# Gravitational medium as a negative frequency field/wave/curve

Discussion in 'Pseudoscience' started by BdS, Apr 6, 2022.

1. ### BdSRegistered Senior Member

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Imagine a wave/field that has a ridiculous negative frequency where the first crest is very f-ing far from the source. It becomes like a curve in space (curve angled by the amplitude/mass) till the first crest.

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3. ### river

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How would this happen ? Physically . Explain further .

Last edited: Apr 7, 2022

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5. ### DaveC426913Valued Senior Member

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Pretty sure you mean fractional frequency - i.e. somewhere between zero and one. There are such things as negative frequencies, but not in the sense you are talking.

Very long gravitational waves are all over the place. Planets produce them with their orbits.
Earth produces a gravitational wave with a wavelength of one light year.

(I confess I had to ask tis last part on another forum. I had forgotten that massive oscillating bodies produce gravitational waves.)

Last edited: Apr 7, 2022
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7. ### DaveC426913Valued Senior Member

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All massive bodies create curvature in spacetime. Moving massive bodies cause changes in curvature, and those changes propagate at the speed of light.

As Earth (or any other massive body) moves in its regular orbit, it changes the curvature of spacetime around it. Since Earth's path is periodic - repeating every year - the net effect is a gravitational wave emanating from Earth at the speed of light with a frequency of one light year (because thats how far light travels during Earth's year).

It looks like this:

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(This is modeling two bodies of comparable mass, but it works just as well for the Sun and Earth).

The frequency of those waves is determined by the orbital period of the bodies.

The frequency of Earth's gravitational waves is [the inverse of one year] in seconds, or about 1/30,000,000th of a beat per second.

Pluto's year lasts 248 Earth years - producing gravitational waves with a period of 248 (Earth) years, for a frequency of about 1/8,000,000,000 of a beat per second.

Last edited: Apr 7, 2022
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8. ### river

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Highlighted

You can't disturb spacetime . Neither space nor time have any physical qualities .

9. ### DaveC426913Valued Senior Member

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If that were true, 3 billion phones with GPS would stop working.
If that were true, thousands of planes would fall out of the sky.

They don't. Thus, your belief is false.

10. ### river

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• Controversial claims should be supported with argument or evidence.

Its not a belief but a fact .

How does GPS , Disturb spacetime ?

11. ### DaveC426913Valued Senior Member

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In one breath you pretend to know a fact about a thing that, in the very next breath, you have to ask how it works.

Let me expound upon "disturb":

Gravitational potential is a field; that means it has a quantifiable, measureable value at any- and every- point in the universe.
In a static universe, those values would be static; they would not change over time.
Our universe is not static. Things move.
When massive things move, it results in changes in the field of the gravitational potential.

Thus, we have a thing F (for field) that would normally be static, and, when another thing M (for mass) is moved within it, thing F changes, and it changes based on how thing M moves.

So, in the literal sense of the word. Thing M "disturbs" thing F.

12. ### river

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Not spacetime . Agreed

13. ### DaveC426913Valued Senior Member

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GPS doesn't disturb spacetime; Spacetime disturbs GPS. If spacetime did not change, GPS devices would not work.

So: GPS devices can only work if Einstein's general relativity (gravity as curved spacetime) works.

14. ### DaveC426913Valued Senior Member

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Yes. Spacetime. Gravity is the curvature of spacetime.
When we measure gravitational potential (such as with a bathroom scale), we are measuring the curvature of spacetime.

15. ### river

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Of course it does , work without spacetime , Measurement has nothing to do whether this or that physical thing does anything .

16. ### DaveC426913Valued Senior Member

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What we are measuring with a bathroom weigh scale is the local curvature of spacetime.

If Einsteins GR were wrong, GPS phones would not work. The phone software includes a factor to account for the curvature of spacetime between satellites and Earth.

17. ### river

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Curvature of Earth .

Mathematics is important to understanding some things . Mathematics though , is not the essence of the Universe . The physical is , the essence of the Universe .

18. ### DaveC426913Valued Senior Member

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This thread is not Alt Theory; it's textbook Einsteinian GR.

I've requested it be moved to a more appropriate forum where hopefully it will attract less nonsense.

19. ### river

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What nonsense are you referring to , exactly . And why is it nonsense .

20. ### BdSRegistered Senior Member

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499
Fields doing their thing in space.

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21. ### BdSRegistered Senior Member

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There's something about an underlying curvature that those orbital changes are contributing to. Probably got something to do with the barycenter of the orbiting objects. I cant quite figure it out yet.

22. ### river

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What thing in space do they do and why ?

23. ### river

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Fluidic energy , that mass is in . Plasma .

Figure it out .