i am not losing weight

Discussion in 'Health & Fitness' started by Skyler45, Apr 9, 2010.

  1. PieAreSquared Woo is resistant to reason Registered Senior Member


    You might get a kick out of this but I had a wonderful chat with Mrs. Raw Food
    Shirley Potasz..http://www.balanceyourday.com/
    Absolutely charming lady .... not sure of her age. I know she's up there but she looked great
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  3. Skeptical Registered Senior Member


    This is a science forum. You should not be referencing quacks.
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  5. PieAreSquared Woo is resistant to reason Registered Senior Member


    Thanks for the tip

    Please Register or Log in to view the hidden image!

    But in all fairness to the raw food lady, who I have a 5 hour talk with. She is no quack and has had much more experience in the field than I'm sure you have.

    As I pointed out to LORI, see looked great and I'm pretty sure she is 80+
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  7. Lori_7 Go to church? I am the church! Registered Senior Member

    wow, she does look good.

    i googled up some info about digestion...


    also, what is primarily important in digestion (as the raw food lady's website explains) are enzymes, and enzymes are found in raw foods. and while cooking food does make it easier to digest, paradoxically it also destroys the enzymes which are required for digestion, and cooking food also destroys much of the nutrient value in food as well.

    i mean, i'm suggesting a diet of fresh fruits and vegetables, nuts, seeds, and sprouts. none of these things are going to hurt anyone. lol...
  8. Skeptical Registered Senior Member


    May I suggest you use a little science? After all, this is a science forum.

    Enzymes found in food are not used for digestion. The enzymes you use to digest food are secreted by your own body. Amylase in saliva digests starch. Proteases from the pancreas digest protein etc. Enzymes do exist in food, but they are irrelevent in relation to digesting said food.

    As I said before, do not patronise quack web sites if you want to find out what is genuinely true.

    Nutrition is not difficult in its basics, but has been hijacked by all kinds of nutters. If you cruise the internet looking for information on nutrition, you will encounter masses of misinformation. Beware.
  9. PieAreSquared Woo is resistant to reason Registered Senior Member

    or you run into people by random chance and see the results before your very own eyes

  10. Lori_7 Go to church? I am the church! Registered Senior Member





    Last edited: May 17, 2010
  11. Skeptical Registered Senior Member

    I made the observation some years ago, that in your average book shop, the section with the largest percentage of total bullsh!t is the section labelled "New Age". However, the second worst is the section labelled "Health".

    The internet is even worse. If you search for health information, or diet information on the internet, the probability that the site you refer to is 100% woo is extremely high. The only way to avoid that is to restrict yourself to web sites by universities, reputable research institutes, reputable medical journals, and government departments. Anything else is highly suspect to say the least!

    I took the time to look at Lori's sites, and they are garbage. Sorry, but that is simple truth. When Lori gets her information from a reputable site such as the American Medical Assn., or similar, I will respect it.

    Her sites talk of enzymes in food. Sure, food comes from living things and contains enzymes. However, to take the next step and say those enzymes are needed for digestion is total rubbish. The human body is adapted to digesting its own food, and makes all the enzymes it needs for that job, bearing in mind that we are also adapted to cooking certain foods to make the job easier.

    The easiest foods to digest are those that have been thoroughly cooked. Those are also the foods with the smallest amount of natural enzyme. Our own gut can cope perfectly well with cooked food, and without the natural enzymes.

    I am a fan of certain foods raw. Fresh fruit and certain vegetables (carrots, lettuce, cole slaw) are excellent eaten raw and contribute valuable nutrients. But we are not adapted to eating raw cereals, root vegetables, or meat.

    My final message is simply to be highly skeptical of nutrition web sites other than the ones I listed. Keep clear of the nutters, and stick to good science.
  12. Lori_7 Go to church? I am the church! Registered Senior Member


    according to the ama's own mission statement, promoting health through nutrition would be a conflict of interest.
  13. Skeptical Registered Senior Member


    Even if you do not like the American Medical Association, there are heaps of reputable sites. There is no need to look at the web sites run by those who believe in non scientific procedures.

    Try something like http://win.niddk.nih.gov/publications/better_health.htm

    Anyone who promotes 'fad' eating, such as all vegan, or all organic, or all raw, or similar is probably a food quack.
  14. Lori_7 Go to church? I am the church! Registered Senior Member

    I actually wouldn't suggest an all anything diet. I tend to be somewhat obsessive so I actually attempted an all organic raw vegan diet for a while and realized I was stressing myself out trying to be healthy, which is counter productive.
  15. Skeptical Registered Senior Member


    That is sensible. Avoiding stress is smart.

