Mass Casualty Attack on Orlando Gay Bar

Discussion in 'World Events' started by Yazata, Jun 12, 2016.

  1. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    A closet case with a gun.

    Just sayin'.
     
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  3. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    They impose anti-western values on themselves without any reference to colonialism. This isn't our fault.

    He was doing God's will, as expressed in the Bible and the Quran.
     
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  5. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    It could help.
     
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  7. madanthonywayne Morning in America Registered Senior Member

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    I would expect the opposite. Disarming the potential victims simply makes them easier targets. Criminals and terrorists never have trouble aquiring weapons , be they legal or illegal.
     
  8. Yazata Valued Senior Member

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    While everyone's attention was on Orlando, a 25 year old Islamic State sympathizer in France named Larossi Aballa stabbed a French police administrator to death outside his home, then entered the house and cut the policeman's wife's throat in front of their traumatized three year old child who was hiding behind a couch, after which he made and posted a You-tube video of the bloody scene in which he said that he was responding to ISIS leader Abu Bakr Al Baghdadi's call for Muslims to kill infidels inside their homes, with their families. In his video, the killer called for Muslims to turn the Euro 2016 games into a "graveyard". The Islamic State's AMAQ news agency is confirming the killer was one of theirs and is taking 'credit'.

    The killer had a hit-list with lots of names on it. (Police, other officials, journalists, even rappers.) But he seems to have gotten bogged down making his video at his first stop and was killed by French police when they raided the house. French police said the killer was known to them as a jihadist sympathizer (lot of good that did if they didn't stop him) and a roundup of his associates is underway.

    https://www.yahoo.com/news/suspect-...d-sentenced-jihad-links-062555487.html?ref=gs
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2016
  9. billvon Valued Senior Member

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    Right! The problem in this shooting is - not enough guns! If only a drunk club-goer could have pulled out his own AK-47 and started spraying bullets, things would have worked out so much better.
     
  10. C C Consular Corps - "the backbone of diplomacy" Valued Senior Member

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    If not for weak spots like Belgium and Ukraine, extremists would at least have more difficulty acquiring guns and explosives for large scale massacres in Europe. The probability increases of getting noticed and making mistakes when the amount of time and number of hoops to jump through amps up for acquiring assault rifles, bullets, grenades & launchers, electronic detonators, and extracting TNT from whatever stockpile of decommissioned land mines. Since the general European population is happy with their self-defense impotency, anyway, it's rather ludicrous to have that "time and difficulty" obstacle for terrorists undermined by leaky-roof countries who can't get their act together (or are outright unperturbed about serving as a weapons bazaar on the continent).
     
  11. C C Consular Corps - "the backbone of diplomacy" Valued Senior Member

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    The anti-immigration right wing extremists were focusing upon that event as well (Grégoire Moutaux, anyway, before his capture). That would have been a strange convergence of opposing cultural nutcases.
     
  12. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    We need to make an experiment . Let be disarmed and see the results , We know how the society go when society is armed. I live in a suburb I have not sean a cop in my area for more then 4 months , I do not have weapons, In the 26 years I have not closed my house , I don't have a key to lock the house. Thank God.
     
  13. spidergoat pubic diorama Valued Senior Member

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    Why is that?
     
  14. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    Anticorrectness

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    President Barack Obama↱, 14 June 2016:

    And let me make a final point. For a while now, the main contribution of some of my friends on the other side of the aisle have made in the fight against ISIL is to criticize this administration and me for not using the phrase "radical Islam." That's the key, they tell us―we can't beat ISIL unless we call them "radical Islamists." What exactly would using this label accomplish? What exactly would it change? Would it make ISIL less committed to trying to kill Americans? Would it bring in more allies? Is there a military strategy that is served by this? The answer is none of the above. Calling a threat by a different name does not make it go away. This is a political distraction. Since before I was President, I've been clear about how extremist groups have perverted Islam to justify terrorism. As President, I have repeatedly called on our Muslim friends and allies at home and around the world to work with us to reject this twisted interpretation of one of the world's great religions.

