Discussion in 'Parapsychology' started by entelecheia, Sep 7, 2012.
share no some aspects in common with praying?
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The law of attraction (popularised in The Secret) is complete bunk.
Oh yeah!, its author is millonaire! help me to invent another Bunk to be the next, oh yeah
Why is legal to publish millonarian Bunks? It doesnt deforest & pollutes our planet? I'm a writer, The most silly my book is more probabilities to become millonaire?
Please Help me with your silliest ideas, i wanna be MILLONAREM!
There are tons of ways to cheat people out of money. The best way is to play on the fears and confusion of the elderly and steal their life savings. The only down side is you have to live with yourself afterwords.
One idea: You could write a trashy novel (or three) like Fifty Shades of Grey.
There are plenty of ways you can make a load of money from rubbish.
I can't believe the level of interest and hype that went on in the media about this book.
Out of curiousity my missus went out and bought a copy. She said it was absolute trash - cheap one line porn - not even well written or saucy.
Go figure what grabs the public mind these days.
What about all the garbage reality TV on at the moment here in Aus ? I've never seen anythin like it, and there's so much of it.
I will speak FOR the law of attraction now.
Yes it is a religion. Instead of asking "God" for items, the law of attraction deals with affirming,visualizing,imagining, or asking the "universe/all that is" for something.
The difference is it is a more scientific approach to religion. I know that doesn't make sense to many, yet it is more along the approach that "Thoughts are real", or "Thoughts become things" so people think that sending out a certain thought will attract more of that thought.
For those unfamiliar with the law of attraction...
The law of attraction basically states you attract what you think about. If you mainly worry about Bills, then you will attract more Bills ( in theory). So ideally; the best thought to express is gratitude, as this will allegedly draw more things in your life to be thankful for.
Back to religion....
If we looked at the teachings of Jesus Christ, what were they?
a) ask and you shall receive.
b) the meek shall inherit the earth.
c) Man is created in gods image (we are all creators)
d) Knock, and it shall be opened up to you.
e) Reap what you sow.
f) If you had faith as small as a mustard seed, you could say to this mountain to move from here to there and it would move.
g) Go thy way; and as thou hast believed, so be it done unto thee.
h) Take heed what ye hear: with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you: and unto you that hear shall more be given: for he that hath, to him shall be given: and he that hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he hath
i) Be not afraid, only believe. Fear not: believe only, and she shall be made whole. According to your faith be it unto you.
j) All these evil things come from within.
k) believe, all things are possible to him that believeth.
and many more.
Forms of Christianity are among the most popular religions in the world, yet the precepts are the same as "The Law of Attraction". These religions have lasted thousands of years.
Now another form of incredibly popular religions is
In Buddhism, it is also commonly stated that “your thoughts matter”.
"All that we are arises with our thoughts" is a Buddhist precept.
So now we have 2 religions preaching "Law of Attraction".
Now let's look at Hindu and Greek religions. Both of these religions have multiple Deities. If you are in need of healing you would pray to Asclepius (Greek god of healing), or Sri Dhanvantar (Hindu god of health care). In these religions you specify your desires by your choice of whom to worship on particular visits to the temples. Does this theme sound familiar to "The law of Attraction".
The Prophet Muhammad continually reminded his followers to be ever grateful to their Lord, and the term shakir, meaning “one who is grateful,” is often used in Islam as a name of great honor among Muslims.
Remember that gratefulness/thankfulness is the number one thing to think upon in "Law of Attraction" as it allegedly brings more things to be thankful for.
Witchcraft is almost pure law of attraction. You focus on goals and you put emotion into it. A typical spell might be to draw a thinner version of yourself on a current picture with magic marker and put it on your fridge.
NOTE: The Catholic church has destroyed much of the Pagan religions. The methods used by Nostradamus for predicting were hidden and likely lost/burned during the Inquisitions that made anything non-catholic a deadly crime. As we know the riches of Egypt fell to Rome rule, and the combined riches of Egypt and Rome fell to the Catholic Church. In truth, the Catholic Church defrauded Rome of its lands and properties.
Biggest Hoax in history..... (It donated the wealth of Egypt and Rome to the church).
