how peaceful is islam ?

Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by leopold, Feb 28, 2006.

  1. leopold Valued Senior Member

    Islam turns good men bad.Islam thrives on deception and craves death and destruction.It’s time you discovered why it’s not possible to be a good Muslim and a peaceful person. Yes it’s true, all Muslims aren’t terrorists—only the good ones are.the terrorists haven’t corrupted their religion ; Islam has corrupted them.There is no choice in Islam. There are no freedoms. The doctrine is named submission. The Qur’an orders Muslims to submit and obey. Where there is no choice, there is no freedom. Where there is no freedom there is no democracy. Therefore, where there is Islam there will be no democracy. Muslims live in social, economic, intellectual, and religious poverty. All Islam has ever been able to breed is tyranny and Islamic society has ever been able to create a productive economy. For its first 1300 years, Islam survived on the taxes and plunder confiscated from conquered peoples. In the last 100 years it has nourished itself on oil. No oil, no Islam. Tyranny and terror are expensive.unable to give his followers a reason to live, Muhammad gave them a reason to die. Muhammad ordered his Jihadists to scream “Allah is Greatest” before every one of the 75 terrorist raids he led during the first 10 years of the Islamic Era. And Allah, Muhammad’s god, confirmed the madness in each of the Qur’an’s Medina surahs. Despite what you have said, Islam is not a peaceful religion .
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  3. vincent Sir Vincent, knighted by HM Registered Senior Member


    I totally agree with you, & well said, your right in islam you have no choices, there are no freedoms of expression, or dissent, only silence or you will be silenced.

    In my honest view it is a cult, if you look back through our entire history, you will find only a cult has suceeded in making people blow themselves up or commit suicide in the act of killing others.

    The only other situation like these, are the japs crashing into us ships, that in my view was a blind belief to follow there emperors orders.

    I too would give my life to protect the queen of england, but there is no emperor or queen in the koran to follow, they are giving there lives over ink in a book.

    In the uk one suicide bomber was married with a new born child, a happy family man who taught at uk school, this man could not be called a insane militant, no his mind was being manipulated by experts, who twisted the words of the koran to make him think he was doing gods work.

    We have had white americans, australians who have also been brainwashed into terroism.

    If you ask any Hypnotist or Psychiatrist, about cults they will tell you islam is one, they have all the methods used by cults, rhythmic moving as one, chanting, non stop praying or worship.

    Christ they even have muslim prayer room in every major airport in the world, can the same be said of any other religon, such is there obsession to pray.
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  5. Yazdajerd Behold... The Bringer of Light Registered Senior Member

    to my knowledge pre muslim arabs use to kill their daughters and marry their step mothers and offer human sacrifices to idols... do u mean they were better?

    Oh... so that's why we r the only religion along with judaism that have laws that condemn criminals, thieves and murderers and states strict laws upon the rulers!

    I'm confused, am I that bad?

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    u mean the religious, i'm religious and not a terrorist. conclusion, stupid theory!

    According to my knowledge in Islam u r not to kill except in two cases, self protection and defence of the nation against an invading army... if that is terrorism, then i'm glad to be one.. only u chose to claim "Salafis r the one to interprit the Quran, no one else" (since this is a slafi interpretation) there r more than fifty sects in islam, its not up to u to say whos right whos wrong, or r u a salafi?

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    Now whos talking about tyranny

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    all religions have dogmas and u r entightled to submit to God (except Budhism who doesn't necesserily beleive in one) christianity doesn't tell u "u can beleive in christ or crucifixion or trinity" it says u should, judaism doesn't allow u to discuss the laws of Moses, u should submit to them similarly zoarostrianism with the gathas and hindus the vedas, if u condemn us u condemn them too..

