Obamacare Lite = Trumpcare

Discussion in 'Politics' started by joepistole, Mar 7, 2017.

  1. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Here I found an un-distorted image:

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  3. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    It's interesting to see how Republicans are marketing this bill. Senate Republicans are calling the bill Ryancare. They aren't yet calling it Trumpcare. Gee, I wonder why. That's some good news for Trump. Trumpers want to call the bill Ryancare and Ryan wants to say it's Trump's healthcare bill. It's a hot potato as well it should be, and none of them want to be associated with it.
     
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  5. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    That's pretty compared to his soul.

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    The man is a foul immoral monster.
     
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  7. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Apparently smashing their heads once on the Obamacare wall wasn't enough for Republicans. The talk is they want to do it again. Trump wants to chalk this up on his 100 day scorecard for all the good it will do him. He will need to get this done next week. But getting this through the House and Senate in one week, a week in which they have to pass funding for the government in order to prevent a government shut down, well, that's very optimistic.

    What Republicans want to do now is allow states to opt out. Opting out will allow insurers to offer substandard health insurance plans. Yeah, the plans will be cheaper, and people can say they have health insurance, but the insurance plans won't cover shit.

    Meanwhile, the premiums for the real health insurance goes through the roof. If you have cancer and you think your 12,000 per year premiums are high, you will love your 150,000 per year premiums.

    I don't think this is going anywhere once it sees the light of day. House Republicans might be able to cram it through the House next week, but I seriously doubt it will get through the Senate.http://www.cnbc.com/2017/04/20/cons...sed-with-changes-to-health-care-proposal.html
     
  8. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    House Republicans think they now have the votes to pass their healthcare bill. House Republican leaders announced last night that they will hold a vote today without allowing time for the legislation to be reviewed by the public, fellow congressmen or by the Congressional Budget Office.

    The only folks who know what's really in the final bill are House Republican leaders. And it's more than a little ironic because when Democrats passed Obamacare Republicans accused Democrats of doing all the things they are now doing in an attempt to pass Trumpcare.

    Unlike Republicans, when Democrats passed Obamacare they did get the final version reviewed by the Congressional Budget Office, and they did allow a period for public review prior to voting on it.

    Outside the Republican leadership, no one really knows what's in the House bill. No one knows what impact the final bill will have. But House Republicans will attempt to get it passed today.

    The bottom line here is Republicans want to raid Obamacare in order to fund their tax cuts for America's wealthiest.
     
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  9. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Thursday Senate Republicans revealed their much awaited hitherto secret version of Trumpcare and are now actively trying to cram it down the throats of Americans. Will they succeed? Thus far 4 of the Senate’s most "conservative" members have objected to it and one so called "moderate" Republican has objected. Senate Republicans want this bill passed by the end of next week. They can only lose 3 votes.

    I expect the 4 most "conservative" members of the Senate who now object will eventually vote for the bill. That has been their history. They make a show for the cameras, but in the end they fall in line. If they do, and if no "moderates" step forward, the bill passes.

    In the end this is a lose-lose for Republicans. If Senate Republicans pass the bill and if House Republicans subsequently pass the bill, which I expect they would, they will get slaughtered at the ballot box after Trumpcare hits Americans in the pocketbook.

    And if Republicans don't pass the bill, they will still get slaughtered at the ballot box; because they didn't do what they have promised to do for the last 8 years; and after 8 years of unrelenting Republican demagoguery the Republican base fervently believes Obamacare to be an unmitigated disaster. After 8 years of promulgating and politicizing the meme that Obamacare is a disaster, and Republicans fail to do anything about it when they have the power to do so, well that's an electoral disaster too. For 8 years Republicans reaped the benefits of dishonestly maligning Obamacare, and when they had the power to do something they didn't, well, that's a hard one to sell even to the Republican base. Of the two options, I think the least damaging option for Republicans would be the do nothing option: to not pass the bill. They can point fingers at each other and call each other RINOs as is their tradition. But when Trumpcare hits the wallets of the Republican base, well, no amount of name calling is going to fix that one.

