?
     
  20. Michael 345 Valued Senior Member

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    Don't know the mechanics or orientation but could they be following the planet Venus?

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  21. StrangerInAStrangeLand SubQuantum Mechanic Valued Senior Member

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    ^^^

     
  22. Dywyddyr Penguinaciously duckalicious. Valued Senior Member

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    Given that the "star" is mentioned in only one of the gospels I wonder why anyone bothers to lend it credence.
    One guy did a lot of checking and came up with a rare alignment that he says may have been the "star": but happened in 6 BC.
     
  23. Dinosaur Rational Skeptic Valued Senior Member

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    From Xelasnave.1947 Post 24
    The bible is an existing document. Editing would be similar to editing books on Greek (or other mythology)

    What would be the purpose if you did not destroy all existent copies of the original documents?
     

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