    In a democratic country u still r bound by judicial laws and taxes and other stuff... similar is ours, only we don't find that u may do anything even when considered harmful to society

    to my knowledge for more than a thousand years its been the other way around the east thriving with culture and people of all sects and beleifs were welcome to join the built of civilization and science and technology and the west was sunken in poverty and civil wars and illness... until the crusades came and things started changing. your scientists were our students...

    for your information a muslim is bound to pay 20% more taxes than does a non muslim in islamic caliphate, but just to answer ur stupid claim, economy was built by the silk road trade wich made all asia rich due to economic cooperation between China India and Persia, not to mention the huge fertile valleys of Iraq Egypt and the Indus, the middle east is not a total desert, oh.... yes, and the loging in lebanon and syria...... (this list won't end)

    Malaysia hasn't the oil u imagine, the qajars and safavids were thriving rich empires before oil discovery in Iran, Turkey was rich before the establishments of perminent colonies of Europe in the Americas and the route around Africa was used to reach India.... but it seems ur ignorance with history is growing still!

    And south America is in poverty, similarly India and south east asia and Nepal and other places, r they all muslim..... it seems we have more numbers than i imagined!

    Name one that wasn't defencive not offensive...... I dare u! Oh... but to u we should let the freedom to die on hands of others without protecting ourselves, if that's tyranny than count me in. And yes, Allah is greater than ur Abu-Ghraib Democracy!

    Oh... and this way in defence isn't a muslim (yet we r proud to be doing) way only, acts against Israel and the Western invaders in the middle East are done by christians (syrian nationalists), jews (middle eastern), communinsts (arabs and south american), athiests (they were amongst the first to, the late lebanese George Hawi was the first to declare armed resistance against Israel) and even japanese and south americans along with muslim..... it is something we hold dear how all these people join for a one cause no matter what their racial and religious background is... irrespective of somes stupid critisism!

    Answer me this why r still the communities of monothiest churches exist in the middle east, if we were so violent shouldn't they've been dead long time ago? it was us who sheltered them from their fellow malkite christians. The only massacres we've done r those between ourselves in our stupid civil wars.

    And no, we r not peaceful with those who claim to be peaceful and then decide to invade us!
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  7. Yazdajerd Behold... The Bringer of Light Registered Senior Member

    Also hindus and budhists and samarians of the jewish communities, r they cults too??

    Thanks for the compliment.

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  8. duendy Registered Senior Member

    YES. those two are conforming to te current trend which is. 'let's scapegoat Muslims, and then we can feel all righteous and smug'....sameold fukin game. shit

    they harp on abot how free WE are? HAH. this is while their freedoms are disappearing as they spak. but ohhh no, to dense to realize it. so manipulated by the propaganda machine they are as blind as bats
    we aint FREE fools. and if you hae forgotten. the 9/11 7/7 were INSIDE JOBS. you wont accpet this. cause you cannot see a bigger picture. you are dupes for te State. their henchmen spreadin their evil

    i am not saying i love Islam. yeah of course, fundamentalism is a bad thing. but you aren't concentrating on fundamentalism are you? you are demonizing ALL people who are Muslims aren't you. or have i got that wrong? please tell me?

    and what aboutfunamentalist Christians, and fundamentalist Empire builders like Bush nd co and Blair nd CO, who have caused so much blood and grief and hate and prejudice and pollution and evil, its unimaginable..... are they your good guys/ spill---here's the place
  9. vincent Sir Vincent, knighted by HM Registered Senior Member

    A cult is something that controls your entire life, right down to the clothes you wear, you will find most muslims conform to religous wear, as we have seen all over europe they will demonstrate for the right to wear there cult symbols, to the point of being fined.

    hindus and budhists and samarians of the jewish communities, r they cults too??

    No they are not there minds can not be manipulated to blow themselves up, the simple reason being there religon does not have that strong of a hold over them, they have free thoughts.
    In islam there is no free thought, if you dare to speak against islam, as in salman rusdies case, a million dollar bounty is put on your head.....
  10. vincent Sir Vincent, knighted by HM Registered Senior Member


    I am not demonizing all muslims, what i am saying is take the cult out of this religon, let them develop, free of mind control, let them have free speach to criticise islam, let them have freedoms to choose there own religon, as we do in the rest of the world.

    They need to modernise there religon, take out these all day call to prayers in the middle east, if people want to visit mosque let them choose, lets not have megaphone speakers all over there cities telling them at 4 or 6am its time to go to the mosque to prayer, what are they drones.