    Of course Republicans could go nuclear and be honest with their base, but that ain't happening. That would be political suicide, and Republican leaders and financiers are anything but suicidal. Yeah, I think the best option for Republicans is to do nothing and revert to calling each other RINOs as is their custom, even though that makes Trump look bad. But remember, Trump is the man who could murder people on 5th Avenue and not lose a single supporter.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2017
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  10. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    Question: how long will it take Trumpcare to be implemented? I put high bets they expect this to kick in at lest 4 years down the line.
     
  11. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    That's a good question. It will be drawn out of over a 7 year period. I know that some of the most severe Medicaid cuts don't kick in until after the 2020 election. Then Medicaid is eliminated over a 3 year period.
     
  12. ElectricFetus Sanity going, going, gone Valued Senior Member

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    So then they are fine!
     
  13. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Oh, I wouldn't say they are fine. The impact on subsidies will be immediate. This legislation really hurts the Republican base: the lesser educated older whites, and it hits immediately, and it gets worse with time. If implemented next year, 15 million Americans will lose their healthcare. The deductibles and premiums Republicans have railed about as being too high will go up immediately and significantly.

    This is more of a tax bill. It's a nearly trillion dollar tax cut for America's wealthiest at the expense of poor and middle class Americans.

    Below is an interactive comparison by the Kaiser Foundation. The premiums for Trump's base, older white people will double or triple. I'm pretty sure that will not go unnoticed. If health insurance premiums were too high before, they are gonna love a doubling of their healthcare premiums.

    http://www.kff.org/interactive/prem...ter-care-reconciliation-act-interactive-maps/
     
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2017
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  14. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    Republicancare exacerbates everything Republicans have been complaining about for the last 7 years. It increases deductibles and premiums. It worsens everything Republicans have been complaining about. It doesn't "fix" Obamacare. It does give America's richest nearly a trillion dollar tax cut. It's a massive wealth transfer.

    http://thehill.com/policy/healthcar...ike-for-older-people-under-senate-repeal-bill

    Additionally, it would allow for the return of junk healthcare policies, i..e healthcare policies which do not provide much coverage. Junk healthcare policies will eventually drive down premiums, but they will also drive down coverage. These junk healthcare policies are a great profit center for health insurers, and they provide Republicans with a convenient smoke screen. Republicans will claim premiums will go down, but what they will not tell you is healthcare coverage will go down too as people who will be priced out of standard healthcare policies opt into substandard healthcare policies: policies that provide very limited actual healthcare insurance.
     
  15. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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  16. Kittamaru Now nearly 40 pounds lighter. Staff Member

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    Just a friendly reminder / heads up...

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  17. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    McConnell threatens Republicans with bipartisan negotiations. McConnell says if they cannot come to agreement oh Republicancare they will be forced to negotiate with Democrats. Oh my God! Say it isn't so! Bipartisanship! Oh my God could there be a worse fate? Republicans would be forced to engage in bipartisanship. While that's an anathema for many Republicans, there was a time when bipartisanship was the norm. The US has a long tradition of bipartisanship, but in the age of right wing entertainment, in Republican circles, it has become an abomination. http://www.politico.com/story/2017/06/27/republican-health-care-bill-mitch-mcconnell-trump-239998

    You know McConnell is getting desperate when he threatens the Republican conference with bipartisanship.

    Goldman Sachs announced today that healthcare reform was unlikely, and healthcare stocks rallied. Health insurance stocks rallied. What does that tell you? Does that sound like "healthcare is melting down" as Trump recently stated?

    The Republican bill is basket case. It's really a tax cut bill for America's wealthiest. And it's yet another case of broken campaign promise. Trump promised to repeal and replace. He also promised no tax cuts for America's wealthiest.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2017
  18. Tiassa Let us not launch the boat ... Staff Member

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    #pullingboehners | #WhatTheyVotedFor

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    Click because the alternative was a better joke for a better occasion.

    This is one of those things that ought to be funny, except, well, the Majority Leader is behaving so dangerously of late.

    But McConnell just pulled a Boehner. That's hilarious, because when Boehner was pulling Boehners, McConnell was busy filibustering himself.

    So now we know: The lower chamber has the upper valence of silly; McConnell just escalated from a McConnell to a Boehner. And, you know, I guess that works, doesn't it, since the Speaker of the House can't fil' himself with 'buster.
     
  19. Mrs.Lucysnow Valued Senior Member

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    Elizabeth Warren disagrees with you.

