'Hostel' scenario

Discussion in 'Ethics, Morality, & Justice' started by Norsefire, Jul 16, 2009.

  1. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    Many of you, I am sure, are familiar with the films Hostel and Hostel II; supposedly, they are based on real events. The mind behind the film came across a real site that sold people, and that was their/his inspiration for the movie...although his claims were never backed up with actual evidence.

    Now, it seems quite unlikely to me that such an operation would go unnoticed for long. It would have to be extremely sophisticated in order to stay off the radar.

    However, that's fairly irrelevant to the topic: my question is, do you think that the actions in hostel are morally permissable? I suppose this is a bad way to present it, because it's a silly question to most as the operations of Hostel were entirely everything most consider immoral

    If I were to rephrase it a different way: is it justified to torture others for one's own pleasure? As the trailer for the first says, it's about experiencing "...anything you desire"; also, is sadism a part of human nature, to an extent?

    As for me, it depends: if the people are bad people, I would not have a problem with it; they're bad, and I might as well enjoy what use they can be to me; However, I would never bring myself to harming innocent people. That's my main objection to the idea.

    For those of you that have never seen the film, here's the trailer for it that conveys quite a bit

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qacVovZLSwE&feature=related
     
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  3. WillNever Valued Senior Member

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    I've seen hostel 2 only. Torturing may seem fun in theory but I don't think it is. Definitely not in ways that maim their bodies forever. You may think that it would be pleasurable to bring vengeance on evil doers, but I think the instant you cut them up and they start producing almost inhuman cries, you wouldn't find it fun anymore. You would be disgusted with yourself.

    Like that one macho acting guy in the movie who pretends that "hes the normal one" for wanting torture people, truly normal people would get scared and sickened when a girl's head is split open with a saw, like he got.
     
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  5. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    I wouldn't. Although I don't know how I'd react; still, I derive a pleasure from the thought. Only if on "bad" people, of course.

    The inhuman cries could act as a stimulation to encourage the individual.

    That's just him, though. What about the guy casually pushing his dead, mutilated body down the hall on the roller while whistling?

    The one that really got me aroused was the scene with the two ladies; it seemed extremely satisfying.
     
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  7. WillNever Valued Senior Member

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    Are you talking about the cutting of the upside down girl's back with the blade? The only violent scene that I found satisfying was when the girl knifed off the would-be torturer's penis and fed it to the dogs. That guy was too afraid to admit to himself that he wanted to hurt people, and too weak to stand up to the people who intimidated him and made him have those desires.

    Why would such cries be encouraging? What is the psychology behind torture feeling pleasant? People do those things because they want control. And people who want control over people and things are usually just afraid.

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  8. Norsefire Salam Shalom Salom Registered Senior Member

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    Yes, it was so.........artistic, so ritualistic, so satisfying.



    What does that have to do with anything? Is sadism not a natural part of the human psyche?
     
  9. WillNever Valued Senior Member

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    Natural or not, is that a good way to be? I don't think it is.

    Sadists torture because they want power. It is the security in power that drives people to seek it. Having power makes the world a less scary place, a less threatening place. They want to master others so that others cannot intimidate them anymore.

    Feeding those desires will never free those people from them, and giving them even a taste of it will increase their wish for hurting even more.

    In the end those desires ruin the torturer's life too, because they become slaves to it.

    The bottom line here is no, it's not moral. Torturing hurts others and it hurts yourself.
     
  10. swarm Registered Senior Member

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    So its a slasher torture flick? What a waste of electrons.

    Only if the are willing to agree without duress.
     
  11. I Push Wood Dreadlocked Skateboard Fanatic Registered Senior Member

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    So... If a "bad" person suddenly started begging you for mercy, explaining that they've got a wife/husband and children at home who would be lost without them, would you continue? Would that not make YOU the "bad" person in someone else's eyes, deserving of a similarly horrific fate?

    Also, one must have an incredibly strong stomach and no sense of compassion if inhuman cries would do nothing to make you take second thought. And you better be into piss, scat, and vomit, because all three tend to happen when someone loses control of their basic bodily functions when burdened with overwhelming pain...
     
  12. Mrs.Lucysnow Valued Senior Member

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    No I think sadism is an aberration. Torture is not the same as killing someone out of a sense of justice or self-defense or pragmatism. Torture is the outcome of perversity. Most people naturally abhor watching a long session of violent torture, its one thing to go through something like this in a movie its another to engage in it in real time.
     
  13. Barbie Banned Banned

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    Wtf? Of course sadism is not a natural part of the human psyche, do you realize how absurd that sounds? There is no evolutionary purpose or benefit to it. If sadism were a gene natural selection would have done away with it long ago, in fact, natural selection would have said to itself "hmm ... a sadism gene? let's see, how could getting tacks shoved up my ass and having my nipples burned with a lighter help me produce viable offspring?" Sadism is obviously a sick cultural creation, a horrible aberration of mankind which counters the very nature of the human psyche.

    Dominant sadism on the other hand, which is when you're the person who's inflicting the embarrassing pain on the parter by putting umbrellas in their bumhole and such, may definitely be an important part of the human psyche, there are tons of benefits to it, but being on the receiving end is humiliating.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2009
  14. Mrs.Lucysnow Valued Senior Member

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    No Barbie both are aberrations. Very few people have the desire to torture or are aroused by torture. Most people are sickened by it.
     
  15. Cowboy My Aim Is True Valued Senior Member

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    I don't think it would be all that difficult to pull off. I'm not familiar with the kidnapping rates in the rest of the world, but here in America people disappear all the time. I mean, not millions of people per day, but enough that someone could set up a "torture mall" a few times per year without dramatically increasing the number of kidnap victims.

    And look at it from the stand-point of Hostel: we're talking about travelers here. In a few months my wife and I will be going out of country to celebrate our first anniversary. If we're going to be gone for a week and disappear on, say, day two, we could be dead before anyone notices we didn't come home when we were supposed to.

    I don't think it's moral at all. I have no problem with killing people in self defense or as punishment for a crime, but that's a far cry from mangling people for our entertainment.
     

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