    I have been to egypt i have heard & seen all these loudspeakers placed through out the country, if i stayed there long enough i too would put my arms out in front of me & say i will obey & happily go off to the mosque.

    Duendy you must have seen muslims praying in mosques, do you consider it normal practice for everyone to move & chant as one, & to bob up and down like a chicken eating corn in unison.

    I have nothing against muslims, i hate mind control, & muslims are being manipulated by there religon.

    Do you deny there must be at least over a 100,000 muslims worlwide willing to be a suicide bomber, to you consider this normal, i do not, events happening in iraq or palestine has fuck all to do with muslims in europe or america.

    The reason muslims in the US or EU get mad about events in iraq or palestine is because, they all feel as one, you only have that effect in a cult, only cult members feel as one.
  11. vincent Sir Vincent, knighted by HM Registered Senior Member

    The following is a description of what cult is: **

    1. A cult is a religious group with extreme beliefs and practices - beliefs that are often contrary to science and logic but they are believed as "obvious" truth by the cult members.*
    2. The members of cults often isolate themselves from friends, family and society and use deceptive and unethical recruiting techniques
    3. Use manipulative methods to control the minds of followers
    4. Venerate a human leader or leaders
    5. Recruiting work is performed by all of the members
    6. People are not allowed to criticize the leader, the doctrine, or the organization, or read information that is critical of the cult.
    7. Members are trained to reject and disbelieve criticism of the cult as lies from Satan.
    8. Members spy on one another and report improper activities or comments to leaders.
    9. Members are taught to suppress anything which might reflect negatively to outsiders about the cult.
    10. The doctrine is absolutist and the ideology is internalized as "the Truth."
    11. Members are told to avoid contact with ex-members or critics, even their relatives.
    12. Members are instilled with a deep fear about ever leaving the organization, and anyone who does depart is of the devil and sometimes severely punished.
    13. Members are emotional controlled and warned of being caught and punished.
    14. Disciplinary action is administered by group leaders, which may involve excommunication for such things as questioning organization policy or doctrine.
    15. People are encouraged to sacrifice education, career and family interests to server the interests of the cult.
    16. Advocate socializing only with other members in the organization and avoiding outsiders.

    3. Use manipulative methods to control the minds of followers

    Suicide bombers classic case

    12. Members are instilled with a deep fear about ever leaving the organization, and anyone who does depart is of the devil and sometimes severely punished.

    In muslim countries as shown in malaysia this year, dozens of muslims attacked a teapot cult because muslims were joining in there hundreds..

    6. People are not allowed to criticize the leader, the doctrine, or the organization, or read information that is critical of the cult.

    As shown with the one or 2 muslims that have spoke against islam this century, a bounty goes on there head, for daring to be critical of islam....
  12. RoyLennigan Registered Senior Member

    nuns all wear the same catholic clothes are they part of a cult? buddhist monks have been known to light themselves on fire in protests in india, are they part of a cult?
  13. vincent Sir Vincent, knighted by HM Registered Senior Member

    by Patricia Pearson ("USA Today," (Editorial) November 5, 2001)

    At the Pentagon memorial service last month, President Bush called the al-Qa'eda network "a cult of evil," and for the first time, I thought: "Yes, that sounds right." It is a kind of cult, and Osama bin Laden - far from being the Muslim world's Che Guevara, is its evil and manipulative guru.

    Curious about the cult analogy, I called Steve Hassan, formerly a high-ranking member of the Unification Church, also known as the "Moonies," and now a leading expert on mind control. We talked about the fact that many of these hijackers were reportedly leading a normal life when, after coming into contact with certain Islamic groups - on a university campus in Hamburg, Germany, for

    Hassan observes that many of the techniques that he encountered with the Moonies are evident in bin Laden's camps: "social isolation, controlling their sleep, showing them non-stop videos of Muslims dying, being buddied up, so that they're never alone. ... Destructive mind control strips away their ability to think for themselves."
    The cult framework goes a little way to explaining the dissonance between who these hijackers were and what they eventually did on behalf of al-Qa'eda.
    My sense of this was confirmed by John R. Hall, the co-author of Apocalypse Observed: Religious Movements and Violence in North America, Europe and Japan.