    “President Obama tried to move us forward with health-care coverage by using a conservative model that came from one of the conservative think tanks that had been advanced by a Republican governor in Massachusetts,” she told The Wall Street Journal in an interview last week. “Now it’s time for the next step. And the next step is single payer.” http://www.salon.com/2017/06/27/eli...democrats-to-run-on-single-payer-health-care/

    Democrats 'moving forward' with Republican bright ideas!

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  20. joepistole Deacon Blues Valued Senior Member

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    What makes you think Warren disagrees with me?
     
  21. Mrs.Lucysnow Valued Senior Member

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    Oh I'm sorry I misread your post! I thought you were claiming Obamacare didn't come out of the Republican camp. Trump care would be a disaster but let's see if it passes, so far the Rep's can't get themselves together. But who wants Trump care? Not their voters. Its partly Paul Ryan's plan and that of the hard line Tea Party fraction who want to see government's role smaller. Republican voters wanted a health care plan that would cap costs. They're not going to get that. Again its a sliver of the ideologically hard fringe who is pushing this plan, not Trump voters. Obamacare isn't worth saving and Warren isn't interested in saving it, so maybe I do think she disagrees with you

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    What I mean is that Warren is forwarding Single-payer which is what Democrats should have come up with in the beginning when they had the chance but maybe this is a better time to do it. Maybe in the face of Trumpcare single payer can find a home here in the US but Obamacare should be allowed to die.

    As expected, Paul Ryan has released a sweeping proposal—the American Health Care Act—to remake the U.S. health care system. Also as expected, lots of people hate it. What’s somewhat more surprising is that so many Republicans seem to hate it.
    Why won’t the GOP line up behind the party’s Obamacare replacement? The basic story is that ideological purists don’t like the fact that the House proposal creates a new system of refundable tax credits, which they see as tantamount to socialism. Meanwhile, Republican pragmatists from states that expanded Medicaid under Obamacare are afraid that Ryan’s overhaul will leave many of their low-income constituents high and dry.

    David A. Hopkins, a political scientist at Boston College, offers an elegant explanation. While the Democratic Party functions as a coalition of discrete social groups, each of which wants government to help address various problems, the GOP functions more as the agent of the conservative ideological movement. This is not to say that Democrats are never ideological. Far from it. It’s just that ideological liberals who, say, would have greatly preferred Medicare-for-all over the kludgy, compromised mess that is the Affordable Care Act weren’t willing to sink Obamacare because it was an affront to their deeply held beliefs. Instead, they sucked it up and backed the president’s health care plan, thinking it would deliver real-world benefits to their constituents. There were plenty of ideological liberals who hated having to cut deals with insurers and pharmaceutical companies and the hospital lobby yet were willing to do just that to achieve their goal of expanding coverage. Republicans, in contrast, have devoted almost no effort to placating industry stakeholders in the health sector—a sector that accounts for roughly 18 percent of GDP, by the way—nor are they delivering much in the way of tangible benefits to rank-and-file Republican voters.http://www.slate.com/articles/news_...ans_hate_the_republican_health_care_plan.html

    Like I've said before the Rep's are just being themselves. Too bad there isn't a party that can address their real needs.
     
  22. cluelusshusbund + Public Dilemma + Valued Senior Member

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    What a lovely sight... McCain givin a thumb down wit a loud an clear no vote on skinny-care while surrounded by his stunned peers.!!!

    .........................................................

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    Last edited: Jul 29, 2017
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  23. cluelusshusbund + Public Dilemma + Valued Senior Member

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    Ah O... coud be a fly (Trump) in the ointment.!!!

    "Trump launched a Saturday afternoon tweet threatening to end “BAILOUTS to insurance companies” if Congress does not repeal and replace Obamacare."

    "Schumer interpreted it as an indication that Trump plans to withhold subsidies to insurers for plans on the Obamacare individual insurance marketplaces that provide lower out-of-pocket costs for people with incomes under 250 percent of the poverty line."


    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry..._597cc9f4e4b02a8434b6c5d9?section=us_politics


    Im glad my wife will be on medicare next year an finaly not have to wonder what the GOP is gonna do to screw up Obamacare... but hell... even medicare ant safe from the GOP

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