It is a shame the loss of books related to "mind power" that were suppressed and destroyed by the Catholic rule (not to mention their killing of millions of innocents).
It would be nice to look around the cellars of the Vatican and see what they truly own.
Back to witchcraft and law of attraction.
Almost everyone in the world practices "Law of Attraction"/Witchcraft.
Have you ever lit a candle and thought upon a wish?
Perhaps while people sang "Happy Birthday" in the background. Yes. That is a pagan ritual that occurs in the homes of many religions.
Have you ever made a Sacrifice while holding a goal in your thoughts?
Perhaps at "ye old wishing well".
Okay. Up to now I have only shown that there is common ground between all religions and "Law of Attraction". These religions compromise five billion people and skeptics compromise approximately one billion (I believe more, but based on stats).
There is a ratio of 5:1 who believe in "Law of Attraction" over skeptics if I include the various religions.
Now I will express opinion...
Law of attraction works amazingly well. I was astounded many times by the way it works as if by "magic".
My grandfather always preached it before it was called "Law of Attraction. He never made more than $7/hr his entire life but retired a millionaire. He claimed he never wanted to be rich and only wanted security for his family. He says he spent 15 minutes per day visualizing his family having everything they needed. He even went so far as to purchase a chicken farm so his family would always have meat and eggs, however the farm was condemned upon pre-purchase inspection and the deal never happened.
My father is a skeptic, however once visualized a certain company making him a job offer and it worked. He does not mind telling that story.
Now I expect most here to guffaw, and say "Horsepuckey", but that is your loss not mine. This does work.
I have used this most of my life.
I have used it on Exams "I will ace this Exam" repeated for almost as many hours as studied on some of them.
I used it to meet people.
Once I affirmed daily that I would like to meet a pretty girl my age that was wild enough to have sex in the middle of city hall. I was young then, and thought this would attract some fun girls into my life. After a few weeks i started dating a pretty girl. I soon learned that she worked in an art gallery. The art gallery turned out to be located in the middle of city hall. nudge, wink.
I repeat that story despite its sexual nature and how it must portray my younger self (I was around 20) because it shows how absurdly this "Law of Attraction works".
One time I had been living off my savings and fading fast. I knew I needed quick help from the "universe/god/all that is". I wrote down everything I wanted from pillowcases to new dishwasher to luxury car. I then put this long list in order that I wanted them. I repeated this list over and over again for hours at a time. I think i affirmed for 5 hours a day for a week. Sometimes I would just repeat the word "wealth". A Union job was posted in the newspaper. If anyone here has ever been in a Union then you know Union jobs are NEVER put in the newspaper, but they needed a special skill set that was not among their normal choices. I accepted the position for $28.60/hr. It was night shift so I received a $4/hr shift premium and made over $32.60/hr. If I worked on a Saturday or Sunday (10 hour shifts), I would get double (2 X $32.60 = $65.20/hr) pay, and made over $1 a minute. I was 30 years old at this time.
The law of attraction works with everything, and seems to work in funny ways.
Imagine from now on that there is no such thing as coincidences. In the world of "Law of Attraction" we call them Syncs.
Perhaps you were discussing Dolphins in Tuna nets with a co-worker during your lunch break. That night you get home and you end up watching a movie where there is a fishing boat catching dolphins by accident. That is a tiny example of how thoughts can affect minor things. You had no idea the movie would deal with that topic?
Now this is where science and law of attraction don't mesh. If things can seemingly co-ordinate to come when you dwell upon the thoughts then time itself does not make sense. How can a movie be scheduled (by the universe)months/weeks in advance that deals with the subject you were just discussing. It is not realistic/possible.
The only way it could be possible would be if
a) Thoughts could travel back in time.
b) Only the present is real. The future and past can BOTH be altered.
This is the only way "The Law of attraction" can work and so can never be compatible with the science of today.
If you wish to attempt using the "Law of attraction" then there are experiments you can do.
Try to attract something you likely would not see. A rat, a blue feather, Santa in June.
Do affirmations that are as if you already have the item.
"I see many rats"
"I have a blue feather"
If you say "I will get a blue feather" this is very wrong. It always implies in the future, and the future will always be in the future.