    "The other kind of apocalyptic group," he says, "is the warring sect. It seeks to bring on the final battle of Armageddon by launching a holy war against the existing social order. Osama bin Laden's al-Qa'eda is definitely of the latter type; indeed, it is a classic case."
    Many pundits are saying that the eradication of bin Laden will be fruitless unless certain "underlying causes" in the friction between East and West are addressed. But that presumes a rational stance in modern terrorism, and there is none.
    America needs to get across to the Muslim world this absolutely essential fact: Bin Laden is not championing their cause or proposing to lead them to a better future. He wants to destroy the world, and that can be no sane man's cause.


    In finsbury park mosque in the uk muslims were shown video's for hours of muslims being murdered, i am not niave to think this is not the only mosque in europe showing video's of muslim deaths, it is just one of the few caught out.

    As you see from above even george bush has called bin ladens followers part of a cult, but just how far does that cult spread in muslim society, if the cartoon demonstrations are anything to go by very deep indeed.
  14. vincent Sir Vincent, knighted by HM Registered Senior Member


    Nuns, priests, monks make up a tiny proportion of our population, what maybe 1 out of 30,000 people in the uk is a priest, get real here.

    In the case of muslims hundreds of millions of them conform to religous wear, there is a big difference.....

    "buddhist monks have been known to light themselves on fire in protests in india?"

    Have they been known to strap dynamite to themselves & blow themselves up in cafe's, trains, or do they crash planes into buildings..

    I am talking about a mind being controlled to kill others, not yourself, we are all capable of killing ourselves we dont need help for that...
  15. GeoffP Caput gerat lupinum Valued Senior Member

    What, they all used to do this? How would there be any daughters left to be step mothers? LOL. I think you're confusing the actions of a few pre-islamic arab extremists with an entire religion. Don't paint all pre-islamic pagan arabs with the same brush. Paganism is about peace - peace with each other and peace with the gods. One must ask why such sacrifices were made and understand the context in which they were offered. The people thought that the gods were angry, you see. It was a different time.

    ...does the contextual plea above look familiar?

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    The only religion to enforce law? I beg your pardon?

    This is the exact nature of suicide bombing. How can you condemn something with one breath and support it in the next?

    But in none of those other religions can you be legally killed for leaving them. You might well quote Deuteronomy back at me, but I don't expect you could find anyone being executed in Western society for converting or becoming secular. The same is of course not true for islamic nations. Can islam undergo a Reformation or not?

    Islamic society, however, places many more limitations on the rights of non-muslims. This in particular is what concerns me.

    Interesting claim. Why has the teacher not learned from himself, then? Let's not forget the climate differences between the ME and Europe. I don't imagine I'd get sick much in Florida.

    This is not correct. The jizya associated with dhimmitude (the oppression or suppression of non-muslims in islamic regimes) ranged up to double those taxes paid by muslims (zakaat). In fact, in many cases in the Caliphate, zakaat was optional rather than obligatory. The collection of jizya was also intended to be "humiliating" and in some places in North Africa (and Turkey, I think) those paying jizya were smacked on the head after payment with a stick to reinforce the perception of subjugation. This is in line with the Quranic command to make the infidels (Jews, Christians, etc) "feel themselves subdued" (Sura 9:29) and "pay the jizya with both hands" etc.

    So the murder of poetesses and the beheading of male captives is "defense"?
    Mohammed needed somehow to attack other villages?

    If that's islam, count me out.

    And are the rights of religious minorities equal to those of muslims in islam? May their churches be built as tall as or taller than mosques? May they repair churches (let alone synagogues) without the permission of the islamic authority? May muslims convert to other religions? Not fifty years ago, there was a sizeable proportion of Christians in many ME states - tell me, where did they go?