    There has not been a moment in my seven and a half years as President where we have not been able to pursue a strategy because we didn't use the label "radical Islam." Not once has an advisor of mine said, man, if we really use that phrase, we're going to turn this whole thing around. Not once. So if someone seriously thinks that we don't know who we're fighting, if there's anyone out there who thinks we're confused about who our enemies are, that would come as a surprise to the thousands of terrorists who we've taken off the battlefield.

    If the implication is that those of us up here and the thousands of people around the country and around the world who are working to defeat ISIL aren't taking the fight seriously, that would come as a surprise to those who have spent these last seven and a half years dismantling al Qaeda in the FATA, for example―including the men and women in uniform who put their lives at risk and the Special Forces that I ordered to get bin Laden and are now on the ground in Iraq and in Syria. They know full well who the enemy is. So do the intelligence and law enforcement officers who spend countless hours disrupting plots and protecting all Americans, including politicians who tweet and appear on cable news shows. They know who the nature of the enemy is.

    So there's no magic to the phrase "radical Islam." It's a political talking point; it's not a strategy. And the reason I am careful about how I describe this threat has nothing to do with political correctness and everything to do with actually defeating extremism. Groups like ISIL and al Qaeda want to make this war a war between Islam and America, or between Islam and the West. They want to claim that they are the true leaders of over a billion Muslims around the world who reject their crazy notions. They want us to validate them by implying that they speak for those billion-plus people; that they speak for Islam. That's their propaganda. That's how they recruit. And if we fall into the trap of painting all Muslims with a broad brush and imply that we are at war with an entire religion―then we're doing the terrorists' work for them.

    Every time we hear our fellow Americans ranting their demands for wicked political (ahem!) correctness about "radical Islam" and "fundamentally incompatible historical traditions", I am only reminded that I already know who the enemy is.

    And it ain't just Daa'ish.
    ____________________

    Notes:

    Obama, Barack. "Remarks by the President After Counter-ISIL Meeting". White House Office of the Press Secretary. 14 June 2016. WhiteHouse.gov. 14 June 2016. http://1.usa.gov/2386dcp
     
  15. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Valued Senior Member

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    Our Turn

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    In truth I'm still not dealing with this well. At least, I don't think I am. Not certain. I knew it was a gay club as soon as I heard the name, and once again my American community lines up to stand with the gay community; it really is something incredible to witness.

    But, you know, it was our turn. Of course it's our turn. It was going to be our turn eventually. And soon it will be someone else's turn. Who's next? Christians at a megachurch? College football fans? Headline concertgoers?

    I suppose I shouldn't be surprised it's the homegrown who are finally hitting the soft targets; it always seemed strange how the internationals kept sending farm league benchwarmers to botch up airplane attacks and the like.

    And then there are the politics: Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX)↱ is on our side, now, or so we are expected to believe but only because he wants us to hate Muslims; Sen. Marco Rubio (R-FL)↱ is most worried about the poor, defenseless guns; Sen. Ron Johnson (R-WI)↱, facing a desperate re-election fight, follows Rubio down that path and then sprints past him in a manner making the difference between an AR-15 and a bomb very, very important; Donald Trump↱, the de facto leader of the Republican Party, reiterates his terrified, xenophobic nationalism; and it turns out thirty-two percent of respondents to the latest Gallup poll on the subject favor requiring Muslims in the U.S. to carry special, mandatory identification.

    That part is a bit depressing. Still, it's better than facing the dead; I can't do that, yet.

    McCool went to Pulse on Saturday night as she often did, with her 21-year-old son, Isaiah Henderson.

    It was a favorite spot for the pair: He's gay, and she still loved to dance — despite having 11 kids and beating cancer twice, Marquez McCool's oldest daughter, Khalisha Pressley, told NBC News.

