Humour

Discussion in 'Science & Society' started by Benson, Jul 23, 2019.

  1. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    iceaura, you are having what is popularly called a public meltdown.

    I wouldn't care except for some bizarre reason I was the catalyst - i.e. triggered it without participating in it. Stop addressing me with your wildly off-topic segues into American politics.
     
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  3. Truck Captain Stumpy The Right Honourable Reverend Truck Captain Valued Senior Member

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    just to add the relationship this meltdown and targeting has to the OP:
    it may well be that these types of displays are the reason so many people think scientists don't have a sense of humour - the propensity of overthinking something while forgetting the scientific principles.
     
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  5. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    Iceaura isn't a "scientist".
     
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  7. Truck Captain Stumpy The Right Honourable Reverend Truck Captain Valued Senior Member

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    I'm not claiming ice is.
    look how many people send articles from babylon bee and the onion to be fact-checked at snopes and other places.
     
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  8. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,994
    Which I am managing to have without the least irrationality, incoherence, or other sign of losing it. I haven't been all that uncivil - certainly not in comparison. I even posted a joke for all those who share Truck Captain Stumpy's sense of humor to enjoy.
    Or to translate without the touchy innuendo typical of the thin-skinned: Not seeing a reason to hold anything in contempt, as long as it claims to be humor in a humor thread (we are apparently supposed to pretend the OP doesn't really exist).
    You lose. The post was made with careful attention to its truth value, and from an informed position (you do know the difference between falsehood and bullshit ? )


    The contrast with those who are not having a meltdown, but instead posting the stuff we see here from a position of of their best sanity and sober thought and self-oblivious satisfaction, is a bit suggestive - don't you think?

    Or to bring the thread relevant posting around: under what circumstances do you think a predicted barrage of these ,
    appearing on cue and without apparent self-awareness in this as well as a dozen other threads,

    becomes identified - in defiance of sense - with maturity and good sense and the robust ability to make and take jokes,

    while "scientists" (as a rule decent and honest informed people, as well as amiable and funny if you know them) become identified with a lack of humor?
     
  9. Truck Captain Stumpy The Right Honourable Reverend Truck Captain Valued Senior Member

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    and yet, I am still laughing
    well, hell! That means I now have to give up my values based on liberty, consent of the governed, and equality before the law, since I'm obviously a bad Liberal and STEM graduate ... so, honest question: does this mean I have to give up my research too since you're obviously the "reality based community (the "left", "liberal", or "scientific", factions)" of informed higher educated Liberal here?
    I never said they weren't decent, honest, uninformed or lacking in humour.
    LOL
     
  10. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,994
    You gave them up long ago - if you ever had them, a presumption which would require evidence sufficient to overwhelm that of your posting here.
    If you want to check (unlikely, but I am duty bound to acknowledge the possibility) you might begin your investigation into whether you ever had any such values by reviewing your thoughts on the consent of those governed who aren't you and your kind.
    Nobody said you did. (re the ever-informative "here be humor" tag of the wingnut poster: if you want you can just assume the "lol" on my end, pretty much continuously in these threads - whether you see any humor or not.)

    Although I did hint that you guys appear to be touchy and thin-skinned on this humor issue, based on your oddly and disproportionately elaborate defensiveness in these posts, so thanks for contributing.
    (Not that I really needed any more evidence. You don't really need to describe the workings of personal attack from an empty bothsides presumption to people who have been subjected to the last three decades of Republican media feeds)

    But that suggests a line of inquiry, relevant to the thread OP: there seems to be a connection between the sense of humor displayed by the self-described humor-possessing crowd and their inability to read posts with comprehension, follow simple arguments, avoid the more idiotic of the false equivalences peddled by Republican media pros, etc.

    Since we already have the standard irony deafness operating, the standard blind spots where the meanings of terms and constructions that depend on direction and inversion of implication would normally appear (such as "ad hominem", or "if/then"), and the popup labels scattershot from misapplied introspection ("hate" and so forth) in this crowd, we have some basis for reasoning -

    it's possible this initially worthless joke of a thread could get somewhere, and actually shed a little light on why the humor that saturates the conversation and media participation of scientific types is imperceptible to Benson and his faction - the self described independent whose every joke of their own is planted in a raised frame bed of utter bullshit composted in public for a generation now.
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2019
  11. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,994
    To set up a couple of OP derived questions, for example:
    1)Why does that poster think he triggered my posting here?
    2)Why does he assume that I am addressing him, personally, when quoting a post of his for setting a reply to an issue it raises?
    3) And why does that poster think directly relevant American politics is off topic, given the long familiar and long political role of the OP and similar memes, including their recent and current amplification in Republican political media campaigns?
    - - - -
    Notice that the dishonesty and bad faith grounding that predicted (by me, above) resort to exchange of one line innuendo (and the rest of their degradation in this thread) is shared, presumptively - it's part of the basic frame within which they communicate, throughout this thread and this forum. It's automatic, presented without a hint of self awareness or intention, regardless of context, regardless of relevance, even (here in this thread) presumed the basis of a robust sense of humor itself.