    The basic rules of nutrition and healthy eating are simple.

    There is a list of what to do, and a list of what not to do. This is pretty well discussed in the NIH reference I gave.

    The "do's" are mostly about variety and balance - getting a range of different foods.

    The "don't's" are mostly about avoiding too much of a list of 'bad' foods, such as saturated fat, salt, sugar, and starchy foods with no dietary fibre. Eat these in smaller amounts.

    When a person gives advice that strays into other areas, such as only eating organic, or avoiding dairy foods, then their ideas are to be avoided. Normal, healthy people can eat a wide range of foods, and be healthy, if they follow the few good rules.
  16. Fraggle Rocker Staff Member

    One of the most prominent differences between Homo sapiens and our predecessor species is our complete adaptation to a predatory, carnivorous diet. We do not have the long intestinal tract of the other Great Apes, with their symbiotic bacterial culture, that allows them to digest modest quantities of raw cellulose. Much less the anatomy-dominating four-chambered stomach that allows cattle to subsist entirely on raw cellulose. We are "built," as it were, to eat meat. The only reason we eventually became able to extract the protein and calories from leaves, roots and grains is that our distant ancestors managed to tame fire and our more recent ancestors invented food processors. Cooking cellulose breaks down the cell walls, as does grinding it into dust.

    So vegans, who insist that they have adopted a "natural" diet, have in fact made themselves totally dependent on the fairly recent--and most horribly unnatural!--technologies of fire and electricity.

    Oh, did I forget to mention that gorillas and chimpanzees eat a lot of bugs, as well as small, raw vertebrates? They are not efficient herbivores, so they need to augment their diet with protein.
    There's nothing ostensibly wrong with organic agriculture... to support a world population of perhaps five hundred million people. If the back-to-nature advocates are willing to live up to their creed, they're going to have to enter a lottery in which six out of every seven of them will be put to death in order to free up the space for organic agriculture. Otherwise, welcome to "Better Living Through Chemistry," the slogan of the 1950s.
    See my above explanation of why it's impossible for our metabolism to extract the nutrients from raw cellulose. That makes virtually all plant tissue useless to us except fruit, which is designed by nature to be attractive to animals, so we'll spread the seeds around in our stool.

    Raw meat, on the other hand, is fine, if you can keep it clean without using antibiotics that destroy the pathetic little bacterial culture our abridged intestines manage to maintain. But somehow I don't think the raw food crowd is talking about raw meat. When they say "back to nature" they haven't got a clue as to the true "nature" of human digestion!

    Our poor Paleolithic ancestors had to make do with raw meat because it was the only thing on the menu. Remember that their flint blades were no match for our modern dining utensils so they were gnawing on slabs of raw meat, and you'll understand why it's estimated that getting a day's ration of nutrients out of raw meat required them to spend three hours every day in the activity of eating.
    At the very least, their claims of "natural" are blatantly fraudulent. Human "nature" requires meat and/or cooked plant tissue.
  17. Skeptical Registered Senior Member


    I agree with almost all your post, which seems to be very sound information. Your ideas on evolution are probably pretty close to the mark.

    I am not too sure of the 'eating raw meat' part, though. I suspect that our paleolithic ancestors cooked it. I mean, have you tried eating a raw steak? Even with a sharp steak knife? Raw meat certainly takes more energy to digest and our paleolithic ancestors probably cooked most meat.
  18. coolplay Registered Member

    I had a very active professionnal activity for about 15 years, and the weight was not a big concern for me due to that.

    I had to quit my job and start working from home and of course I was not so active anymore and I start to eat more often and naturaly gain some wait and fat !

    After approximatly 2 years did pick up more than 20 pounds !!!
    Disgusted about myself I tried firt to qui smoking and got 7 pounds more after 6 months.
    (everything in the belly of course)
    probably that the combination of the above was not a good idea.

    After a couple of months of depression, I decided to follow a program that I did found on linkxoo.com/health-fitness/diets-weight-loss/lose-abdominal-fat and I am very pleased with it.

    Besides that, I also quit some very bad eating habits and reduced my alcohol consumption (who was not that hight anyway ... but just to put all chances on m side. .. sometimes a little beer or a glass of wine but that's far it.

    Today I am very happy as I lost more than the half of what I got by changing my activity and this after a couple of months only.

