Metallic hydrogen, once theory, becomes reality:

Discussion in 'General Science & Technology' started by paddoboy, Jan 27, 2017.

  1. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Metallic hydrogen, once theory, becomes reality
    January 26, 2017

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    Image of diamond anvils compressing molecular hydrogen. At higher pressure the sample converts to atomic hydrogen, as shown on the right. Credit: R. Dias and I.F. Silvera
    Nearly a century after it was theorized, Harvard scientists have succeeded in creating the rarest - and potentially one of the most valuable - materials on the planet.



    The material - atomic metallic hydrogen - was created by Thomas D. Cabot Professor of the Natural Sciences Isaac Silvera and post-doctoral fellow Ranga Dias. In addition to helping scientists answer fundamental questions about the nature of matter, the material is theorized to have a wide range of applications, including as a room-temperature superconductor. The creation of the rare material is described in a January 26 paper published in Science.

    "This is the holy grail of high-pressure physics," Silvera said. "It's the first-ever sample of metallic hydrogen on Earth, so when you're looking at it, you're looking at something that's never existed before."



    Read more at: https://phys.org/news/2017-01-metallic-hydrogen-theory-reality.html#jCp
     
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  3. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    http://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2017/01/25/science.aal1579

    Observation of the Wigner-Huntington transition to metallic hydrogen

    Abstract
    Producing metallic hydrogen has been a great challenge to condensed matter physics. Metallic hydrogen may be a room temperature superconductor and metastable when the pressure is released and could have an important impact on energy and rocketry. We have studied solid molecular hydrogen under pressure at low temperatures. At a pressure of 495 GPa hydrogen becomes metallic with reflectivity as high as 0.91. We fit the reflectance using a Drude free electron model to determine the plasma frequency of 32.5 ± 2.1 eV at T = 5.5 K, with a corresponding electron carrier density of 7.7 ± 1.1 × 1023 particles/cm3, consistent with theoretical estimates of the atomic density. The properties are those of an atomic metal. We have produced the Wigner-Huntington dissociative transition to atomic metallic hydrogen in the laboratory.
     
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  5. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Pretty impressive stuff I reckon...Remembering that metallic Hydrogen has been theorised for 20 years or more, to exist deep withing the Gaseous giants Jupiter and Saturn....
     
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  7. Randwolf Ignorance killed the cat Valued Senior Member

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    Maybe...

    Two physicists say that they have crushed hydrogen under such immense pressures that the gas became a shiny metal—a feat that physicists have been trying to accomplish for more than 80 years.

    But other researchers have serious doubts about the claim, the latest in a field with a long history of failed attempts.

    Ranga Dias and Isaac Silvera, both physicists at Harvard University in Cambridge, Massachusetts, first posted a report of their results on the arXiv preprint server last October, which attracted immediate criticism. A peer-reviewed version of the report was published on 26 January in Science, but sceptics say that it includes little new information.

    Five experts told Nature’s news team that they do not yet believe the claim, and need more evidence. “I don’t think the paper is convincing at all,” says Paul Loubeyre, a physicist at France’s Atomic Energy Commission in Bruyères-le-Châtel.
    https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/doubts-cloud-claims-of-metallic-hydrogen/
     
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  8. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    I will wait to see it to believe it

    http://www.nature.com/news/physicists-doubt-bold-report-of-metallic-hydrogen-1.21379
     
  9. MacGyver1968 Fixin' Shit that Ain't Broke Valued Senior Member

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    Glad you posted this thead. I saw this on another forum, and I was going to post it here to get some opinions.
     
  10. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-38768683

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    Image copyrightHARVARD UNIVERSIT/R.DIAS/I.SILVERA
    Image captionSmaller than the cross-section of a hair on your head: The tiny sample went from transparent, to black, to highly reflective as the pressure was increased. Becoming shiny and reflective is a sign the material has become a solid metal, the Harvard team claims
    Scientists in the US say they have at last managed to turn hydrogen into a state where it behaves like a metal.


    excerpt:
    "I understand that others in the DAC community have been rather sceptical (arguing that the apparent reflectivity might be coming from contaminants in the sample, the aluminium oxide coating on the diamonds, etc.). However, if they really have achieved nearly 500 gigapascals in the DAC it is not unreasonable to have observed a transition to metallic hydrogen,” commented Marcus Knudson from Sandia National Laboratories.

    "The scepticism here is probably a good thing, in that it will drive many groups towards attempting to reproduce this experiment. This publication will certainly incite the field. Again, if it holds up, this is an exciting result. I think in this case time will tell," he told BBC News.

    And Jeffrey McMahon from Washington State University concurred: "With respect to the tiny sample amount: Such experiments are performed in small diamond anvil cells. One challenge would be to make a larger quantity (at once); another, perhaps bigger challenge is to recover even the small sample (ie, remove it from the extreme pressures that it is under in the diamond anvil cell).