    It's not, notice, that they are making sense, or even trying to. That would be spoiling a "humor" thread, see. The three posts (sampled from the predicted litany of one line innuendo here) freely and deliberately contradict each other and themselves, are enjoyed for that feature. The common ground is not in reason or reality, humorless or humorous. It's in a shared body of lies, deceptions of self and others, presented with their best effort at cleverness of innuendo - like the Pocahontas whoops, the California abuse jokes, the "liberal media" references, the barrage of "scientist" takedowns and insults, the America-inundating sewer of what has been described by lefties as "the quotidian argot of their wretched lives".

    4) So: How did those two come to be able to assume that displayed common framework of shit-for-brains presumption?

    And so forth. Four for starters. Melted down from the OP, mind.
     
  12. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    18,935
    Because posts 38 and 40 were
    1] directly replying to me, quoting me, and addressing my issue of not getting the joke
    2] the point - and not before - where it took the turn towards political opining and dragging in larger political issues

    You didn't merely quote me, your response directly addressed me in second-person:
    That's not an "assumption"; that's how communication works. Own your words.

    Because that's your beef, you're dragging here from somewhere else.


    Don't be obtuse. It's silly that this needs explaining. Now let's move on.
     
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  13. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    It's not silly that it needs explaining. It's funny and this is the humor thread. Even though unintended, the Ice meltdown is funny.
     
  14. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,994
    The one line innuendo.
    Eventually, they all devolve to that. It saves them accountability for what would otherwise be unmissable dishonesty.
    The larger political issues were in the OP - the "turn" was the standard bullying take a joke bs from the people dodging accountability by claiming this was a "humor thread" - i.e. a thread for posting jokes.

    It didn't start that way. It started with a familiar media feed from the larger political world of Republican science denigration, and no jokes at all.
    Iirc one of my replies to your posting addressed the author of the post, as a form or template for reply to the issue raised - which was not personal to you.
    Is that what you are talking about?
    Typo?
    That would be post 14, not 40, if you are assigning the "turn" to me rather than the OP or the author of post 5.
    (It wasn't a "turn", of course - it was the thread topic, right from the OP and page one.)
    My mood did turn midway, if that's the all important focus of your thinking - that happened after my initial good humor and playful mood had stretched to post 32, where it hit the last straw joke.
    I looked that one up, despite knowing better. No point. Communication does not work, with you guys. You aren't honest enough, you don't pay attention, and your frame excludes most of my posting content anyway. Repetition for the benefit of others is the best I can do.
    I dragged it in from the OP of the thread and its first solid appearance in a response ( post 5) - starting in my initial post here, 14.
    Oh, I'm not being obtuse. Good thing, too - because this "explanation" schtick I mocked when Seattle came up with it is not going to go well for any of you. Using "explanation" for personal attack takes a certain sophistication, and playing the just joking playground card early on undermines the pretense.

    Even in some pretending 'it's just a joke' thread. The real ones look like this: http://www.sciforums.com/threads/jokes-and-funny-stories-ii.140862/page-127
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2019
  15. Truck Captain Stumpy The Right Honourable Reverend Truck Captain Valued Senior Member

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    too right! LMFAO

    Humour has such a broad range of definitions, from medical to comedic. Almost everyone has a sense of humour. A good question to ask is why people think scientists don't.

    In my experiences and observations, people with higher education tend to have more information to draw upon to see that ludicrous or absurdly incongruous or punny moment, so their range is typically broader as they are able to enjoy humour that less educated people wouldn't even understand. Some of the jokes about Heisenberg are a great example.

    I liked this part of the wiki article on humour
    I think there should be additional clarification for the wiki article, however. Some people, needing to have attention, needing to feel accepted by a sub-group or seeking control get thin-skinned either for themselves, for someone else or because it is an effective and now acceptible way to garner attention. (there are obviously other reasons)

    the internet also trains people in the art of trolling, teaching how to bait others into the rabbit hole. Some of these people posture as representatives of the woke culture for what they perceive to be justifiable reasons, but that isn't always the case. Here is a great video on that by former POTUS Obama


    Personally, I think the behaviour that some of the woke culture display are akin to the posturing by a Banty Rooster: they can be hilarious to watch.

    Another personal observation: the more politically active a person is, the less inclined they are to publicly display a sense of humour.
     
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  16. Seattle Valued Senior Member

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    The inept poster frequently lumps the rest of the world together by over-using "they". No need to have to respond to a post (since "they" can't), just dismiss every comment as "Republican talking points" even if that person isn't a Republican, doesn't watch TV and potentially isn't even from the U.S.

    A melt-down is a terrible (and funny) thing to watch. The humorless melt down quicker than those possessing humor it seems.
     
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  17. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    OK, well maybe stop quoting me and addressing me. I interpret being quoted and addressed as if it's intended for me. I'm quirky like that.
     
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  18. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Interesting. I have a very public sense of humour, and am mostly apolitical (though as I get older, I find a much blurrier line between politics and just living - i.e. whether one gets to breathe air or drink clean water requires one to vote carefully.)
     