This is pseudoscience so as such it is fair game for ridicule, but it does work miracles. If you want to learn more try
(I have old version of this movie with Hicks on my Sony walkman)
(or any youtube video by hicks will make you think)
I will advise against taking any courses. Any halfwit can bundle together the precepts and sell them to you, but all the information is available.
If only you follow certain adages such as "don't cry over spilled milk" or as Norman Vincent Peale rephrased it, "Don't worry about anything you cannot do anything about", then I think your life would improve.
I already know this is a topic not welcome on a science forum, so if you want to comment just to say "phooey" it is not unexpected, so save your time and go to another thread.
Daily affirmations is a very effective way to bring about a desire. Repeat a short phrase repeatedly for 15 minutes in the morning and at night. Visualization is also touted as very effective, but my best results have come from affirming daily. Maybe just repeat the word "wealth" if you want wealth, or repeat "I am pure" (from ancient Egypt)" for health. Many great free websites on affirmations.
I say it works without fail, and works well. Many say it doesn't. Every religion in the world is on my side.
A lengthy and interesting response, kwhilborn.
I ascribe to no religion yet I contemplate that the universe consists of energy in motion and we are all a part of that energy and motion.
Coincidence or synchronicity abounds in my life and I just accept that some things are very interesting indeed. :shrug:
Regarding the law of attraction and the use of deliberate visualisations etc have you ever thought of the difference between what a person may want as distinct from what a person may need?
I coined this poem as a response to people seeking advice on the process of invoking the laws of attraction years ago..
"Blessed be thou deserved be
Ask only for what thy deserved be
and blessed be thy shall deserved be..."
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We so often forget that humility is required in the asking for anything from any one or thing.
"A guy gets down on his knees and begs the universe for a Rolls Royce.
He goes to bed only to wake up suddenly in the middle of the night to the screeching of car brakes and the sound of a car bulldozing it's way into his bedroom.
The car happens to be a Rolls Royce."
So he had asked for something he didn't deserve.
and if he works on himself, maybe one day he will deserve it....
and essentially due to the "attraction paradox" ...there is no "free ride".
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I think a Rolls Royce is a valid goal. I do not think humility is required for LOA. I think it is important to Intend a goal and believe, but deserving and undeserving are just creations in your own mind. I disagree.
well by all means ask the universe to bow to your request....
I am a retired former Engineer at the age of 45 with 3 strong and healthy attractive kids. I am content with my current Cherokee, however the Cadillac crossovers are more my style. It's coming. As nice as a Rolls Royce may be in some cultures. My culture deals with snow and anything not 4 wheel drive is second rate here.
If you believe LOA requires humility then it will for you. The dictionary defines humility as "the quality of having a low view of one's importance, a lowliness of mind, or a sense of one's own unworthiness through imperfection and sinfulness". Synonyms for the word humble include docile, fearful, lowly, withdrawn, poor, base, inferior, insignificant, trivial and even miserable. The etymology of humility is the Latin humilitatem, which means lowness or insignificance. Even more interesting is that the word "humiliate" has its origin in the word humility. Surely this begs the question, if humility is really such a virtue, why then do we not seek to be humiliated? The answer is simple, humility is not a virtue.
I was raised to believe that praying for oneself was wrong and selfish. I think this is what you meant. I now realize that asking for what you want is part of the plan.
"Ask, and ye shall receive".
Oprah Winfrey says - "You really can change your own reality based on the way that you think."
Look at this video. She does seem to use prayer methods comparable to your views.
She believes in the Law of Attraction, and had drawn a movie role into her life through concentration, and becomes attuned to guidance and becomes meek. I can see where your ideas have merit if you say humility is the same as the submissive meekness she shows when she is rewarded with the movie role. However this same lady went on to earn 3 Billion dollars since then, and can afford many Rolls Royce. I think there is a difference in definitions.
I also know that many use the law of attraction without humility or meekness just fine.
Will Smith - "The idea is that you have command over what your future, what your situation is. That you internally and with your spirit or however you want to put it, the Tao or Muslim Allah or Jesus - whatever that universal force is that you connect to - you, in sync with that force, have command to will your future".