    I of course feel much healthier, I do more sports, and drink a lot of water.
    I definitly can say that everything is going fine now, I eat normaly but in raisonnable quantity and I am not using pills.

    Let's see how far all this will bring me reducing my belly fat but for now I certainly cannot complain.
  19. coolplay Registered Member

  20. sly1 Heartless Registered Senior Member

    Guess i'll spew out some common health fitness rhetoric with some of my own additions.

    you want to try and eat every 2 hours or so. Depending on your exercise routine and daily routine the times are actually very crucial.

    Yes breakfast is THE most important meal than any other meal you can possibly eat during your day. It does exactly what it says. Breaks your Fast, which is what you are doing when you sleep for 6-8 hours a night.

    If you like carbohydrates breakfast is the time to eat them. Include protein in some form for every meal of the day.

    Before bed a small cup of yogurt or cottage cheese helps keep your body from going into fasting mode. Why? Those dairy products contain a protein called Casein which is a slower digesting protein that reduces the amount of time your body thinks it is "without food". The less amount of time you are in fasting the better. When your body is in fasting mode you produce a certain horomone that triggers fat storage. Its your bodies way of saying ok I need to hold onto this because I dont know when im going to get nutrients again.

    Exercise is obviously important for multiple reasons. Try and find your fat burning Target Heart Rate which is roughly 60-65% of your Max Heart Rate which is roughly 220-Age...your MHR is not exact but it is close enough to get within a decent THR.

    When doing any kind of exercise that increases your heart rate typically you will not start burning fat stores until about 20 minutes of sustained THR. Why? Typically you body has enough quick energy to avoid burning fat.

    Oddly enough your body doesn't like to burn fat...you can compare it to the US unwillingness to use oil reserves instead of raising gas prices or in your case weight to a point of rediculousness. In your bodies opinion fat to a certain degree is good it means on starvation island you will last the longest. Unless everyone turns to canibals then you are screwed lol...


    Most people immediately think of running to get their heart rate up to desired levels however almost any kind of physical work will get your HR up. You can superset a weight lifting routine and keep your HR up to your target heart rate for probably an hour in essence killing two birds with one stone.

    Hope some of this helps! GL and the key to health and fitness is consistancy...it is a forever life style change not a stop and start process you do when its time to get into a swim suit!
  21. Skeptical Registered Senior Member

    Unfortunately, Sly, you are reporting on a whole lot of stuff that is widely believed, but for which there does not appear to be any backing from research results.

    For example : Why is breakfast the most important meal of the day? I have heard this all my life, and I keep looking for research work to support it. So far without result. I suspect this is an urban myth. Something that has been repeated so often that everyone believes it without evidence.

    I have read several research reports on weight loss attempts. The most glaring discovery is simply that long term weight loss is not normally the result. The vast majority of people who lose weight put it all back, and often a lot more, within 5 years. This is the reason I advise people not to attempt to lose weight. Instead, make the attempt to improve health. Good food and good exercise.

    Do not try to eat less. Satisfy your appetite without being a glutton. Find some form of exercise you can keep up for life. No good exercising in a gym, for example, for a month or two and then stopping because you can no longer be bothered. Even walking is excellent. If you do not have the patience to do gym exercise, try walking to work a few days each week. Don't get over-ambitious with your exercise program. You have to keep it up for the rest of your life.

    Weight loss diets? A lot work in theory, including high fibre diets, and high protein diets. In practise, the victims of those diets simply put back all their lost weight, and often a lot extra, over time.

    If you are morbidly obese, then consider surgery. This still remains the only proven long term solution for morbidly obese people. If the financial cost is too high, then consider travelling to India or Thailand. Both countries have excellent doctors and clinics, as witnessed by the number of such doctors who are accepted as US citizens!

    Extreme exercise works, but very few people can keep it up long term.

    I am trying to be realistic here. Please do not go by perceived wisdom without experimental evidence. At the end of the day, for most people, it does not pay to attempt to lose weight. However, a program to improve health can pay major dividends.
  22. sly1 Heartless Registered Senior Member

    I just know what I have learned and experienced from my college education and experience in the health and fitness for the past 9 years of my life.

    What I expressed has worked with noticeable and measureable results in my own personal fitness/diet routine that I have been maintaining for the last 9 years of my life.

    You could be right there might not be alot of research to convience skeptical people of the claims but that doesn't mean there is no truth to the ideas behind why they would work.
  23. Captain Kremmen All aboard, me Hearties! Valued Senior Member

    Overweight people should never listen to the advice of thin people.
    They don't know what they are talking about.

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