Proof of the supernatural

Discussion in 'Free Thoughts' started by garbonzo, Mar 9, 2015.

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  1. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    LOL! That's what paranormal is. When something extraordinary happens beyond explanation by science. Duh...

    paranormal
    [par-uh-nawr-muh l]

    adjective

    1."of or relating to the claimed occurrence of an event or perception without scientific explanation, as psychokinesis, extrasensoryperception, or other purportedly supernatural phenomena."===http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/paranormal
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2015
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  3. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Ignored...When you actually educate yourself on what you are talking about, I might listen. Till then you are a waste of my time.
     
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  5. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    Whatever my gullible old friend.
    You're the one with the agenda, then claiming to have "scientifically investigated" all this nonsensical woo. Drop your agenda, open your eyes and the real situation won't be as anywhere near stupid as you claim.
     
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  7. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    And when you educate yourself on how science works, you'll stop wasting your own time.
     
  8. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Tell me how science explains this event then. It's quite simple really. 4 rescue workers hear a woman's voice distinctly call out "Help me! Help me!" from a half submerged car containing a dead woman and her unconscious baby. What's the science on this?
     
  9. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    Who knows?

    Just because we don't have the answers doesn't mean "ghosts" win by default. You still have to prove it.
     
  10. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    LOL! So much for science then..
     
  11. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    So much for your idea that it's ghosts.
     
  12. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Mountains of paranormal evidence and eyewitness accounts says otherwise...Like those 4 rescue workers for example..
     
  13. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    Please provide this extraordinary evidence for your extraordinary claim, instead of just saying it exists.

    You still haven't proven that it's ghosts.
     
  14. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Voices coming from invisible beings is one of the prime demonstrations of spirits. We know this from all the evidence we have gathered about them. Since you admit you have no other explanation, then mine is the most probable.
     
  15. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    No, it really isn't.

    "Probable" is meaningless.

    We need evidence and proof, otherwise any claim can be made.

    Ghosts? Why not aliens? Or Unicorns?

    There's more evidence for ventriloquism than there is for ghosts.
     
  16. paddoboy Valued Senior Member

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    All the evidence WE have gathered???

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    That says it all.
     
  17. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    Says you who has never even looked into the field of paranormal investigations, of which there are over 3000 organizations in the U.S. alone. I'm trying to think of any unicorn research societies out there now, and gosh, none seem to come to mind now.
     
  18. Daecon Kiwi fruit Valued Senior Member

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    I've looked into it quite a lot, actually.

    It's how I realised it had no scientific validity.

    What's your excuse?
     
  19. Magical Realist Valued Senior Member

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    What part of it was invalid? The video evidence? The photo evidence? The audio evidence? The eyewitness evidence? The emf and motion detector evidence? What part of this field has no "scientific validity"?
     
  20. garbonzo Registered Senior Member

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    Science has a hard time validating the paranormal, including aliens, because they are rare events and irreproducible. If aliens don't want to be known yet, there are various methods to make sure there is no concrete evidence. They know people like you won't believe even 5 eyewitness testimonies, all they need is to make sure they aren't filmed basically, which is easily achievable, especially if we assume that are more technologically advanced than us. Anyway, again, the paranormal is incompatible with the scientific method because it is rare and irreproducible. Look how long it took to find evidence for the Higgs Boson. We needed to build a hulking machine that cost BILLIONS of dollars and thousands of man hours in order to find evidence for something STATIC, meaning it's always there. Paranormal phenomenon is even more stringent than that. Like I said: irreproducible. I don't believe people can reliably see into the future for instance. This would be easily reproducible, and compatible with scientific testing. There is a study using RNG machinery where it seems total consciousness of humanity seems to predict certain events, so this may show we can tap into it eventually, but as of yet it is not reliable or we would know through scientific testing.

    I don't think there can be such thing as a ghost like you see in fictional stories like Casper. They can't talk to you or hold a conversation with you, or if they did, it won't be reproducible. You can't get a group to come in next Saturday and let them hear you talk to an invisible being. That's too easy. We would be able to validate that. How many times have credible news crews come to a so called "haunted building" only to find nothing? These things are incredibly rare. I believe some of these recordings are legit, but again, they aren't reproducible. How easy would it be if there were a voice that kept talking all the time in this one building? It would become a tourist attraction and it would make worldwide news. This obviously isn't the case. These events are rare. But we know they are REAL because of so many testimonies. We accept these testimonies on just about everything else except cases such as these.