    Neither are the Christians, really. The difference is that they don't burn down the embassies of islamic nations for the kind of bigoted vitriol that mosques churn out all over the ME, nor does their religion support such. "Turn the other cheek" is their rule, as I recall.

    Unfortunately, that wasn't Mohammed's take on things.

  16. nikita Registered Member

    in dar ul harb anyone who is not islamic and does not covert should be killed.
    killing is justified in the Quran.

    by suggesting that there are 50 sects and pluralism in Islam is also incorrect.
  17. DiamondHearts Registered Senior Member

    So it's wrong to stand up for our rights? Isn't that the right of Muslims to wear religious clothes? Why should that be bad? That is the right of Muslims to practice their religion.

    I can remember something racist you wrote about Pakistanis when you said 't is easier to draw water from a rock than you get money from a paki.' Paki is an offensive racist slur against Pakistanis used by the British.

    This confirms my suspicion that most of the people who are bashing Islam are doing this because they are racists. People should argue with Islam on an intellectual basis without having to resort to insults, racial slurs, and threats of violence.
  18. DiamondHearts Registered Senior Member

    Such a belief does not exist in Muslims. You are using deciet and lies to portray your point of views. Killing is only justified if there has been unjustice commited. Not all Muslims are exactly the same. Most Muslims accept other views and are open. There is pluralism in Islam on many matters. People, if you don't know what you are talking about, don't write it.
  19. spidergoat Liddle' Dick Tater Valued Senior Member

    In theory, Islam is no worse than any other religion, but in practice, the unquestioning submission and fundamentalism allows them to be exploited by fanatics with power, not their best interests, at heart.
    HOw do you explain the Sunni/Shiite split, and all the violence that it generates?
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2006
  20. Kunax Sciforums:Reality not required Registered Senior Member

    Sunni/Shiite -catolic/protostans maybe the only different is time
  21. AmishRakeFight Remember, remember. Registered Senior Member

    Sure, it's fine for a group of people that want to wear the same thing to wear the same thing. But when there are leaders telling the followers what to where, why to wear it, how to wear it, who should wear it, and forget being taken seriously in the Islamic community if you don't wear it, then that's where the problem arises. Do you think all these people decided one day that they all <i>want</i> to wear the exact same thing, without guidance and someone telling them to? That's absurd.

    And calling somebody a Paki is similar to calling someone an Texan or an Irish. It's simply a shortened colloquialism (sp?) of Pakistani.

    And last time I checked, the rest of the world stood in stunned perplexity as the Muslim world put a $1,000,000 bounty on the head of the cartoonist. And blew themselves up at markets and other gathering places. And hijacked planes. That takes it even farther than your statement of "threats of violence"; they're USING violence as a political tool.


    P.S. Nice avatar, SpiderGoat

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  22. duendy Registered Senior Member

    Vincent, i cxompletely am with you regarding understanding how religious beliefs divide. and how Islam is particularly still in that religious mode which once was the Western mode. agreed

    but hate aimed at tem and propaganda will only make things wose. cause you have o also wonder where yourself is at. what cult is YOU with?

    Do you rgard yourself as in a free culture?? i dont, and manyothers dont

    i have grounds to believe that tis country you feel so superior about had its hand right in excacerabting this propaganda against Islam through staged atrcities against its 'own' people, and then waging illegal war on Iraq killing thousands of innocent poeople, children, and using illegal radioactive tipped weaponry that causes gennocide, ecocide

    that to me that soundspretty fukin heavy. and THIS is the free saving the UNfree?

    i wholly agree with you that for NOW the beginning is for tose in Islam to also quesll the fundamentalist element. but you see how can what West has done encourage that??!!! know abou the 'sanctions' dealt to Iraq by UK and USA, don't you. where thousands of children, babies etc died? ....then tey are zapped. melted, poisoned byt the same eveil bastards who did that. and all with the message' we are helping you'...wouldn't YOU be angry. demented??
    you ot to look at the whole pisture. as painful as it may be to not be able to point finger and seem the goody
  23. Hercules Rockefeller Beatings will continue until morale improves. Moderator

    Bullshit religious propaganda from first to last. Grow a brain.

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