    At 49, she'd been married a few times, and earlier in her life, she'd moved from New York City to California. In 1985, she met Robert Vince Pressley Sr., who was serving in the Air Force in San Bernardino, and the couple got married and had two children, including Khalisha.

    They only stayed together for four years, but they stayed in touch, talking as recently as last Thursday, Robert told NBC News. "She was a good mother [and] a good provider," he said. "She was always trying to help people, taking people in who had no place to live."

    Marquez McCool eventually ended up single and living in Florida with six of her children, the youngest of whom was 12, Khalisha said.

    "She was always really cool, but really a mom at the end of the day," she said — "the sweetest lovingest person in the world."

    Early Sunday morning, Henderson dialed Khalisha immediately after the shooting. He was screaming, she said.

    He survived, but his mother did not.

    "He had to watch his mother die," she recalled. "He saw everybody getting killed."

    Khalisha added: "He feels it was his fault."


    (NBC News↱)

    Nor can I face the living.

    The gay community, as Rachel Maddow↱ reminds, is forged in fire. And today we are the symbol; who will it be tomorrow?

    Nobody made excuses. Nobody called it an accident.

    Our American community stands watch; thank you.

    Columbia! raise Thy Lamp like morning new; blind Ma'at tests Her Scales and sharpens Her blade; Thy sister, too, hears the mourning wail.

    The American community stands watch; let this be our American Way.
    ____________________

    Notes:

    Benen, Steve. "After massacre, Trump speech takes 2016 race in a scary direction". msnbc. 14 June 2016. msnbc.com. 14 June 2016. http://on.msnbc.com/21jQBB7

    —————. "Cruz sees Orlando massacre as possible wedge issue". msnbc. 13 June 2016. msnbc.com. 14 June 2016. http://on.msnbc.com/25T6qFt

    —————. "How Marco Rubio hopes to avoid a debate over guns". msnbc. 13 June 2016. msnbc.com. 14 June 2016. http://on.msnbc.com/25Tc3n3

    —————. "Poll: One-in-three Americans support special ID cards for Muslims". msnbc. 14 June 2016. msnbc.com. 14 June 2016. http://on.msnbc.com/21kbSKW

    —————. "Senator draws a curious connection between assault rifles, bombs". msnbc. 14 June 2016. msnbc.com. 14 June 2016. http://on.msnbc.com/25UZCaz

    Fieldstadt, Elisha, Tim Stelloh and Corky Siemzsko. "Orlando Massacre: What We Know About the Victims". NBC News. 14 June 2016. NBCNews.com. 14 June 2016. http://nbcnews.to/236wSq7

    Maddow, Rachel. "Gay community 'forged in fire'". The Rachel Maddow Show. 13 June 2016. msnbc.com. 14 June 2016. http://on.msnbc.com/236keat
     
  16. cosmictraveler Be kind to yourself always. Valued Senior Member

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    My deepest sympathies go out to the families , friends and loved ones of the Orlando carnage of all those who were killed . I join with all those who are saddened by this shocking event that took the lives of so many of the young adults and adults of Orlando. So much lost of life for no other reason then hate and terror brought on by one man it makes me want to hope that the people everywhere can try and work through this tragic rampage and bond together to try and help each other to overcome what has happened and let love overcome .

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  17. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

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    Exactly. So, the thing to do is get more of these assault rifles on the street, see? Perhaps we could arrange a fundraiser in the next few days and give away a couple of AR-15s as door prizes. Yeah, I think that would be appropriate...

