Jesus will come

Discussion in 'Religion Archives' started by Saint, Dec 14, 2011.

  1. arauca Banned Banned

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    What ever you want to make of the birth .
    The word of God come in flesh, to show us how to live and how to behave . Relating with God and relating human with human.
    If that son of God would not have come , the Israelis would kept the message for them self . So, tank God for Jesus
     
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  3. spidergoat Venued Serial Memberlist Valued Senior Member

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    I only know that there are some teachings attributed to Jesus which he claims came from a God. I don't think there is anything special about the teaching that was unique to the Middle East. Not killing, raping, and stealing are morals common to many cultures around the world.
     
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  5. arauca Banned Banned

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    Are there many teaching from that time were they teach compassion ?
    Yes there are many ancient laws , you can go to Hammurabi and several before him, but teaching compassion and self sacrifice for others. I would like you to mention some teachers .
     
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  7. spidergoat Venued Serial Memberlist Valued Senior Member

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    Chimpanzees, Bonobos.

    Compassion and self-sacrifice (altruism) are traits common to many primates and indeed many mammals.

    Oh wait, I was mistaken, here is an even more primitive example:

    An interesting example of altruism is found in the cellular slime molds, such as Dictyostelium mucoroides. These protists live as individual amoebae until starved, at which point they aggregate and form a multicellular fruiting body in which some cells sacrifice themselves to promote the survival of other cells in the fruiting body.
     
    Last edited: Feb 29, 2012
  8. Robittybob1 Banned Banned

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    Most commentators are looking at the wrong census for they did not appreciate that Jesus was "oldish" (49-50 years old and this was confirmed by Iraneus) when he was crucified.

    Does the Shroud of Turin show a young man or an older man?

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  9. spidergoat Venued Serial Memberlist Valued Senior Member

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    The Shroud of Turin is a proven fraud.
     
  10. arauca Banned Banned

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    Sorry, that tells me about the level of your mind.
     
  11. spidergoat Venued Serial Memberlist Valued Senior Member

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    I suppose you have given away everything you own to the poor, as Jesus instructed?
     
  12. arauca Banned Banned

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    Very good , I noticed you know his teachings. I give my token.
     
  13. Robittybob1 Banned Banned

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    Is it? I have not seen the proof of that yet.

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  14. Robittybob1 Banned Banned

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    I tried that but no one wanted my junk.

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  15. Robittybob1 Banned Banned

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    Keep it fair. Keep it clean. Fight the argument not the man.

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  16. spidergoat Venued Serial Memberlist Valued Senior Member

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    Yeah, you should look into it.

    After years of discussion, the Holy See permitted radiocarbon dating on portions of a swatch taken from a corner of the shroud. Independent tests in 1988 at the University of Oxford, the University of Arizona, and the Swiss Federal Institute of Technology concluded that the shroud material dated to 1260–1390 AD, with 95% confidence.[4] This 13th to 14th century dating matches the first appearance of the shroud in church history.[wiki]​


    This is also about the time when various other religious icons were forged, there was a huge interest in this kind of thing at the time.
     
  17. arauca Banned Banned

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    Tomb exploration reveals first archaeological evidence of Christianity from the time of Jesus

    The archaeological examination by robotic camera of an intact first century tomb in Jerusalem has revealed a set of limestone Jewish ossuaries or "bone boxes" that are engraved with a rare Greek inscription and a unique iconographic image that the scholars involved identify as distinctly Christian.

    The four-line Greek inscription on one ossuary refers to God "raising up" someone and a carved image found on an adjacent ossuary shows what appears to be a large fish with a human stick figure in its mouth, interpreted by the excavation team to be an image evoking the biblical story of Jonah.

    In the earliest gospel materials the "sign of Jonah," as mentioned by Jesus, has been interpreted as a symbol of his resurrection. Jonah images in later "early" Christian art, such as images found in the Roman catacombs, are the most common motif found on tombs as a symbol of Christian resurrection hope. In contrast, the story of Jonah is not depicted in any first century Jewish art and iconographic images on ossuaries are extremely rare, given the prohibition within Judaism of making images of people or animals.