Jim Carey - wrote a check to himself, in the amount of 10 million dollars for "acting services rendered". He postdated the check for 1995 and carried it in his wallet. Carrey also visualized himself cashing the check and what he would buy with it. By the time 1995 rolled around, Jim Carrey was indeed wealthy enough to cash the check (according to the book Jim Carrey by Amy Stone, he never cashed it; Carrey instead put the check in his father's coat pocket after he passed away, as a symbol of his father's dreams and support for his son's success).
There are millions of incredible true stories about this, and I have dozens of amazing true stories myself, but it is important to remember that if you believe it requires humility then for you it will. You have created that reality.
You can use this for daily living. Expecting a parking space at the local mall is using the Law of Attraction, but does the driver need to use humility. I think it is a great downfall of the christian religions that they use guilt so often. "Jesus died for you, now give us $20". The religion makes people ashamed to be prosperous. Maybe that is why the Jewish faith was able to accumulate so much wealth.
I think we are all here as a fragment of "all that is" to create experiences and events that we would like and to realize our spiritual side. I do not think someone will be cast out because they did not ask with enough humility. If the Law of Attraction does exist then one explanation is we are all a part of god "created in gods image" with our own creative abilities. Our thoughts are real. Our dreams sprout Universes. If we are a part of god then we should not believe ourselves to be humble, docile, fearful, lowly, withdrawn, poor, base, inferior, insignificant, trivial and even miserable as humility suggests.
It is Intention, belief, and gratitude that are key.
To even think for one second that you must be deserving is wrong. Even entertaining that thought for a second will draw punishment towards you. Know that you are worthy and deserving at all times.
@ Quantum Quack,
Your poem seems very "Christian" to me. I dislike the term deserved. Creating is not about deserving at all. I could write books on this subject of equal or better quality than many people have already published. I am very experienced and well read on this topic.
There is nothing wrong with asking for what you like. I believe it is the purpose of this power.
Possibly you could look at the story about the Rolls and consider the driver [is he deceased or just injured] his family [does he have wife, kids, pet dog] and who else is loosing out due to your success. [ car finance, mortgage, house insurance, ]
If you believe that the universe is a closed system then who is paying for your lifestyle if you haven't worked to deserve it?
I am interested in your response.
re: Oprah....note the song that changed her life "I surrender all, I surrender all" then she gets her movie deal....deserved be.. and she deserved it...The Color Purple is one of my fav's as well.
see this note about Oprah:
you have used her as an example inappropriately...you wish to understand humility...watch this video
you obviously have not experienced what is like to be a victim of someones elses inappropriate use of prayer LOA..maybe one day you will be...and understand that poem you are so quick to dismiss.
Do you believe Will Smith or Jim Carrey don't deserve their fortune?
The thing you may have misread or don't understand is it is not what you think about yourself that matters when you ask the universe to help in some way. It is what the universe "thinks" that does matter. Hence asking only for what the universe [God] thinks you deserve is an action of surrender and humility.
Okay. I am done with the lengthy posts. You need to look elsewhere for answers if you don't understand. The law of attraction is based on our thoughts creating reality. If this is true then you are not "stealing" anyones Rolls Royce, but if everyone knew how to use this perfectly, and the entire world wanted Rolls Royce's then there would be no lack. This obviously would seem absurd, but if everyone was a conscious creator this world would be much different.
I gave the Oprah argument to show I understood where you were coming from, but Humility is NOT a requirement unless you believe it is. We can go back and forth on this for the next 100 posts, but it won't change the fact that stating it so will only make it true for you.
Deserving and Humility are unrelated to the Law of Attraction. They sound like Christian ideals actually. You are creating. It matters what YOU think. The Universe is just a compilation of millions of fragments of yous. You have more influence over your own life, as you care more and think more of yourself even if only in reflex. Basically i am stating the Universe is not going to dwell upon what you deserve or not, it is up to you.
Normally you are correct I guess but if one is practicing the LOA in the occult or in a way that is similar to spell-casting or destineering then it is very relevant.
It is not question of whether the quester is deserving or not in their own eyes it is whether that which thay are begging of does.
Humility [ humbleness] and gratitude and deservedness are only attitudes that if genuine can make the LOA work remarkably well. But they need to be genuine attitudes and not simply contrived ones.