    Oh, wait! The Republicans beat me to it - they always steal my best ideas:

    One day after the worst mass shooting in American history, Tennessee State Rep. Andy Holt (R) said he plans to give away two AR-15 assault rifles — the same kind of weapon used in the massacre — as a “door prize” at an upcoming political fundraiser.
    ...
    “After all, it was a bullet that stopped the terrorist. Amazing how so many seem to miss that fact.”
    ...
    “I want you to arm yourselves and learn to shoot with deadly accuracy should the need arise,” he wrote. “Protect your family. Protect yourselves. Protect your friends. Our government has made it quite clear that it is incapable of doing so. At the end of the day, it’s your responsibility anyways.”
    Now who said the right wingers are obstructionist do-nothings with no affirmative plans on how to combat mass shootings?

    http://new.www.huffingtonpost.com/e...-orlando-shooting_us_575f0d84e4b071ec19eec3a7
     
  18. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

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    No, say it ain't so. He was a repressed homosexual that couldn't stand to see two men kissing? Maybe because he couldn't get any himself? You would think some evidence of that would surface...

    At least four regular customers at the Orlando gay nightclub where a gunman killed 49 people said Monday that they had seen Omar Mateen there before.

    "Sometimes he would go over in the corner and sit and drink by himself, and other times he would get so drunk he was loud and belligerent," Ty Smith said.

    ...

    Another Pulse regular, Kevin West, told the Los Angeles Times that Mateen messaged him on and off for a year using a gay chat app.

    http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...tclub-omar-mateen-profile-20160613-story.html

    -----------------

    Orlando shooter Omar Mateen's ex-wife says he had 'gay tendencies' as Pulse patron describes attacker as 'a regular'
    One man said Mateen had asked him out, while another said they had chatted on a dating app

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...s-pulse-patron-say-attacker-was-a7081041.html


    -----------------

    Orlando shooter Omar Mateen was gay, former classmate says

    http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/news/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen-was-gay-former-classma/nrfwW/

    Imagine that...

    By the way, I live less than two hours from Pulse. Thank the powers that be, all my friends that frequent the club showed up as safe and accounted for.
     
  19. madanthonywayne Morning in America Registered Senior Member

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  20. Bowser Namaste Valued Senior Member

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    A Christian might refuse to bake your wedding cake, but a Muslim, well...

    I think it is interesting that the guy was a second generation Muslim--born and raised here. I mean, what did we teach him in our public schools? Where did he acquire his loathing for our liberal culture? We were once a melting pot where people came together and became one. What happened to that tradition?
     
  21. C C Consular Corps - "the backbone of diplomacy" Valued Senior Member

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    With the exception of his father's disbelief, any skepticism probably revolves around it being considered too fitting a way to get subtle revenge for the victims. Should the 'Secret Life Of Omar' pan out in the course of the investigation, Islamic State may have to backtrack on acknowledging his contribution to their cause and renounce his allegiance / request for absentee citizenship. Unless they've got an honorary exemption and medal of valor for self-hating LGBT members who after the deed voluntarily throw themselves off a building in the best figurative way they can under limited circumstances.
     
  22. iceaura Valued Senior Member

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    If there has been an American tradition of people becoming one with their gay brothers, not expressing loathing or hostility in regards to homosexuality, and the gay culture being recognized by mainstream Americans as "our liberal culture", I missed it.
    A Christian might shoot you with a high powered rifle as you stood at your kitchen sink for performing abortions, or tie you to a fence and beat you to death for being homosexual, but it has been a while since a blazing cross led Christians through the night on missions of terror as a matter of routine. So there's that much to be thankful for.

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  23. Yazata Valued Senior Member

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    This Islamic preacher, born in the UK (a country that harbors a disproportionate share of the world's radical Islamic clerics) and educated at some of the best British universities (he has an MD from Imperial) but who currently lives in Qom Iran I believe, was just kicked out of Australia, where he was on a speaking tour, when the government revoked his visa.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/15/british-anti-gay-cleric-has-australian-visa-cancelled/

    The "Death is the sentence. We know. There's nothing to be embarrassed about this. Death is the sentence" line was apparently recorded during a talk he gave on how Muslims should deal with homosexuals at the U. of Michigan, Dearborn in 2013. (Amazing that he would be given that kind of academic venue, but not at all surprising.) He gave a similar speech at a Muslim center in Orlando, a few weeks before the recent attack. It's unknown if Omar Mateen was in attendance.
     

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