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  19. Truck Captain Stumpy The Right Honourable Reverend Truck Captain Valued Senior Member

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    I hate politicians and I have a truly broad and f*cked up sense of humour... but then again, I had an interesting life and did things that most only dream of doing.


    mulled this over a bit and I agree, though I don't know if it's a byproduct of ageing or because I really would like my descendents to have somewhere to live in the future that has the freedom to enjoy it. I would truly hate for them to have to live in squalor while a dictator reigns with an iron grip.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2019
  20. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,994
    The "rest of the world" is not "they" in any of my posts, of course.
    That's something a competent reader in good faith would pick up easily, in part because they would not have confused their little troop with the rest of the world.

    Identifying the US Republican media feed assumptions, assertions, and viewpoints with some kind of common reality as shared by the general public, the rest of the world, real America, etc, is a familiar Republican Party propaganda meme, a basic framing assertion and assumption of that specific propaganda feed, its parrots, and almost nobody else.

    And it's the basis of their shared sense of humor - as immortalized in the chuckle bucket of yet another very large and bankrupt utility company with Republican protection cheating and abusing (even killing) Californians. (W and Enron, anyone?)
    Not "every comment" - just the ones familiar from hate radio and Fox and Republican politicians and the rotating stable of wingnut punditry and the other long familiar parrot cages, and without other plausible origin (common error, common vocabulary, common viewpoint and emphasis, etc).
    Like media accounts of Kim Jong Il's awesomeness at everything, that stuff has only one basic source.

    Or do I have to dumb that down a bit more, to match the explanation templates provided by the bandarlog here?
    That would rest on your ability to identify comparative political activity and the presence of a sense of humor in those not sharing your own. As you are here incapable of recognizing Republican talking points, the political activity of posters you don't know, or the humor of posting that is not framed as yours is, there is doubt on that score.

    In my neck of the woods, liberals and lefties who are most politically active tend to display humor to a fault - they go shallow for cheap laughs, they offend, their mouths routinely get them into trouble. Conservatives and righties somewhat the opposite - the more politically engaged, the more solemn, dull, angry. That's reflected in the politicians on stage - compare Al Franken, Jesse Ventura, and Tom Emmer. But I think that may be a regional feature - in the honor culture regions of the US, for example, no such pattern is visible at my distance.
    Or maybe just shrug off the noise, and deal with the issues as if adults were involved somewhere in the mix. That's less trouble.

    Meanwhile, the first and most obvious guess at why so many victims of Republican media operations think scientists have no sense of humor (and they are the only ones who do) would be the standard anti-intellectual bias of that faction. Not having a sense of humor is widely seen as a character flaw or incapability, and the Republican base routinely assigns character flaws and incapabilities to liberal intellectual elites. Scientists, being for the most part liberals, are bad drivers and equipment operators, too. And they are poor shots, inept fishermen, etc.

    But this is also true of poets, writers, artists, historians, all manner of liberal arts employers. Why does the recent Republican propaganda effort focus on denigrating scientists?

    Because such reality based intellectuals threaten the corporate profits from damaging resource exploitation. They threaten taxes, and regulations, and government curbs on the making of money. Poets do not.
     
  21. DaveC426913 Valued Senior Member

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    Done.
     
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  22. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    30,994
    First, an admission: I committed a Poe's Law illustration, in post 56, as demonstrated for me in posts 58 and 60.
    Sorry about that. I was lulled by the illusion of playfulness and good humor - forgot the audience here.

    But then, it did smoke 'em out a bit more, gave them more rope to hang there agenda on - which maybe helps the more naive bystanders.

    Because 56 did set a couple of things in front, relevant to the OP, starting with the timeline of the wingnut "explanation" schtick that has dominated their posting here:
    That's a quote and a link to the only post in this thread in which I "explain" a "joke" (intending mockery and parody - oops). It appears after, not before, the first couple of the many posts from Seattle, TCS, and their bandarlog, which assume that I had posted some kind of "explanation" of a joke here in the course of "melting down".

    It's a direct and fairly detailed (i.e. obvious) imitation of a post in which one of the multiple members of that tribe who - unlike me - did in fact post a lame explanation of a joke, posted a lame explanation of a joke;

    thereby entirely missing not only the OP and thread topic but the contents of my posting to that point (Consideration of the context in which anyone would find the "joke" in 33 funny - coffee-spitting hilarious, we read - assumes getting the joke in the first place);

    bringing up the eternal question that hovers over their posting - here, there, pretty much everywhere if they're given enough rope - and may even shed light on their opinions of scientists and their sense of humor:

    Are they lying, or are they stupid?
     
  23. Truck Captain Stumpy The Right Honourable Reverend Truck Captain Valued Senior Member

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    you went apeshit over the joke, so I'm calling bullshit on this.

    the rest of that post is your baiting with an attempt to justify your outrage and an explanation of your intentional baiting and trolling because you lack a sense of humour

    Done.
    enjoy lying to yourself!

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