Jupiter's Orbital Velocity & Equatorial Velocity cancel?

Discussion in 'Pseudoscience' started by nebel, Jul 31, 2017.

  1. origin In a democracy you deserve the leaders you elect. Valued Senior Member

    Messages:
    10,894
    You're having quite a conversation with your self. I haven't bothered to read any of.
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2019
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  3. nebel

    Messages:
    1,909
    I am actually not talking to myself, or strictly for myself, but responding to ideas that pop up here and on other sites on the subject.
    Taking a sidereal view, interesting things have to happen, when with these epicycles, cycloids, matter on planets, even moons appear to slow down, come to a halt in "fixed" space and even reverse, appear to retrograde.
    so, while you were a stellar contributor in the past, thank you, please take the sidereal, stellar view once in a while; For the last word might not have been said on this.
     
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  5. nebel

    Messages:
    1,909
    Origin, good and lucid question!
    No, but from that viewpoint only the equator at noon and the Moon Europa, not the whole planet, would be near a standstill or being retrograde, because the Orbital and Rotational velocities are so closely matched but working in opposite directions.
    In these, and Saturn's data, the equation (Vo:Vr) =~ 1 ! , so: the zero velocity zone is near the planet surface. Harder to visualize is

    The Earth to Moon situation where Vo: Vr is a ratio of 64:1, but multiplying that by the Earth radius of 6370 km gets you 407 744 km4 which is near the Moon apogee of 406 700 km, different at different times of course still,
    During an eclipse like 2019, 2024, The Moon is in a zero velocity position. with respect to the Sun/stars. how? as in a cycloid,
    Considering the Earth being the hub, the Moon affixed to the rim, our satellite will be at zero velocity when making contact with the road, the Sun/orbit,ecliptic.
    The only point in the system at rest in such a way.
    again and again.
    NASA and Mr. Bezo's, Blue Horizon promise to have a woman on the Moon by 2024. ,

    Anybody suggesting an experiment to falsify this alternate theory at that occasion?
    while watching the shadow of the Moon moving across North America during that April 8 Lunar night?
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2019
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  7. nebel

    Messages:
    1,909
    Just a note on my monologue here: have brought a NASA proof into this, (I think there is even a relevant partial Dione image moving against the Saturn background.)
    On Saturn, if the Earth Moon would be put there at it's original orbital radius, it would have a orbital velocity that closely matches the orbital velocity of the parent planet Saturn, namely ~ 10 km/sec. see "Doing the Numbers on no.1" below.
     
  8. nebel

    Messages:
    1,909
    I do not understand what you mean, by "meet" -- how? match perhaps?

    Look at the direction of both rotations. As we face the Sun, we move retrograde. the Sun prograde (in a planetary sense we always look at the nightside of the Sun)
    Sun rotation, at Equator, 2 km,/sec. Earth rotation .5 km/sec. Earth orbit around sun 30 km/ sec.
    Where it all meets is in the lunar revolution, 28 days, close to the Suns rotation, ( dealt with in the thread "Doing the Numbers on No 1. )
    You probably will not find a matching number of km/sec. until into the Kuiper belt or Ort cloud. or the outer Moons, Ours is 1 km/sec.
     
  9. nebel

    Messages:
    1,909
    "--An audacious mission circling Jupiter’s poles is probing the planet’s deepest mysteries -"
    New Scientist
    SPACE 22 May 2019
    When I see banded pictures like that, I wonder whether the differences in surface speed in the stellar reference frame have anything to doe with it. The shear that would result from near standstill at the mid day equator to 10 km/s velocity at the poles and double that at midnight.
     
  10. nebel

    Messages:
    1,909
    just a reminder, in the upcoming opposition observations of Jupiter, please note:
    The rotation of the cloud bands at the equator is only 8% slower than the forward movement of the planet. Nearly cancels as the OP states.
    If Europa, or it's shadow) is anywhere near transit, it has the same orbital velocity retrograde view, as Jupiter forward motion (13.7 km/sec.) . almost at standstill at noon with the clouds, the Red Spot. so:
    zero velocity zones in you field of vision.
    Zero velocity zones defining a common field, like all rolling tires in the world touch the earth at zero velocity, thus define the global surface. mostly, kind of.
     
  11. nebel

    Messages:
    1,909
    Earth being in the zero velocity zone of the Moon,
    Equator clouds of Jupiter in zero orbital velocity around the sun
    Europa at perihelion at zero velocity around the sun; as seen Friday to Sunday. great views! so,
    when apparent orbital speed drops to zero, like in the above cases, in the speed formula, what happens to the value for time?
    Does it not touch the fundamental value?
     
  12. nebel

    Messages:
    1,909
    Here is a link that might show that the Uranus system (like Jupiter ans Saturn), where several Zero Velocity Areas are identified, has enhanced heat absorption, in spite of the great distance from the source, the Sun.
    University of California - Berkeley. "Astronomers see 'warm' glow of Uranus's rings: First heat images of the rings enable scientists to determine their temperature." ScienceDaily. ScienceDaily, 20 June 2019. <www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/06/190620153544.htm>
    pease see calculations in the "Harvest machines" Thread in Alternative Theories.
     
  13. nebel

    Messages:
    1,909
    origin, Venus of course is hot as hell, even at night time, a warning for us. but here are the interesting
    Orbital vs rotational velocities of that retrograde neighbour:
    For every km of radius, the Venus rotation adds .ooo 0003 km/sec to each km of radius, extending that line out to the Mercury orbit would add 15 km/sec to Venus' Ov of 35 km/sec. , gives ~50 km/sec, well within the 39-59 km/sec range of Mercury's Ov.
    A vertical stick on Venus would keep pointing at Mercury.

    On the night side, subtracting this ratio from the orbital velocity gives you the Mars aphelion.
    The alternate theory of cancelling rotational and orbit velocity works, at a distance, and even for retrograde orbits. It works, period, cancelling or adding/subtracting!
    There is a kind of tidal lock, synchronous movements between planetary surfaces and orbit velocities. because

    Venus rotates like Mercury moves
    Venus rotates like Mars moves.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2019 at 5:08 AM

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