    Show me a study done where 5 people heard the same human voice saying the same sentence when it actually wasn't a human voice at all, but "a talking machine". SHOW THIS STUDY TO ME AND I WILL REST MY CASE, PROMISE. People misremembering something is much more common than implanted memories happening at the same time to 5 different people.

    This is not a fact. We don't know what they are doing, what their purposes are, or why they do what they do, but there's enough evidence here to put someone away for life, that's enough for me to believe it. There is no explanation for some cattle mutilation cases too. Why mutilate cattle? Good question. But it's a mystery. At some point we do have to say we do not have the answers. We have enough evidence to believe in quantum mechanics but there is still mysterious parts of it we have to say we don't know to. I understand the scientific method and alien visitation hasn't met that standard of evidence yet, but we as humans don't always go by that to believe in something. None of us do, even intellectuals. If 5 of your friends told you Breaking Bad was a good show and that you should watch it, you would believe them! You don't need the scientific method for everything you believe in your life.

    Hearing someone call for help is nowhere near as complex as this. If it were, I might agree with you.

    By what reasoning?

    They aren't lying. Their accounts are reliable. They are seeing the dress that color. I fail to see how this is proof 5 eyewitnesses aren't reliable.

    It's the same thing to me! It's not natural. I call it supernatural phenomenon. I don't know what it is, but it's real. I don't know if that was a ghost and all the baggage that comes with that label. I don't know if the mother died, became a ghost, and was able to then speak again somehow, I don't know if it was the mother, but a voice did happen, and that is supernatural phenomenon.

    People assume "ghosts". People assume "spirits". As if these are beings like humans with their own intelligence and consciousness and they are roaming around the Earth, that they are a separate entity like aliens. But what if they are just the consciousness left over by others? We don't know what consciousness is yet really. But just like how your eyes can move still after being decapitated, your consciousness may still live on in the minds of others for some time, with events, objects, or location connecting you.

    Fact: Relatives sometimes experience knowing that their loved one has died before they are aware of the event.

    Fact: It is proven that we can connect with another person's consciousness through Michael Persinger's God Helmet.

    Fact: Our consciousness is connected in some way (electro magnetic field?) and reflects that in RNG machines.

    All this proves is that people that alive are connected, perhaps through the electricity our brains emit, but maybe part of people exist in everyone's brains somehow. Just a thought. There's nothing to prove this, but it seems logical. Just my theory.

    All of those "EVPs" posted by Magic Realist are short, do you notice that? I think it further supports this post.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2015
  21. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    So then the sun rising is Paranormal (according to early cro-magnon humans)
    The Sun and the Moon and the orbits of everything is Paranormal (according to heliocentric believers)
    The disappearance of a high energy pulsar into the gravity well of a binary star system is paranormal, as science cannot explain it as of yet.
    The propagation and underlying carrier of gravity is paranormal
    The birth of the universe is paranormal.

    According to you, much of the world is "paranormal" simply because science cannot explain it yet.
    ...
    What a wonderfully Alice-in-Wonderland viewpoint... and how terribly naive. Just because something defies explanation now doesn't mean it defies explanation forever.
     
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  22. origin Heading towards oblivion Valued Senior Member

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    I do not think the majority of the people who think they see a alien spacecraft or a ghost or bigfoot are lying, I just think they are mistaken!
    The point about the dress color is not that the people that thought the dress was white and gold were lying the point is that their observations were NOT RELIABLE. More than half of the people surveyed were wrong about the color of the dress. So 2 people side by side looking at the same picture can see different things. That is the point, eyewitnesses are not realiable. It is especially true if they witnesses think they are seeing something unusual or scary, because they will be "pumped up".
     
  23. Kittamaru Ashes to ashes, dust to dust. Adieu, Sciforums. Valued Senior Member

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    Yep - MR will refuse to see this simple fact, though, because it discredits his "idea".

    My response to this thread at this point:

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    Last edited: Mar 12, 2015
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