    The tomb in question is dated prior to 70 CE, when ossuary use in Jerusalem ceased due to the Roman destruction of the city. Accordingly, if the markings are Christian as the scholars involved believe, the engravings represent – by several centuries - the earliest archaeological record of Christians ever found. The engravings were most likely made by some of Jesus' earliest followers, within decades of his death. Together, the inscription and the Jonah image testify to early Christian faith in resurrection. The tomb record thus predates the writing of the gospels.

    The findings will be detailed in a preliminary report by James D. Tabor, professor and chair of religious studies at the University of North Carolina at Charlotte, to be published online in www.bibleinterp.com on February 28, 2012.

    "If anyone had claimed to find either a statement about resurrection or a Jonah image in a Jewish tomb of this period I would have said impossible -- until now," Tabor said. "Our team was in a kind of ecstatic disbelief, but the evidence was clearly before our eyes, causing us to revise our prior assumptions."

    http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2012-02/uonc-ter022712.php
     
  18. Robittybob1 Banned Banned

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    But remember my first question regarding this? If it was a forgery were they going to produce the face of a young man or an older man?

    Or was it just coincidental? The image of the face only appeared with modern photographic methods. Did they originally think it held an image?

    So what were they originally forging? Just the cloth or the stains on it?

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  19. Balerion Banned Banned

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    How would Luke's testimony "match" and event for which Luke is the only source? There is no other record of that census, nor was there ever a Roman practice that required citizens to return to the city of their birth. This was merely an invention of the author to place Jesus' birth in the city of King David, and thus fulfill the prophecy.

    Even Mathew contradicts this. So clearly it was not a real event. It was a fabrication.
     
  20. Robittybob1 Banned Banned

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    It was 20 years ago that I studied this thing. When Augustus first become Emperor he ordered a census. I found references to all the events mentioned in the Roman histories, that totally convinced me it was not just a story. You read the stories completely different way once you understand that Jesus was born in 17 BC. Have a go and tell me what the story about getting lost in Jerusalem means with the different birth date?
    I might try and find the book I wrote with all the references (some of them were internet sites but as you know they keep on changing the URLs so I imagine some won't be relevant any more.

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  21. Robittybob1 Banned Banned

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    I see there is a version of the book on this computer, it is 25 pages long and from memory the final version was 35 pages, so it might not be the final version. Can a document that long be put onto the forum?
     
  22. Balerion Banned Banned

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    Augustus never ordered an Empire-wide census, as Luke claims. That simply did not happen, so the author is already guilty of fabrication. Secondly, no Roman census ever required people to return to the place of their birth. For one, it would have been a tremendous clusterfunk, and yet there is no record anywhere of such a enormous undertaking. Secondly, the entire point of the census was to connect people to the land they owned, because land ownership was the basis of the taxation. What purpose would it serve to move people to their birthplace? Third, census-takers are the ones who travel, never the person being counted.

    So chronology is the least of the concerns anyone has with Luke's testimony. It's more a matter of him simply making things up. And as I already said, the motive for this is clear: Jesus needed to be born in Bethlehem to fulfill a prophecy and imply lineage with David. That was Luke's purpose for concocting the census nonsense. It's also why Matthew has a completely different explanation for why Jesus was born there (fleeing Herod, I believe), while the other two gospels make no mention of his nativity, only saying that he's from Nazareth.

    Now, don't mistake this for me saying there was no historical Jesus, because I think Luke's fabrication (and Matthew's as well) indicates that someone of importance was born in Nazareth somewhere around that time. If he were fictional, why not just have him be from Bethlehem? Why the need for subterfuge--and conflicting subterfuge at that? The lie is telling.
     
  23. indianmath Rajesh Bhowmick Registered Senior Member

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    Suppose he comes ;Then what will be the reaction of the western countries then i.e what will be their reactions or what will they do with him?are they prepared for his welcome (especially on the present scenario where the followers of Jesus are following his preachings so well

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    ) What answer the western countries or his maximum followers will give to him when Jesus asks them about Hiroshima & Nagasaki :shrug:
    Suppose I am a 5yr old child & I ask this on behalf of Jesus to his followers.:bawl:
    regards.
     

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