It has nothing to do with Christain ideals but more to do with universal "occult law" so to speak. Made even more relevant to those who have signifciant knowledge of "occult type" practice and are taking the role of suplicant. [beggar-quester- seeker- asker]
Witchcraft is actually a good way to look at this. In advanced Witchcraft (Magick) books that have become popular it is important to direct emotional energies towards thoughts fabrication into reality. A spell might need to be cast outdoors while naked because you would have strong fears of being caught etc, that would be the excitement put forth into the spell. Mr. Crowley went so far as to engage in sexual relations with men and women during rituals. The idea was to channel sexual energies into the goals, and visuaizing the outcome of the goals was necessary during orgasm. This is common witchcraft type beliefs (research Magick,Crowley).
These witches claim to have achieved many manifestations using these methods which are far from humility. If anything Aleister Crowley was the exact opposite of humility. He was an evil man. "wickedest man alive" according to the press.
I believe he did achieve results using his methods, and yet he is FAR from deserving, and certainly without humility. I still see the Oprah type christian humility working, but I do not view it as necessary. In AA (alcoholics Anonymous) they allegedly ask members to surrender themselves to god. This is also along those lines.
How you believe it works is how it will work for you.
I see your point. I have given examples of mine. It's a minor issue .
Thanks to the skeptics for letting us hash this out without the normal thread bashing.
As I outlined in my lengthy first post here Law of Attraction IS a religion. This should be in the religion thread if you ask me, but I also think this will eventually be explained by science, but not for another 100-1000 years, so maybe t's fine where it is? IDK.
I have seen the Law of Attraction work in very weird and spectacular ways. I know many skeptics just guffaw at this, but this is another instance where an hour affirming each day for a month may allow you to create a miracle in your life. You can prove this to yourself (or not, no loss to me).
Yes I have had the uhm duty, of being a guest a number of so called Pagan parties [ wiccan with serious Goth overtones ] as part of my quest to understand the why and how they attempted to manipulate their social environments.
I have spent numerous occassions trying to unravel the intense suffering that some practicioners of wicca managed to get themselves into using "desire projection" techniques. So please understand why I have been so strong on my recommendation of proper grounding of the emotional being so that the negative impact is minimised.
Yes it is true that in the main the power to spellcast/destineer is derived from the Sacral Chakra, the energy being highly/hyper erotic and incredibly addictive. Power addiction is a huge issue and one society does quite well at protecting itself against by endlessly frustrating the practicioner with psychic fraud and deceptions. A sort of pychological game of "hop scotch" diversion and frustration is normally the outcome. Primarilly due to improper application of a gift they may have applied with out the necessary humility, altruism, service to others etc. that "attracts" positive outcomes instead of forcing the world to reject the projecting individual.
Eventually if change does not occur the individual is fully marginalised by society. Some are placed under psychiatric care, some manage to live out of cardboard boxes and so on. [better than being burned at the stake as was the case not so long ago]
I have, unfortunately, seen way too many tragedies associated with this issue. [ which I guess is why mainstream society is reluctant to embrace it from an intuitive/instinctive premise]
a bit like playng with Ouigi Boards and the like...
The only solution I could came up with after years of studying this issue was the poem mentioned earlier because if the spell caster or the desire projecter keeps this "rule" in mind then they are considerably more able to interferre with other peoples lives without serious detriment because people instinctively blame God [quite rightfully] for any negative change instead of the projecting individual.
If you held the emotion of gratefulness/thankfullness about every little blessing in your life you would attract more of the same emotion. If you were to feel humility you might not be projecting a positive emotion.
Deserving is a judgement call. You would need a strong ego to tell yourself you deserved a Rolls Royce, and again I see reflections of the guilt imposed by Christian religions hurting their subjects. They might all feel they deserve Honda Civics.
I think I would be re-writing your poem.
I cannot see any harm in Ouija boards? I have used them and they are a valid tool for seeking answers from your subconscious.
Anybody attending a Pagan Party with serious Goth overtones without the purpose of study is likely damaged goods to begin with. Isn't Goth supposed to be expressive of sadness with emphasis on being a social outcast in many cases. I do not mean to insult Goth's if I am mistaken, but I'm betting there is a higher number of mental health issues there to begin with. I think there is more corrrect energy in any church of any religion, as I feel they are all the same.
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