    "Whether the latter is possible is an important open question."
    http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-38768683
     
  11. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Sure, and we have had the same sort of situation with controlled nuclear fusion experiments. But from where I sit, both situations, if successful and viable, would have momentous benefits and advantagous for humanity, which should see that further research into achieving the desired results [if possible] continue.
    [see my previous article]
     
  12. geordief Registered Senior Member

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    Is this not a far longer shot than nuclear fusion?

    How can they maintain the metallic state other than by maintaining extraordinary pressure?

    There is no way to isolate this product from the environment in which it is created is there?
     
  13. timojin Valued Senior Member

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    Is it metallic at room temp. and high pressure at low temp. or is it necessary to hold it at high pressure and low temperature .
     
  14. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    As indicated in post 7, these are the two problems that need to be overcome to see this as a viable scenario.
     
  15. Q-reeus Valued Senior Member

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    Not as outlandishly ridiculous as say 'Warp Drive' fantasies, but at best a curiosity with no hope of any commercial development re room-temperature superconductor. Which might not even be a property of metallic hydrogen.
    If by some miracle a finally unambiguously confirmed metallic hydrogen could be 'stabilized' so as to exist at STP, the production process will be inherently enormously costly and time consuming. Shine on, microscopic dot imprisoned at ~ 500GPa inside a diamond anvil. Shine on.
     
  16. geordief Registered Senior Member

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    Yes , I missed that last excerpt.
     
  17. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    And obviously while many better qualified people then you are working towards that possibility, I for one certainly encourage continued research, as of course the benefits would be enormous.And of course even Professor Carroll did not say it was impossible.

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    In short I totally reject your pessimistic opinion with regarding this and also warp drive possibilities, the same way I rejected your anti GR threads and gravitational wave threads of the past. The benefits are far too great to throw your arms up in the air and cry impossible.
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2017
  18. Q-reeus Valued Senior Member

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    Which makes them far, far better qualified than yourself.
    Are they aware that paddoboy encourages further research? That knowledge will really give them a boost!
    No, there wouldn't be any such practical benefits. For the bleeding obvious reasons I gave. Even on a pure theoretical knowledge basis, it seems rather mundane to me.
    Are we still on topic here? Carroll has chipped in re metallic hydrogen claim?
     
  19. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Certainly.

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    Just as much a boost as your own contributions.

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    Rubbish...problems to overcome certainly but just one benefit would be rocket fuel.
    Well as much on topic as warp drive which you raised for obvious reasons..
    In short I totally reject your pessimistic opinion with regarding this and also warp drive possibilities, the same way I rejected your anti GR threads and gravitational wave threads of the past. The benefits are far too great to throw your arms up in the air and cry impossible.
     
  20. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    An excerpt from the following...................
    http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-38768683

    "It has been suggested for example that metallic hydrogen might be metastable; that is - once made under extreme conditions it would maintain its state even when brought back up to ambient pressures and temperatures.

    And if, as some think, it is also a zero-resistance superconductor, that could lead to a revolution in the transmission and storage of electricity. For example, cables made from metallic hydrogen could feed energy across a country without the sort of electrical losses experienced in standard power grids.

    The US space agency is also fascinated by the material. Already super-cold liquid hydrogen makes for a very powerful rocket propellant, but the dense metallic form of hydrogen promises to deliver really colossal levels of thrust that would enable huge payloads to be lifted off Earth.

    But all this is in the realms of speculation for now. First, it must be shown that the Harvard work can be reproduced. If that's possible - and some are saying that is a very big "if" - then more sizeable quantities of metallic hydrogen need to be created".

    http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-38768683

    Again, I'm sure most here realising the possible benefits, would encourage further experiments and research into what has been achieved so far.
    And obviously, that most certainly will be done.

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    And even more obviously, such new research by reputable scientists will continue to be reported when appropriate.
     
  21. Q-reeus Valued Senior Member

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    Ha ha ha. Have you tried doing a cost vs benefits calculation? Only kidding - of course you haven't. I'll give that pie-in-the-sky notion one plus - nowhere near as outlandishly crazy as the fundamental let alone practical issues surrounding 'Warp Drive' hyper-hype.

    On the very remote chance some 'miracle blend' could be found to allow stability at STP, we might have a potential high explosive (since it would almost certainly be prone to rather violent phase change to it's naturally stable form as gaseous H2). I expect especially Mossad would then be busy initiating research into a new means of carrying out untraceable assassination. Not much else comes to mind. Oh, hang on. The still hopeful laser fusion crowd might be able to justify the huge cost of having a more convenient ignition target. IF the necessary blend is amenable to stable STP as for pure hydrogen that is. So many BIG IFF's. [and I note your #17 rather mildly lists a few.]
     
  22. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Whatever floats your boat qreeus.
    On your cost benefit cop out argument, you I'm sorry to say, and myself by the way, are just not able to see that far into the future and use whatever economic scenario is in place by then. Or are you proposing research into other fields instead? Perhaps some unscientific venture such as ID may geld with you better?

    Bottom line like I said, the research into this and many other "difficult" but not impossible scenarios will continue.
     
  23. Q-reeus Valued Senior Member

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