Is consciousness to be found in quantum processes in microtubules?

Discussion in 'Pseudoscience' started by Write4U, Sep 8, 2018.

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  1. river

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    Does not the Brain at some point control the extent of the nervous system ?
     
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  3. river

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  5. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    I am no expert, but apparently high pressure in the eye does somehow damage the microtubules in the optic nerve and which are instrumental in processing optical information.

    Distortion of Axonal Cytoskeleton: An Early Sign of Glaucomatous Damage

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3109006/
     
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  7. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    To the best of my knowledge, no...., the brain depends on a healthy neural network.
    Much like a computer is dependent on the wired network that moves the information to and from the central processor, the MTs inside the neural network are chemical constructs (tubular processors) and can undergo "catastrophic disintegration".
     
  8. river

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    Consciousness is in every physical , material object(s) . Not with intellect , necessarily ; but with the fundamental goal of survival . Which takes the evolution of the intellect .
     
  9. river

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    Or is the brain stretching out into its environment ?
     
  10. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    This is a profound question.

    I like to think that in non-sentient objects, response to external pressure it is more of a gross mathematical/physical process of cause and effect such as the formation of molecules from individual atoms or purely mathematical physical response to say collisions, but in organic objects this response system is often dependent on evolved
    sensory information facilitated by Microtubules.

    Take a paramecium, a single celled organism. It has cilia, little hairs attached to microtubules and a flagella, a tiny little motor driven by a microtubule which propels the paramecium.

    When the paramecium bumps into an object, the cilia get disturbed by the kinetic force and force the paramecium to change course. Think of a Roomba vacuum cleaner. Still purely mechanically responsive, but showing signs of a proto sensory ability.

    Now the organism acquires a photosensitive chemical patch purely by accident and over time establishes a conduit to the cellular microtubules, which are responsible for motion. Now the organism "learns" to respond to light and dark conditions and begins to be able to avoid obstacles without bumping into them. As the light sensitive patch evolves (by natural selection) into an eye and the neural connections with microtubules becomes more sophisticated the organisms develops a neural network (often associated with the cytoskeleton) and a few billion years later we have an octopus, a descendant of sea slugs, which has remarkable sensory abilities in near total darkness, with 8 small brains located in its tentacles, as well as a central brain which is capable of very sophisticated calculations.

    One of the remarkable land organisms is the Slime mold a compound single celled organism, which forms a type of proto hive-mind, similar to the insect hive mind but still more primitive. This organism is capable of solving mazes and has a rudimentary sense of time, the beginning of a circadian rhythm, which regulates certain behaviors.

    Next come the insects, which over time acquired very sophisticated hive minds and behaviors, millions of years before the mammals appeared on the scene.

    Remember, most land animals have much better sensory equipment than humans. The human advantage is we have evolved a giant brain which allows for much greater and sophisticated information processing.

    And there you have the evolution of sensory intellect in general and human intellect as the pinnacle of ability for information processing ability and purposefully (motivated) acting on that process.

    This a very crude nut-shell narrative, but I'm confident that evolution of intellect followed a similar path as I inadequately described. IMO, the conceptual logic is sound.
     
  11. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    THE HUMAN MEMORY
    BRAIN NEURONS & SYNAPSES
    September 27, 2019

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    https://human-memory.net/brain-neurons-synapses/
     
  12. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    continuing...
    https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/03/120309103701.htm
     
  13. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Quantum Physics in Consciousness Studies
    Re: ORCH OR
    https://www.academia.edu/28151558/Quantum_Physics_in_Consciousness_Studies
     
  14. Michael 345 New year. PRESENT is 72 years oldl Valued Senior Member

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    I don't care where consciousness is found

    As long as it keeps doing this

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    Pinterest

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    Write4U and exchemist like this.
  15. exchemist Valued Senior Member

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    Tnahks ofr shit!

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  16. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Continuing describing the role of microtubules in the origin of motility in living organisms .
     
  17. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    A perfect example of what Anil Seth described as an example of heuristic "best guessing" by the brain and it's ability to make sense of seemingly random sensory perceptions.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heuristic
     
  18. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    One fact pertinent to mitochondria;
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4801864/
     
  19. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Re chloroplast;
    https://web.wpi.edu/Pubs/E-project/...163018/unrestricted/MQP_Paper_Final_AK_VW.pdf
     
  20. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Continuing .....

     
  21. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    Cytoskeletal Signaling: Is Memory Encoded in Microtubule Lattices by CaMKII Phosphorylation?

    Introduction

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    Conclusion
    https://journals.plos.org/ploscompbiol/article?id=10.1371/journal.pcbi.1002421
     
    Last edited: Mar 30, 2020
  22. Write4U Valued Senior Member

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    == Is each neuron a quantum computer? ==

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    The recent discovery of quantum vibrations in microtubules inside brain neurons appears to corroborate claims that consciousness derives from deeper-level, finer-scale activities inside brain neurons.
    The eminent mathematical physicist Sir Roger Penrose in the 1990s suggested that quantum vibrational computations in microtubules were “orchestrated” (“Orch”) by synaptic inputs and memory stored in microtubules. They may be the seat of stored information that neurons (and glia exchanges) intermediate.
    Moreover, in a new development it is thought that Microtubule quantum vibrations (e.g. in the megahertz frequency range) appear to interfere and produce much slower EEG “beat frequencies.”
    In Consciousness in the universe: A review of the 'Orch OR' theory, Penrose and Hameroff suggest, “Consciousness depends on anharmonic vibrations of microtubules inside neurons, similar to certain kinds of Indian music, but unlike Western music, which is harmonic."

    How cool and weird! Only I am less interested in the mystical implications about roots of consciousness than whether this nails in "intracellular computing" as a major part of brain function.

    http://davidbrin.blogspot.com/2014/02/the-latest-on-time-travel-ironic-title.html
     
  23. river

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    Intracellular thinking . Life thinks .
     
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